• frmorrison

Blizzard wants PvPers to do heroics, and because it is really good for PvP and not from that venue it is being nerfed to 10%.


The 2000+ teams are getting items fast, but like has been said before, a majority (I would say 80%) of Arena teams are at 1500 points, so they aren't getting their gear fast (maybe have 2 pieces of their set or a weapon only), so I doubt Season 2 will have new gear.

 

diospadre

The average team rating is a pointless statistic. "New" points are introduced into the system every day as thousands of teams are created, go on a losing streak and are abandoned. Someone who does arenas frequently probably has an average of something between 1600 and 1800.

 

Antoine

I don't have the arena gear, but I do know that the 4-piece bonus on the old WL/Marshal gear (.2 seconds off Immolate) did reduce the GCD for that spell.

 

Sapphrina

Affliction lock 4pc set bonus should be 0.2secs off UA or SoC. NOT immolate.

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niska

qft, though I'm still not convinced that lowering cast time below that of the GCD is all that useful. I think I'll stack resilience bonuses instead.

 

Viktus

The only spells I would wear a cast time reducing bonus over a large chunk of resilience would be UA or fear, pref UA since fear has pushback resistance through the pvp gloves.

It won't happen though, since UA is a 41 point talent. Not even all affliction locks will have it, nevermind demo locks who aren't interested in the crit set.

It would be a great bonus, the same way "Increases the duration of The Beast Within by 6 seconds" or "Gives your Earth Shield a 100% chance to resist dispel effects" would be great bonuses. They're just too specific for blizzard to implement them.

 

zepi

Has anyone considered that only 50% of the teams achieve a winrate of 50% or more?

And with a winrate of ~50% with rating ~1500 getting these "sets" is pretty slow. So again, bottom 40% is not getting more than 1-2 pieces. Well, I guess this only conserns about 40% of the players and about 0.01% of EJ-forums population, that one being me

 

Necrotoid

This analysis doesn't quite work right. A lot of people have one "good" team and 1-2 "fun", "temporary", "friendly" whatever teams. The ability to be on a good team and beat a bunch of newly made, temporary, or nonserious teams means there is the possibility that >50% of the population can have a win rate over 50% in their chosen bracket.

DOT and rot.
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zepi

Hmm, hadn't considered that, but still, only 50% of 5v5 teams will have over 50% winrate, and with 3v3 teams to achieve similar gear-progression in arenas is quite a bit harder.

 

probiscus

Regarding the warlock 4pc set bonus: I wouldn't mind seeing something along the lines of "your demon armor grants you (insert arbitrary #) resilience"

The number would ofc have to be larger than 35 to make any sense - but given the set bonus should be better than the 2pc, I'd expect to see something along the lines of 50-75. Granted, I have -NO- idea how much of the itemization budget that would eat up (or even how set bonuses are factored into itemization budgets).

 

Kody

This is no different from PvE. The top guilds get their new items first, then it trickles down to the lower tiered guilds.

 

drole

Lets just hope they regain their sanity and change a couple of those setbonuses.

 

Viktus

It would have to be an absolutely massive number to overcome the 20% healing bonus from fel armor, not to mention the +100 damage. Anything that counteracts mortal strike to any degree is pure gold in the current metagame, it would probably take about 150 resilience for me to consider giving up fel armor.

 

Emeraude

Regardless of how much drama starts falling out from top guilds vs lower tiered guilds, they're never in direct competition with one another.

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alienangel

Damn, if that energy bonus were a 2 piece, and stacked with nightslayer and vigor, there would be such an orgy of theorycraft on Ming's site

 

Cel

If anyone suggests wearing 5 pieces of Nightslayer.... o_o

130 energy, though.. I'd do it for fun from time to time. :P I still have my sets of t1, t2, t2.5 in the bank. (never did finish t3. :[ LFM Kel'Thuzad, Thaddius and Four Horsemen)

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◊ Kyth

Ya know, I first was writing that you might have just had confusion from lag (I have 80-200, which can easily, along with human reaction times, eat up that 0.2), but....:

Thinking about it though, I guess you're probably right that it did. It's been a while since I pvp'd as full destro (sniff... I miss it!), so I'd forgotten about the beauty of those seduce/SB/immo (seduce)/conflag/SB cycles -- that wouldn't have worked reliably without "spell not ready" issues once you got the upper gear. Hmm.


It just doesn't jibe with Blizzard's justification for nerfing the imp firebolt talent ("can't reduce spells below the gcd") and what they've done with haste. It's like there's two different philosophies here, and whether we get a gcd reduction depends on which team happened to implement spell/item X.

whine. sulk. /auc WTB gcd reduction consistently PST!

 

probiscus

You're probably right, the number would be too large for it to be realistic. Though, I think my breakeven would be somewhere closer to 100 resil. Even then, that buff would just continue the perpetual QQ'ing from every other class about dueling warlocks.

 

Keline

neither are these arena teams. How often do you think is a 1700 rated team matched against a 2100 one? Most of my games are 12-17 points

 

obsolete

regardless of how easy or not it is to obtain the arena gear, the fact remains that if blizzards agenda is to keep PvE and PvP seperate then the moment any guild starts obtaining T6 then they would have to upgrade arena gear. Otherwise players in the top PvE guilds will have significant advantages in PvP, essentially forcing PvP'ers to PvE in order to be competitive.

 

diotox

As long as they continue keeping resilence far, far away from any pve gear, they would have to add absolute gobs and gobs of stamina and DPS stats for pve gear to be more valuable than the current gladiator stuff. The difference between beating on someone with 300 resilence and 0 is night and day. Not to mention, the damage prevented by resilence is damage that doesn't have to be healed, even if you have a giant HP pool with 0 resilence you are going to be taking damage at an alarming rate.

 

Ghost

The only problem with this, is that some servers progress in PvE much much faster than other servers. For instance, on Lightninghoof right now no guilds have even been making attempts into Serpantshrine yet (though we hope to start very soon). While on many other servers it has been cleared or close to cleared. I expect the same thing with Teir 6 to happen too. Guilds on other servers will be clearing Black Temple while our server is just barely stepping foot into it. That would suck to have PvPers on the server decked out in T6 equivilent armor when no guilds are even able to progress into T6 yet.

 

raal

I've said this before and I will say it again: Why is that a problem? You cannot bring gladiator gear to raids anyway. A Rogue with 300 resilience, 12000 HP and 1100 AP is not a viable damage dealer. You will be better off using quested blues. Hell, you will probably do more damage using a full "of the bandit" set.

 

Anedris

Is the reverse (tier 6 in the hands of raiders before equivalent gladiator gear is released) an issue either? Won't players in raiding gear simply get destroyed due to their lack of stamina and resilience? I presume some items will carry over (weapons especially) and something like a 3-minute mage team would benefit from enormous firepower but in general it seems that Blizz has done a reasonable job of making the glass cannon approach that is encouraged for most classes in raids (excluding specific encounters) non-viable in PvP. (Or I am I off-base here?)

 

raal

Raid gear in PvP is more viable than the other way around simply because no part of the raid itemization contains "dead points" for PvP. Resilience is does not bring anything to raids, and it is very expensive on the itemization budget. While survivability is king in PvP, DPS is important too, so raid gear does not suffer as badly from a cross-over.

Also, Tier 6 seems to be getting a lot more stamina. The Slayer set (Rogue) has 212 STA and 10 sockets, compared to the Gladiator set with 214 STA and 7 Sockets. Socketed for PvP, the Slayer set will have more stamina, in addition to having an obscene amount of damage. It is just plain better, resilience or not.

And it should not be better for PvP, just as PvP gear is not better for Raids. In fact, it shouldn't even be equal, it should be worse by a rather large margin.

That is why they need to release a second tier of gladiator armor.

On a side note: I do not mind if they reset the arena points between seasons, or require the Tier 1 Gladiator gear as a trade-in for the Tier 2 part. That would make Arena progression closer to what Raid progression is like, and only fair.