Cel

I had thought that as well, but since the druid got a 2.3 ppm, and he has a 1.0 speed attack, I thought it might be a % rather than a multiplier against weapon speed. Suppose that's not enough reason to think that though >_>.

"There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." - Bertrand Russell

Alpha is recruiting... go go.

 

The Iron Colonel

I suggest hopping on the PTR and getting the rogue box to test it yourself. I tend to take people's word for things like that, but confirming information is always good.

 

Cel

I wish I could... I can't seem to get the thing downloaded and installed properly. I've given up. :[

"There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." - Bertrand Russell

Alpha is recruiting... go go.

 

Nevervate

in further use of this thing, I've found the proc rate to be much closer to 2.0 ppm, and definately not 1.7ppm. But since it can proc off itself, and its likely modified by attack speed, it will go over 2.0ppm while haste is active... so with the time i am @ .75 attack speed, i have better chance to proc again.

in the end 2.0-2.5ppm is what I experience.

As for bear form, it provides excellent TPS/DPS gain if you are willing to sacrifice the trinket slot.

Cannot stress enough that this is an excellent trinket, and w/ +40 AP, even better.

 

Maddness

ssssh! Wait til the rest of us get one before the masses fully realise this !

http://hosted.filefront.com/rroguee

 

Eishara

It's more likely that Blizzard will realise just how good it is and lumber it with an internal cooldown just like everything else :/

 

Surion

Everyone just whistle along and act inconspicuous!

 

Kink

I will try to run some tests when possible. Ill post here any results I find. Not that I play WoW much these days, so I may as well gather some data for others =)

There is light at the end of the tunnel.
The only problem is, it's often an incoming train.

 

Gasmask

I logged onto PTR 2.1 and tried out the trophy today. Here are my findings. It seems to have a PPM = 1. t is not percentage based as some have suggested.

Here are the results with a Deep Thunder (3.8s)



Here are the results with a Sun Eater (1.6s)



I can see this being very handy for a 2h dps warrior especially in conjunction with windfury.

CasualGamer

 

Darkmantle

Clarifying that with what mob it was tested on using what attacks would greatly enhance that use of your post.

It feels like straight auto attack numbers.

 

Gasmask

Oops yeah. Straight autoattack on a Blasted Lands servant.

CasualGamer

 

Ounce

Posting this here because I do not see a post on this in the Elitist Jerks forum.

Our loot council wants to have a good idea of who the DST should go to.

I'm looking for references to good analyses, all in one place, as to exactly how much impact this trinket has for each class, and what the alternatives do. I could not find a topic dealing with this specifically on these forums.

For example, I know that the DST is the top trinket in the game by over 40 (ideal) dps for my spec, thanks to Bleedo's dps spreadsheet. So far, our loot council seems to think:

#1 -- Rogues, Fury Warriors, Enhancement Shaman (highest dps take priority)
#2 -- Hunters (MM?)
#3 -- MS warriors, BM hunters
#1000 -- Feral druids

We have 4 rogues, and potentially 2 or 3 hunters whose dps justifies this trinket. The current proposal is that the first 2 go to rogues, the 3rd goes to a hunter, and the 4th becomes an open roll among the classes who most need it. Feedback, and links to good analyses are better. Because this item is so good, we really want to make sure that it's going to the people who get the most use out of it.

 

Malan

Its the 2nd best trinket in the game right now for an Enhance shaman according to current itemization theory, especially given its placement in the early raid zones.

Shitting up every single thread on EJ since '06

 

• Shifft

Haste isn't that good for shamans or MM hunters, it's very good for rogues and all DPS warriors, and to a slightly lesser extent BM hunters.

 

Malan

Absolutely incorrect. None of our instant attacks are normalized to weapon speed, so there is no negative impact from increasing our auto attack damage. There is no empirical point at which haste is "not that good" for a shaman. (There is a theoretical point at 1.5 to 1.4 that is bad, but no testing data exists for it and once below 1.4 the gains come back)

Shitting up every single thread on EJ since '06

 

• Shifft

I meant it isn't as good for shamans as it is for rogues, warriors or BM hunters, because it only affects your autoattack DPS whereas rogues get extra potency procs, warriors get extra rage, and BM hunters get to do more steady shots. I could be wrong though.

 

• Maestroquark

You're not counting Flurry - Spells - World of Warcraft at least. More attacks = more crits = more flurry uptime. Might not hold the same meaning as combat potency, but it's more than just a straight haste bonus.

What are you waiting for, a certain shade of green?

 

• Shifft

From what I understood, more attacks = flurry runs out faster but also reapplies faster = the exact same percentage uptime.

 

Nezralix

I assume you can stack this effect with Abacus of Violent Odds?

 

◊ Hanos

Yes... however, when you have guilds like mine that have seen 1 since March.... you really don't even consider that option. Our Enhancement Shaman has aggro issues anyway, you need to give it to the person who will get the most benefit out of it, which is going to be your highest DPS Rogue. Haste doesn't help BM Hunters because it just leads to clipping, and warriors are threat capped as well.

So, unless you have been uncommonly lucky (in which case I hate you), you should give it to your rogues first. The benefit there is so much higher then anyone else, because first off you are doing more damage or should be so the % increase is higher, and the fact that we get more energy when it procs due to Combat Potency Procs. Linking Abacus, Haste Pot, Drums, Heroism and this procing you better have your finger on evasion/vanish.

I should be getting the next one that drops, but Gruul hates us and has only dropped 1, and has dropped the rogue legs once in the last 3 months, which were given to a F&F because the officers figured we wanted T5...

 

Crizis

Huh? Perhaps I'm reading this wrong, but it sounds like you think that weapon normalization for other classes is affected by attack speed increases, which isn't the case.

 

◊ Hanos

Agreed, having haste does absolutely nothing to the value of Sinister Strike or Backstab they are still based off of your normal weapon sweep and attack power.

However, it is my understanding the the amount of rage a warrior generates per hit is reduced when they have haste, aka hitting with a 2.8 speed weapon for 500 and hitting with a 2.8 speed weapon hasted to 2.5 speed will not generate the same amount of rage... which is what I think Malan is getting at.

 

Kasi

Malan with his 1.5 to 1.4 is also talking about the 3 second WF cooldown for the ability. And since you want your MH proccing as much as possible, then 1.5 is good because you could crit on every second MH swing, while at 1.4 on MH you could only crit on every third MH swing.

 

Ailee

As said already, you're very far from the truth.
Haste is good for any spec hunters until they hit about 1.7'ish ranged speed. Going below that isn't particularly bad, however the gains will be about equal. It's an excellent trinket for any physical DPS and no class should be looped in to a "it's not as good for you as it is for me" until you have a complete and total understanding of their mechanics.

 

• Shifft

I apologise then, I was just going by what our hunters told me for the part about hunters, and I was fairly sure that I was accurate in the way I ordered it.