Anyone ever had Oz bug out?

• Hamlet · 03/27/07, 10:16 PM

Curtain came up and Roar wasn't there. Started killing Dorothee, and Strawman and Tinhead never went active. After killing Dorothee and Tito, we dropped combat and were stuck on stage with Strawman and Tinhead still standing there. Jumping over and running around to Barnes, we couldn't talk to him.

Anything to try besides zoning out for half an hour?

Shabadu · 03/27/07, 10:41 PM

My group's very first Opera was a pretty bizarre Oz. First we had only Dorothee and Roar spawn when the curtain came up, we tried killing Dorothee and they both despawned and the curtain came back down. We ran back out and Barnes started the event again, only this time Strawman spawned as well, but no Tin Man. Killing all them ended up spawning the crone and we picked up our loot for the week.

As to your specific problems, try having everyone die or pulling mobs out onto the stage and seeing if part of the script triggers. Other than that a soft reset'll be your only option.

Hexel · 03/28/07, 12:08 AM

We had Tinman not spawning once, upon killing the remaining three The Crone would not spawn. Soft reset was the solution.

zarf55 · 03/28/07, 12:24 AM

We had problems, mainly with roar not spawning - there was an unexpected windfall in that he decided to spawn after the first crone, so we killed the first crone, then him and then had a second crone spawn which we proceeded to kill and loot.
First dropped witches hat and earthsoul leggings, second dropped witches hat and eternium greathelm, which must be the final nail in the coffin for loot seed and other such predetermined drop theories as they would predict both witches to drop the same.

Delta5 · 03/28/07, 1:01 AM

We had something like this happen Monday. Our first time ever doing the opera event we got Oz and started it to see what would happen. We wiped fairly fast and a rogue managed to vanish and the event started to reset but he got agro on the Tinhead and somehow reset the event again because he lived (I think he ran into/through the curtain because it had come down at this point, not sure exactly though). When we came back only Dorothee and Tinhead were there. When we started the event again we killed Dorothee and Tito but Tinhead never became active so we were stuck on stage and eventually left instead of waiting the 30 minutes to reset it.

• Hamlet · 03/28/07, 1:04 AM

Originally Posted by Delta5

We had something like this happen Monday. Our first time ever doing the opera event we got Oz and started it to see what would happen. We wiped fairly fast and a rogue managed to vanish and the event started to reset but he got agro on the Tinhead and somehow reset the event again because he lived (I think he ran into/through the curtain because it had come down at this point, not sure exactly though). When we came back only Dorothee and Tinhead were there. When we started the event again we killed Dorothee and Tito but Tinhead never became active so we were stuck on stage and eventually left instead of waiting the 30 minutes to reset it.

I think the vanishing rogue might be the common factor here.

• malthrin · 03/28/07, 1:36 AM

That happened our first week in Kara. Vanishing Rogue was at the top of the list of our possible suspects. We wiped and the scenario that Delta5 describes transpired.

Thelyna · 03/28/07, 1:37 AM

We had a rogue vanish on a wipe on Oz in our first week, and there she went, had to come back the next day.

Surush · 03/28/07, 8:05 AM

Originally Posted by Arawethion

Curtain came up and Roar wasn't there. Started killing Dorothee, and Strawman and Tinhead never went active. After killing Dorothee and Tito, we dropped combat and were stuck on stage with Strawman and Tinhead still standing there. Jumping over and running around to Barnes, we couldn't talk to him.

Anything to try besides zoning out for half an hour?

This exactly describes what happened to us this week (first time we have had Oz). We did ask for GM help, more in hope than expectation, and were advised to do a soft reset.

Edit: I should have said that it was our second attempt, and we probably did have a rogue vanish at the end of the first (I cannot remember for certain but there were two in the raid).

Cadfael · 03/28/07, 9:23 AM

Originally Posted by zarf55

We had problems, mainly with roar not spawning - there was an unexpected windfall in that he decided to spawn after the first crone, so we killed the first crone, then him and then had a second crone spawn which we proceeded to kill and loot.
First dropped witches hat and earthsoul leggings, second dropped witches hat and eternium greathelm, which must be the final nail in the coffin for loot seed and other such predetermined drop theories as they would predict both witches to drop the same.

Loot is determined on mob spawn. So if the mob spawns "dynamically" ie. later in the instance as with all opera encounters, then loot is determined there and then. For bosses that "just stand there" and wait for you to come by they have their loot assigned upon first player entering the zone, thus "spawning" the instance and all its content, including the boss in question.

There is no way a player can look into the loot list of a mob before killing it. GMs may or may not have this ability though. There's one place where this can be shown which is the altar of storms in blasted lands. At least it was so a few patches ago, been a while since i was last there confirming it was still working (mobs there show the weapon and weapon only they are going to drop by actually wearing the model of the weapon visibly).

Sorry for thread hijacking, never had any other strange bugging out in Karazhan except the prince going into no-aggro mode.

Erongg · 03/28/07, 9:33 AM

Loot is determined on mob spawn. So if the mob spawns "dynamically" ie. later in the instance as with all opera encounters, then loot is determined there and then. For bosses that "just stand there" and wait for you to come by they have their loot assigned upon first player entering the zone, thus "spawning" the instance and all its content, including the boss in question.

There is no way a player can look into the loot list of a mob before killing it. GMs may or may not have this ability though. There's one place where this can be shown which is the altar of storms in blasted lands. At least it was so a few patches ago, been a while since i was last there confirming it was still working (mobs there show the weapon and weapon only they are going to drop by actually wearing the model of the weapon visibly).

How do you know this?

• Maestroquark · 03/28/07, 9:53 AM

Originally Posted by Arawethion

I think the vanishing rogue might be the common factor here.

I was gonna bring this up elsewhere, but now I feel it's relevant here.

On Monday we were doing our first Netherspite attempts. Near the end of the night, I vanished right as Netherspite reset. After a small mishap of a priest getting too close and dying alone, we charged in again for one more try.

That last attempt I was in the green beam, blocking the green beam (Netherspite wasn't getting hit), and yet was not getting the debuff. It was kinda frustrating since we wiped at 7% (Enrage) and I'm betting that getting the debuff on my turns would have made up the difference.

Cadfael · 03/28/07, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by Erongg

How do you know this?

I'll be happy to give a detailed explanation when/if mods move this message of mine into another thread, as it actually doesn't really have anything to do with the subject of the thread.

I don't read this forum every day, so I had assumed it was actually common knowledge by now, especially since there was a blue post some months ago from Tseric I believe about this topic.

Davidson · 03/28/07, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by Maestroquark

I was gonna bring this up elsewhere, but now I feel it's relevant here.

On Monday we were doing our first Netherspite attempts. Near the end of the night, I vanished right as Netherspite reset. After a small mishap of a priest getting too close and dying alone, we charged in again for one more try.

That last attempt I was in the green beam, blocking the green beam (Netherspite wasn't getting hit), and yet was not getting the debuff. It was kinda frustrating since we wiped at 7% (Enrage) and I'm betting that getting the debuff on my turns would have made up the difference.

Vanish, possibly along with some other abilities (invis, divine shield) make you unable to get a beam until you relog. After wiping a few times to paladins/hunters not getting the red beam, rogues not getting the green beam, or whoever not getting a beam buff, I just have people relog before the fight now.

As a side-note, Netherspite is my favorite fight in the entire zone. It's so amazingly easy when you have a good strategy, yet can fall apart instantly if said strategy is not followed.

MatsT · 03/28/07, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by Cadfael

I'll be happy to give a detailed explanation when/if mods move this message of mine into another thread, as it actually doesn't really have anything to do with the subject of the thread.

I don't read this forum every day, so I had assumed it was actually common knowledge by now, especially since there was a blue post some months ago from Tseric I believe about this topic.

That wasn't what the blue post said. The first person zoning in does give the basic seed, but there are a lot of other pseudorandom variables that is taken into account when loot is randomized when the boss dies. Randomizing loot when the first person enters the instance would be very stupid and would open up a lot of potential exploits (see diablo 2 gambling originally being decided when you opened the menu). As far as we know today, loot is almost certainly decided upon the death of the mob.