Our first mag kill.
Moonbiter, Stellar arent on cubes. Zogeth is MM(bm since yesterday) Tequilla is BM, I am surv(1010 agi at that fight), Aduro was a backup and clicked from 25~% when luiza died.
Warlocks where on the usual dot+infirnal job
My own dps was not as high as it could have been, Being nervous about clicking and thus using a very simple rotation. But overall dps seemed fine.
Any way people can improve?, and tips for myself are allways welcome. http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report...4s&s=7417-8152
I tamed a scorpid now btw to test it, 15fps(for a month more at least) but my macro is decent enough. I will try to get another hunter on scorpid/md at release duty next kill.
Truestrike... good point. the rest is kara drops that hate me.
but this wasnt about gear or comp speccs. more about the raid dps in general.
Luiza being so low did suprise me, since he usually is very high.
Here are two "good" kills from tonight, noteworthy because of what I'd consider high DPS (also high apparently compared to most other kills listed on WWS):
With regard to Karathress in particular, we recently had one of our locks respec 0/21/40 shadow, and I think the results in situations where he can just sit and chain nuke speak for themselves. That's some disgusting damage.
As others have mentioned, lack of battleshout and windfury is hurting your rogues (the battleshout thing is confusing, as they do get it on a few attempts and you're not exactly lacking warriors; i guess it may just be that their warrior is bloodraging and putting it up pre-pull, then refreshing it before it runs out, which won't be showing up in the split log).
Yep, I swapped a warrior out of that group when our feral druid showed up after the first couple attempts - bad group management on my part.
Thanks a lot for the advice (same to Lavanda, Lia, and Nuno). I'll pass this along to my guild and I'm expecting an easy Gruul death next week.
I'm "Armisael" Only reason I'm posting is, according to every spreadsheet I've tried, and the web calculator, I should be doing about 1300 dps(lag considered, only had to move for one infernal, going all out) with a shadowpriest and cos, so I wanted to know what I was doing wrong. My %s seem about right, and I'm casting 100% of the time, so I have no idea.
Anyone? Or are the spreadsheets/calculators way off?
Here are two "good" kills from tonight, noteworthy because of what I'd consider high DPS (also high apparently compared to most other kills listed on WWS):
With regard to Karathress in particular, we recently had one of our locks respec 0/21/40 shadow, and I think the results in situations where he can just sit and chain nuke speak for themselves. That's some disgusting damage.
For the Lady Vashj fight I've been looking over both Manly's and Stion's damage output and what sort of cycles they are using.
The biggest difference I notice between them is that Stion used Invisability twice and Manly didn't use it once. Then I notice this:
Manly 66 Non-crit, 28 crit Fireballs for 318k damage. Total 482k damage.
Stion 65 Non-crit, 45 crit Fireballs for 388k damage. Total 527k damage.
I wish the Armory had a past gear feature to show a raid set because as the Armory is showing for me now;
Manly has 99 spell hit/36.41% spell crit/974+ Fire damage
Stion has 60 spell hit/31.46% spell crit/1093+ Fire damage
Just from those numbers, I would assume Manly would best Stion due to more crit/hit, but is it because Manly is doing so many Scorches in the log that is screwing with his lowered dps?
Another thing that disturbs me is the severe lowness of rest of the casters, the next one being 120k lower than Manly. But what's even more disturbing to me than that is how low the Shadow Priests are.
It just isn't clicking to me as how some people are so extremely high, while others are so low.
Here are two "good" kills from tonight, noteworthy because of what I'd consider high DPS (also high apparently compared to most other kills listed on WWS):
With regard to Karathress in particular, we recently had one of our locks respec 0/21/40 shadow, and I think the results in situations where he can just sit and chain nuke speak for themselves. That's some disgusting damage.
0/21/40 usually goes into a fire build but Zarplex used it to a shadow build. I do realize that he has 2 pieces of +shadow only gear on his profile which causes just a small issue. Overall, its hard to argue with the results.
Eoy of forte has released movies for quite some time doing quite good fire dps in the 0/21/40 build. Just someone to take a look at.
could I get someone to look at the mage Agatha and fill me in on how the dps time is worked out? It seems to be calcing the time his ignites/fireballs tick as dps time which I think would substanially lower his DPS value in the DPS column. Could someone with a bit more experiance explain hwo you get a reliable DPS number for a fire mage, or is gruul just a terrible fight to comapre wws values?
Taken from the WWS forums:
To understand this, you must understand the "DPS mode". A player is in DPS mode 5 seconds after doing damage. If he does other damage during these 5 seconds, he stays in DPS mode. If he does no damage, he leaves the DPS mode.
It means that as soon as the player don't actively chain-cast spells, he leaves the DPS mode. Eg to heal himself, ot to move in the room, or to resplenish mana. Even if he waits 3 secs between casts, then incant a 3 seconds spell, he leaves the DPS mode for 1 sec !
DPS time measure the time the player was in DPS mode. It can be usefull to judge if players enter combat soon enough, don't spend too much time repositionning, switch mobs quickly, etc...
As for the DPS, it is not just damage done/duration of fight. It is damage done/dps time. It reflects more accurately the effectiveness of the player when he's DPSing, but is not the sole measure of a player's performance.
This means that imp fireball/ignite will indeed increase your dps time, since every dot that ticks will reset the 5 second timer. Keep in mind that most classes have some form of DoT's though, only one I can think of right who hasn't is frost mages.
WWS also has the average dps, which is simply total damage done/time present, you can find that by pressing the config button
For the Lady Vashj fight I've been looking over both Manly's and Stion's damage output and what sort of cycles they are using.
The biggest difference I notice between them is that Stion used Invisability twice and Manly didn't use it once. Then I notice this:
Manly 66 Non-crit, 28 crit Fireballs for 318k damage. Total 482k damage.
Stion 65 Non-crit, 45 crit Fireballs for 388k damage. Total 527k damage.
I wish the Armory had a past gear feature to show a raid set because as the Armory is showing for me now;
Manly has 99 spell hit/36.41% spell crit/974+ Fire damage
Stion has 60 spell hit/31.46% spell crit/1093+ Fire damage
Just from those numbers, I would assume Manly would best Stion due to more crit/hit, but is it because Manly is doing so many Scorches in the log that is screwing with his lowered dps?
Another thing that disturbs me is the severe lowness of rest of the casters, the next one being 120k lower than Manly. But what's even more disturbing to me than that is how low the Shadow Priests are.
It just isn't clicking to me as how some people are so extremely high, while others are so low.
Obviously, both of us don't wear that gearset for that fight. I had to put some suboptimal gear to pad up with the fact that I didn't have an elemental shaman in my group this week. This usually is not the case so I never really bothered picking up past 10% spell hit. For reference, I was wearing [Ruby Drape of the Mysticant], [Neltharion's Tear], [Darkmoon Card: Crusade], [Band of Crimson Fury], which puts me at +1027dmg, 14.81% hit (after talents), 32.88% crit. Keep in mind that Darkmoon Card: Crusade will not show it its +dmg in armory, so in practice its higher than those numbers.
I'll be honest here and just say that you're looking at the wrong things...
-Stion has 34.46% crit. (his profile doesn't have molten armor on)
-25k of Stion's dps comes from Static Charge (4% of dps). This is a debuff that hurts you and your teammates.
-Stion had 39% of his fireballs crit, whereas I had 29%. I'll just say that Stion was lucky on crits whereas I wasn't.
I'll also make mention of a few things that cannot be shown in a parse (not easily seen at least). Stion does extensive use of stopcast. I do from time to time, mostly when I'm not distracted. If there is something important I need to keep watch of, I typically won't use stopcasting simply because it puts my attention somewhere that isn't really important in the grand scheme of things. More specifically; on phase 1 I will do stopcast, but you won't see me do it on phase 2 because I need to check constantly my positioning (since spreading out helps healers). I also make sure that I am not in the conical direction of the naga tank/melee. During phase 3, I will do stopcast up until the point where poison clouds start dropping to a somewhat more annoying level, if you ever get that far (which we didn't in that kill). You could say its unacceptable to play without 100% stopcasting. I believe under some fight it is better to put your attention span on things that can affect the others (this is typically the case in fights where positioning is key). I prefer a 'safe' playstyle. This is also why I am using the nexus key. I could be using my karazhan dagger with my badge offhand for that slight dps increase, but in the end, I don't think its worth giving up that many stamina.
Another thing that disturbs me is the severe lowness of rest of the casters, the next one being 120k lower than Manly. But what's even more disturbing to me than that is how low the Shadow Priests are.
It just isn't clicking to me as how some people are so extremely high, while others are so low.
They had different roles in the fight, Manly and Stion were in the best position to stand and nuke, the others had to move a lot.
Here are two "good" kills from tonight, noteworthy because of what I'd consider high DPS (also high apparently compared to most other kills listed on WWS):
With regard to Karathress in particular, we recently had one of our locks respec 0/21/40 shadow, and I think the results in situations where he can just sit and chain nuke speak for themselves. That's some disgusting damage.
Any particular reason Zarplex didn't mix Immolate into his rotation during Karathress? He did during the other encounters and his average DPS from Immolate was greater than from Shadowbolt throughout the raid.
Here are two "good" kills from tonight, noteworthy because of what I'd consider high DPS (also high apparently compared to most other kills listed on WWS):
With regard to Karathress in particular, we recently had one of our locks respec 0/21/40 shadow, and I think the results in situations where he can just sit and chain nuke speak for themselves. That's some disgusting damage.
I notice in particular that in karathress you have only 7 healers. I noticed this too for a previous morogrim report. Don't you have mana/healing issues? On our last morogrim kill (14k raid dps) we had 8 and many claimed we were missing one extra healer. I wonder if this compensated by the fact you have 3 shadow priests, but i would still to know how you work to pull it off.
I notice in particular that in karathress you have only 7 healers. I noticed this too for a previous morogrim report. Don't you have mana/healing issues? On our last morogrim kill (14k raid dps) we had 8 and many claimed we were missing one extra healer. I wonder if this compensated by the fact you have 3 shadow priests, but i would still to know how you work to pull it off.
We use 7 healers because we maintain 17k rdps. I can imagine you need 8 healers with 14k rdps. :/
And yes, shadow priests do make a world of difference. Looking at that page, I can readily tell you that one shadow priest in my group provided me 16,832 mana during the course of the fight.
We never really run with more than 7 pure healers, and on quite a few encounters run with just 6. Usually healing is held up fine and I rarely run into mana issues even when not in a shadow priest group. I guess it really depends on the fight, as we did HWL Najentus with just 6 healers and in the future I am sure we will increase the number as that was quite intense.
We got irregular rogues dps, especially on Lurker where one of them is litteraly top1 far away on each try.
I think he may be DPS alot while spout, others just ensuring they stay alive. no real clue yet btw
Any particular reason Zarplex didn't mix Immolate into his rotation during Karathress? He did during the other encounters and his average DPS from Immolate was greater than from Shadowbolt throughout the raid.
Actually, it was a frame issue. I am running with two dottimers currently (for testing). The one I was looking at didn't record immolate properly half the time, so rather than using the force, I just went with what was easier.
0/21/40 usually goes into a fire build but Zarplex used it to a shadow build. I do realize that he has 2 pieces of +shadow only gear on his profile which causes just a small issue. Overall, its hard to argue with the results.
Eoy of forte has released movies for quite some time doing quite good fire dps in the 0/21/40 build. Just someone to take a look at.
0/21/40 fire has emberstorm.
0/21/40 shadow can take advantage of erotically budgeted shadow damage items and (most importantly) my own ISB procs.
We haven't had our best players on for awhile, so DPS is a bit low. Advice would be much appreciated!
Well, normally I comment on a micro level, but at this point, all i see is 7 wipes. I think your problem is more on a macro level. You run a raid with 9 healers (!) and a raid dps on average below 6k. I don't think its as much as a problem of player skills or gear, its just a matter of numbers. Ever since raiding existed the first rule of tuning has always been 'whats the lowest number of healer we can bring to a raid on a given fight?', and i think the numbers here are just working against you.
The main problem clearly still is Shadowbolts and loose elementals for you guys. There's nothing much to say about your dps or WWS when you'r still in learning phase. I would recommend taking another lock if elementals prove a problem and make sure CoT is up the entire time. If your warriors are having trouble interrupting, tell them to stick to auto attack and spam a few specials right after they interrupted the cast.
I'm going to assume attempt 6 was the best (since blast nova wiped you there). By the time magth released, you killed 2 channelers and lost 3 dps. Try to forget about cube clicking till you atleast are able to down 3 channelers by the time magth releases.
Spread your channelers out more, they got 2 heals off. The heal range is only 40yd so just keep them out of 40 yd. A channeler healing himself shouldnt happen. Let your mages/rogues/shaman make an interrupt rotation.
Taking another look, I might be able to say something about dps:
Stitchtooth: very big resist rate, even vs lvl 72s. Does less dps than a tank (yes; he died, but he still should push alot more dps). I'm not that familiar with balance builds, but he seems to have just 'picked some talents' in alot of cases: no balance of power while he clearly needs the hit, 1 point in Tranquil Spirit and only 2 in Subtley? Here is the build of our regular balance druid (he insist on keeping NS, but you can put those 3 points in moonfury or imp FF if you must): http://armory.wow-europe.com/#charac...Blade&n=Elshar
I'd call him pretty undergeared for the dps race Magtheridon is though. Also, give him a shadowpriest.
Deathdealer has a 52% VT upkeep, which is horrible. Labiana's is 75%+- which is decent but can also use improvement.
I'd say your top 5 is pretty ok on dps, but everyone under them has to work harder. In terms of group layout, I wouldnt put healers in shadowpriest groups untill all your dps has one. You run very healer heavy (though we do the same), but ask your 2 shamans to use more chainheal, their healing is way too low. If they 'just dont have anything to heal', remove one of them. (or even better: remove 2 priests and get an extra pala and rogue)
Right, I just browsed your log file; you need to make clear that your entire raid is responsible for keeping the elementals under control. Here is a list of CC that affected your elementals: http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report...4&fiaa=i&fit=4
Eoy of forte has released movies for quite some time doing quite good fire dps in the 0/21/40 build. Just someone to take a look at.
Yeah, I actually had specficially pointed Eoy out to Zarplex when he was considering his spec, but I think the key is that we're going for more raid synergy rather than personal DPS. We typically have 3 shadow priests and 2 other affliction locks on any given raid. An increase in ISB uptime due to a dedicated shadowbolting warlock with +crit gear is really significant.
As a warlock on CC on Mag, all I can say is the fight was ... hell until we got it through everyone's head that the entire raid has to CC the infernals, locks simply have the best means for long term.
At least HoJ/Scream should appear everytime and infernal drops on a healer or right near, it's impossible to have the warlock be there 100% of the time to babysit one priest/paladin, there's fear, the room is pretty big so until a lock is available every other form of CC is fair game.
Scatter Shot/some traps/blind for infernals in the dps camp/tanks that had their add killed are other options. People don't have to move to look for infernals but if something is in range, even 2-3 seconds of delay will help, especially since you're using 2 warlocks to learn. Think about the fact that the locks can only CC 4 and afaik there's max 2/channeler, 8 total.
06/09/07, 11:31 PM
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