4.03 Raid Mechanics and testing - Page 3

Lightflower · 01/24/11, 6:03 PM

Originally Posted by Doktre

Nefarian 10s:

We are having some real difficulty controlling adds in P1 due to Ony's tail swipe stunning the mage-kiter. What I'm wondering is whether anyone has had any success using the Line-of-Sight mechanics (source) on Ony's Lightning Discharge? Would Ony need to be positioned with her Lightning Orb humping the pillar or her head, or is it just not possible to position her so that the raid is out of LOS?

We had extremely limited success with LOS mechanics for Onyxia's discharge ability. Some of our players reported that standing very close to a pillar and having that pillar block LOS to the centre of her body enabled them to avoid discharge while others standing in similar spots could not avoid. On the whole, we ditched the strategy as unreliable and went back to a more standard "turn the dragon" for our kill.

My personal opinion is that the LOS effects are probably more to do with the notorious pathing issues which exist in that room and are similar to the issue where sometimes Priest POH will not hit players in Chimaeron's room who are standing on the slightly lower section of the floor or on the other side of a crack.

On the subject of LOS issues for the Nefarian encounter, has anyone found positions where the dragons are not affected by them? We have had numerous issues with Nef landing during P1, tank rapidly getting a massive (130k) threat lead then the dragon simply turning to someone else.

Kuku · 01/24/11, 7:17 PM

Originally Posted by Doktre

Nefarian 10s:

We are having some real difficulty controlling adds in P1 due to Ony's tail swipe stunning the mage-kiter. What I'm wondering is whether anyone has had any success using the Line-of-Sight mechanics (source) on Ony's Lightning Discharge? Would Ony need to be positioned with her Lightning Orb humping the pillar or her head, or is it just not possible to position her so that the raid is out of LOS?

LOSign Onyxia never showed any signs of success when we tried it.

You don't need to kite the adds, by the way. They are fully susceptible to most CC's (polymorphs being the only exception I am aware of. Yes, you can warlock fear them, even though they are undead). We usually CC 3 of them and have our ret tank/kite them until the first 3 die.

The adds on Maloriak can be warlock feared as well, despite being undead.

Sonrisa · 01/24/11, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by Lightflower

On the subject of LOS issues for the Nefarian encounter, has anyone found positions where the dragons are not affected by them? We have had numerous issues with Nef landing during P1, tank rapidly getting a massive (130k) threat lead then the dragon simply turning to someone else.

We found that Nefarian's threat isn't active until he lands. Also Onyxia's threat will reset if people don't jump down at the same time. This is due to the platform being a moving object: the lava doesn't raise, the platform sinks. It's pretty much the same thing that happened during the Gunship battle when people jumped to the oposing sheep and Saurfang/Muradin would keep resetting his threat. Also, the platform being a moving object is the same reason why mages can't use ring of frost in it.

Sh4d0wfury · 01/24/11, 11:23 PM

There is (or at least there was) a bug on Onyxia's threat when a DK used path of frost to reduce his falling damage. Onyxia would turn to a random enemy (which could include pets) and hit them a few times if the tank went to far away from her. The solution is simple, just don't use path of frost.

Sonrisa · 01/24/11, 11:53 PM

Originally Posted by Sh4d0wfury

There is (or at least there was) a bug on Onyxia's threat when a DK used path of frost to reduce his falling damage. Onyxia would turn to a random enemy (which could include pets) and hit them a few times if the tank went to far away from her. The solution is simple, just don't use path of frost.

I had no idea that bug existed (which I'll be sure to test out tonight). What I wrote was the only logical explanation we had for the threat resets after going through the logs and making sure that no one was in fact using Blessing of Sacrifice on the tank. The Path of Frost bug however does indeed seems likely since the aggro reset weren't happening on our early attempts and I know I kept forgetting to use it, and we didn't have any threat issues. As it started happening I assumed people were getting paranoid with aggro and jumping down later to ensure they wouldn't turn Onyxia and that's how I got to the moving platform theory.

One thing I don't get though, is why using Path of Frost would have any impact what so ever on threat.

sp00n · 01/25/11, 7:24 AM

We had Nefarian attacking random targets on almost all of our attempts so far.
Howerver, last week I think we didn't have these issues, and we also had no DK in our line up that time.

We'll be there again tonight, maybe we can validate this further.

Exemplar · 01/25/11, 8:19 AM

Originally Posted by Kuku

The adds on Maloriak can be warlock feared as well, despite being undead.

I believe the previous week the adds on Maloriak were undead. This last week we found the adds were not undead, which adds tools to many classes but removed them from our Paladin tank (Holy Wrath would no longer stun them).

sp00n · 01/25/11, 4:43 PM

Originally Posted by Sh4d0wfury

There is (or at least there was) a bug on Onyxia's threat when a DK used path of frost to reduce his falling damage. Onyxia would turn to a random enemy (which could include pets) and hit them a few times if the tank went to far away from her. The solution is simple, just don't use path of frost.

Still seems to be the case. Just had two engages, the first one without Path of Frost and no random targetting, the second with, and she instantly showed the usual behaviour of randomly targetting someone in the raid, not depending on aggro.

// Edit
Only one attempt out of 6 showed the erratic behaviour. Exactly the one where Path of Frost was active.

Lightflower · 01/31/11, 5:32 PM

We have done a couple of attempts at the achievement Double Dragon and noticed some odd occurrences with the Twiilight Corrupters. Our DPS team goes down during the first Dazzling Destruction and has noticed that the Corrupters spawn in an apparently random location, that they run for a portal which spawns in an apparently random location and that the first corrupter targeted despawns (before running through a portal) about 4 seconds after it is first attacked.

We were wondering if anyone has observed different effects on this fight or is the above entirely normal? If it is normal, any hints on how to get the achievement would be greatly appreciated.

kaib · 02/01/11, 6:23 AM

We had another issue with Valiona/Theralion heroic, was wondering if anyone else had issues with that. In the second Valiona phase the devouring flames went mental on us here and there. It didn't happen all that often but frequently enough and wiped two or three attempts on 3x% with 25 people alive, which was rather frustrating.
I cannot pin it down but twice someone managed to call it ahead of it bugging out, it seemed her casting animation was different, the black spikes around her missing or something like that.
We definitley had people inside the twilight realm at that point, possible that she's 'targeting' (I know she's not actually targeting somene, but might be some script to determine where she turns towards) someone inside the realm and that causes it?

@valiona achievement:

It looked to me like they spawned on one end of the room and ran to a portal on the other side. They are fast and immediatly despawn once they reach it. You can stun and freeze them however. Shadow fury, hammer of justice etc and frost mages can deep freeze/shatter them (whateve that stuff is called). They have about 120k hp, which isn't a lot. Let some people with good burst zone in, set up someone as assist who spams a targeting macro and then stun/root and kill them.

Ayreon · 02/01/11, 6:38 AM

We experienced the issue with Valiona's breath as well and from what (little) I could gather, it indeed appears to be caused by her targetting the breath on someone in the twilight realm. It only happened once or twice though.

TrlstanC · 02/03/11, 5:15 PM

An issue with group healing on Chimaeron, I've seen it mentioned before that there were some issues with LOS, or some similiar issue in his room:

Using Prayer of Healing I would have some players that consistently weren't getting the heal in the target group for a number of attempts in a row, single target healing still worked fine. Having players move away from the back corners of the room (where the stairs come in) and not stand in, or on the other side of any depressions fixed the problem. It's one of those problems that makes me think I'm paranoid, but can also cause a wipe.