I will start off the discussion with...
Rogueset, wtf? Where is the +hit rating? And what is the reason to put 4 (four) blue sockets on that?
But otherwise i like the set, good looking great setbonuses and all.
This seems to be a re-occuring thing.. also notice warrior tankset got red sockets instead of blue and dps blue instead of red, whats up with this? :P
Wow, nothing but red and yellow sockets on the tanking set?
Blue sockets on the dps set?
Um, neat. The set bonuses are fairly unimpressive too. The stats are nice on both, but the bonuses and sockets have me just baffled.
Edit: So what's with the lack of hit/crit on the plate dps set? The ingores armor thing is nice, but will really depend on how big a factor ignoring 406 armor is. I can see it being a nice little bump, but um, I don't get it.
I'd actually be more worried by the sheer amount of Shield Block Rating the Warrior Tier 6 gets, as it stands already most people don't care about the socket bonuses, but the stats on the gear itself should be good, and Shield Block Rating simply isn't much good for a tanking Warrior, especially in those amounts.
It'd be far more effective for tanking if most of that was converted to Dodge Rating, and possibly some Hit Rating.
In fact as contrary as it sounds in comparison to now, I'd say the developers should look at the Paladin tank set for examples of how to itemize the Warrior tank set.
warlock set.. super.. no spell penetration.. stam > int .. plently of dmg.
like it... and +35hp per tick isn't bad at all. thats basically 35hp/s keeping ua/immo/corr up. (175hp5)
and yeah no red sockets... its like they try to limit your stacking of your most wanted stat (+dmg for warlocks). after the yellow socket buff though its not so bad.
Last edited by Vodrin : 04/20/07 at 2:20 PM.
Reason: mp5 -> hp5
If they put nothing but blue sockets on the tank items they may as well all stay 12 stamina on them. Same for red for rogues/hunters. Differing colors makes you think about the socket bonuses instead of them being automatic.
Very good tank set bonuses for the Paladin. Kick in the junk on the 2pc set bonus for healing.
Edit: I'm pretty sure these have already been posted somewhere, I got a good snicker out of the mage robe/pants/helm all being practically the same last time I looked.
Yea, socket bonuses are fairly terrible, but every now and then you can actually get one that works out decently. In theory. Its almost like they are trying to lure us into socketing dodge rating for a few stam. Stacking of parry rating is odd as well.
The warrior tank set is pretty bad. 7/10 gems are red which few warriors will use. 3 of the items add parry rating which is much less mitigation than dodge.
The warrior DPS set is even worse. Pure agility itemization rather than crit, no +hit, and instead it "reduces armor"? Not many warriors will find these as upgrades in either PVE or PVP.
I'm pretty happy with paladin healing set, other than helmet. Good mp5, remains to be seen how much we lost when we see the shaman set, but it's definately much better than t5.
Engineering tank helmet looks far better than warrior t6.
e:
And now that I've seen the shaman set, it's basically as I expected, only the helmet is weak.
I like what they did with the Rogue set. The bonuses while pretty bland are both nice increases to damage overall. Lacks a little bit of hit rating, but like anything can be made up with the sockets on the items.
Interested to see how much of the new gear that comes from Black Temple and future itemization will include 'ignores armor'.
My only gripe with the set is the amount of blue sockets that are on the different pieces. I know its for limiting the stats we get, but blue typed gems are stamina focused first with a secondary (in the case of pure blue just stamina) dps stat that is typically lower. No big deal I guess, but I'd prefer more yellow and red sockets instead of blue ones. I'll have to weigh it out to see if acquiring the socket bonus is worth it, but most likely ill be throwing some yellow hit gems in there.
warlock set.. super.. no spell penetration.. stam > int .. plently of dmg.
like it... and +35hp per tick isn't bad at all. thats basically 35hp/s keeping ua/immo/corr up. (175hp5)
and yeah no red sockets... its like they try to limit your stacking of your most wanted stat (+dmg for warlocks). after the yellow socket buff though its not so bad.
I don't like the set bonus -- Warlocks already have plenty of sustainability. More damage please. I have no problems getting heals on raids, there's lots of ways to get it, there's limited ways to get more damage.
Also, it's like the set designers got the sets backwards. Unless my math is wrong (quite possible), Warlocks have 14 more crit rating, and mages have 19 more hit rating. It makes me wonder if they switched them accidentally (although the sta/int/spi balancing is correct for both classes.)
All in all, I'm underwhelmed. I saw the mage stats before and my warlock friend said "don't worry about all the crit and the moderate/low damage, that's the mage set, warlock set will be different." Instead it's exactly the same, except we have even more crit and less hit.
Warlocks don't have a useful +hit talent (what we have only affects our dots, so we need to get +hit for our threat reducer and our nukes), and most of the raid builds are at most 30%-60% crittable spells, some without the "100% on crits" talent, making crit so much less useful for us than a mage...
Better, the 2-piece bonus is clearly the shadow-based builds bonus since most of our dots are shadow: if you are the crit-happy build (fire-destruction) you won't be using as many of these dots, so you won't get as much of the bonus. But if you're the shadow based builds, then you're nuking far less because you're maintaining more dots, so the crit is far far less valuable...
Most of our raiding-focused talents are in affliction, but all of our sets are catering to Destruction (with the set bonuses being all over the place.) I really don't get it.
That all said -- I do like the stamina . And the 6% bonus on our main nuke will work out to about 1.8-2.4% DPS increase for me on raids, which is a nice perk.
Last edited by Kyth : 04/20/07 at 2:51 PM.
Reason: set bonus clarification
What in the hell is up with the equip's on the warrior dps set? I mean I can see putting the crit needed as an agi slot that will go up with buffs but that just seems really odd to me.
To say i'm dissapointed with the stats on the warrior tank set would be an understatement. Wow thanks for wasting all those points on PARRY rating when it costs completely too much as a stat already, no really thanks. Oh, and also thank you for those wonderful red sockets that everyone will just put 15 stamina gems in despite their color.
I love the Prot Paladin set, but where's the design philosophy here?
- Tier 4 has dodge, block, parry, and block value randomly on different pieces, leading to only helm/shoulders being worthwhile.
- Tier 5 is absolutely loaded with block, with some random parry.
- Tier 6 is absolutely loaded with avoidance, just enough block, and parry where it's actually useful (but still worse than block rating tbh).
I don't like the set bonus -- mages get damage-increasing, we get... sustainability? Warlocks already have plenty of sustainability. More damage please. I have no problems getting heals on raids, there's lots of ways to get it, there's limited ways to get more damage.
Also, it's like the set designers got the sets backwards. Unless my math is wrong (quite possible), Warlocks have 14 more crit rating, and mages have 19 more hit rating. It makes me wonder if they switched them accidentally (although the sta/int/spi balancing is correct for both classes.)
All in all, I'm underwhelmed. I saw the mage stats before and my warlock friend said "don't worry about all the crit and the moderate/low damage, that's the mage set, warlock set will be different." Instead it's exactly the same, except we have even more crit and less hit.
Warlocks don't have a useful +hit talent (what we have only affects our dots, so we need to get +hit for our threat reducer and our nukes), and most of the raid builds are at most 40%-60% crittable spells, some without the "100% on crits" talent, making crit so much less useful for us than a mage...
Better, the 2-piece bonus is clearly the shadow-based builds bonus (which are the ones that nuke less, so get less value out of the crit): if you are the crit-happy build (fire-destruction) you won't be using as many of these dots, so you won't get as much of the bonus.
Most of our raiding-focused talents are in affliction, but all of our sets are catering to Destruction (with the set bonuses being all over the place.) I really don't get it.
That all said -- I do like the stamina . And the 6% bonus on our main nuke will work out to about 1.8-2.4% DPS increase for me on raids, which is a nice perk.
I think as a shadowpriest I'd actually want to take T6 -- but it's not too huge an upgrade over the tailored stuff still. At least they are learning to put sockets in all the items.
For example, just comparing 2 items of Frozen Shadoweave... going from Frozen Shadoweave shoulders to T6 shoulders nets you:
+3 stam
+9 int
+24 spirit
+9 hit
+14 crit
-8 dmg
A worthy tradeoff, even if the item has too much spirit on it.
Going from Frozen Shadoweave chest to T6 chest:
+0 stam
+16 int
+26 spirit
+17 hit
+18 crit
-15 dmg
+1 socket! (will almost make up for the -dmg by that point)
So we're getting more raw stats, and hit/crit to boot, at the price of slightly lesser damage. What this could end up doing is let you put less points in Shadow Focus, freeing up some talent points for something else.
Spellstrike still looks to be slightly better though. However if I can change my build to put points in Imp Mind Blast, the 4 piece bonus might be worthwhile, will have to run the math on that one. The 2 piece is nice, I always like set bonuses that extend spell durations.
This isn't the best place for this comment, but looking over some of the socket bonuses on a few of these really makes me think that Blizzard needs to just ditch socket bonuses altogether and instead just give you an additional 20% of the gem effect if you socket the matching color into it. The socket bonuses really don't accomplish much of anything when people just ignore them.
I love the Prot Paladin set, but where's the design philosophy here?
- Tier 4 has dodge, block, parry, and block value randomly on different pieces, leading to only helm/shoulders being worthwhile.
- Tier 5 is absolutely loaded with block, with some random parry.
- Tier 6 is absolutely loaded with avoidance, just enough block, and parry where it's actually useful (but still worse than block rating tbh).
The designers seem to intentionally mix it up a little bit moving from one tier to the next, presumably to either (a) give people more flexibility in their gear selection, or (b) mitigate the feeling that you're just putting in all this work to move stats up a couple of points.
Indeed. And an interesting observation. If you assume this isn't just random poor itemization, it suggests them trying to force PvE warlocks away from UA for some reason.
(although if it's not just random poor itemization, it doesn't explain why we have *less* hit on our set, by a lot, than mages do. I don't know many mages starved for +hit but I know an awful lot of warlocks who are.)
Either way, I wonder if it'll actually change the balance of what build produces the most raid dps. That probably will depend on what off-set pieces we can get with better itemization.
I'm unhappy though: if I have to wear this shadoweave set (which I made in week, what, 3?) until the next expansion...
I don't like the set bonus -- mages get damage-increasing, we get... sustainability? Warlocks already have plenty of sustainability. More damage please. I have no problems getting heals on raids, there's lots of ways to get it, there's limited ways to get more damage.
The mage 2 piece bonus is a 2 second increase in Evocation's duration. This increases damage how?
Melador> Incidentally, these last few pages are why people hate lawyers.
Viator> I really don't want to go all Kalman here.
Bury> Just imagine what the world would be like if you used your powers for good.
I don't like the set bonus -- mages get damage-increasing, we get... sustainability?
eh?
Mage:
(2pc) +2s on evocate = mana recovery = sustainability
(4pc) +5% damage on DD nukes = percentage based straight dps boost
Warlock
(2pc) Regen 35hp when dots tick = sustainability
(4pc) +6% damage on DD nukes = percentage based straight dps boost
(warlock %dmg is clearly higher because a portion of their dps comes from dots as well - even though the scales on the 4pc weigh in favour of mage, I believe, as I suspect dots make up more than the extra 1% would)
04/20/07, 2:08 PM
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