I'm part of Marly's raid and I believe that I don't DPS enough. I'm sorry, the current link the armory shows me in tanking stuff but as far I as remember, I've got around 1750AP, 24%crit, 190hit, Dragonmaw and Vindicator's Brand (in Berserking stance, unbuff). I've got a classical 17/44/0 fury DW build.
About DPS Cycles, I save enough rage for Bloodthirst (Sanguinaire in french) and Whirlwind (Tourbillon) and spam Heroic Strike at the same time.
On this down, I'm only at 586dps. Should I've done more ? As I've died before Execution sequence, is it normal ? How could I improve my DPS (I know I've got some +12ap instead of +16 but they're really too expensive atm.) ?
I dunno, as rage gained through Unbrielded Wrath has been normalised. I've read many topics about slow MH and fast OH or slow MH and slow OH and I didn't find a satisfying answer. It seems that both are well doing. Anyway on Gruul's fight I'm often full rage (or above 50)
I'm part of Marly's raid and I believe that I don't DPS enough. I'm sorry, the current link the armory shows me in tanking stuff but as far I as remember, I've got around 1750AP, 24%crit, 190hit, Dragonmaw and Vindicator's Brand (in Berserking stance, unbuff). I've got a classical 17/44/0 fury DW build.
About DPS Cycles, I save enough rage for Bloodthirst (Sanguinaire in french) and Whirlwind (Tourbillon) and spam Heroic Strike at the same time.
On this down, I'm only at 586dps. Should I've done more ? As I've died before Execution sequence, is it normal ? How could I improve my DPS (I know I've got some +12ap instead of +16 but they're really too expensive atm.) ?
Thanks for your advices
I don't think your dps is that bad considering you died before 20%. A big chunk of your damage comes from that period. I noticed you died from taking a Hurtful Strike. If it was due to getting aggro over the OT, you might want to try and be more conservative about using heroic strike (also, did you have BOS all the time?). Some use cleave instead, others spam hamstring, it's a matter of you giving it a shot. If the OT died, well, better luck next time.
Try to replace your AP gems by +strength gems. You will get a small increase in AP under the effect of BoK. I also think you stats need some work, even though i can't see your gear. Try to improve your hit and crit rating without losing much stats. If you can keep around 1700ap, but go up to 14/15% hit and near 30% crit in beserk stance you should see an improvement. I would work on +hit first, and then crit.
Here is the armory updated with my DPS stuff, berserking stance) (27.14% crit, 198hit, 1744ap).
About Trinkets, I have the Terokkar thing that gives 22hit and AP boost (quest reward). I ran many Heroic furnace without getting the better trinket et bad luck on the Opera event too. I've got the cloak that drop on the Prince (70ap 30sta) and the one that drop the Ogre in the Shadow labyrinth (16hit 18crit 30ap). I'm currently gatheriing mats for the epic crafted one (23crit 52ap, red socket). I'm not sure which one I should use at the moment.
I know I can upgrade the blue ring with the Ring of a Thousand Marks.
I also have the Vanquisher's Legplates but I dunno how to gem it properly without loosing stats.
About Gruul, according to KTM I was far from the OT (druid) but it seems that he wasn't at close contact at that moment (and I was third in threat list)
Any advice about my stuff and gems would be appreciated
A shaman in the melee group would have given you a kill at around Growth 11 if you wiped at 1% at Growth 12 according to the parse.
Your mage Foofoo doesn't seem too clear on what his spell cycle is - he's using Arcane missles (wtf?) Frostbolt, and Fireball. That's not any sort of standard mage rotation I've ever seen or heard of. In fact when you view his spells cast over every Gruul attempt that you did that night it almost looks like he's just mashing buttons. His spec seems a bit odd too although another mage could probably tell you better. He's not using Arcane Blast at all which would seem to be part of the point of going deep Arcane. Overall I'd say he hasn't given a lot of thought to his talents or how he plays.
Hunters: They need better shot rotations. Their average time between autoshots is in the 6-7 range with weapons with unbuffed speeds of 2.9 and 3.0
Warlocks: Desole needs to use Curse of Elements instead of Curse of Doom since we have 3 mages. Shard needs to work on DoT uptime.
Mages: Foofoosheshe is preforming way under his gear, even when he stays alive.
Our DPS warriors didn't do so hot - I'm not sure if it's because they didn't have windfury, or if it's something else.
I don't really know what to look out for on the healing front. Any suggestions for our guild are appreciated.
Your first shadow priest: Yunalesc must be a moron. I know that sounds mean, but only morons put precious talent points into improved fade. Further, he is way under performing for his gear, and his gemming and itemization isnt that bad, but could use a little work.
Your other shadow Priest, Ehrin, has a much better spec, but again he is wasting 3 talent points on stupid pvp talents (improved fear, silence) instead of threat reduction and mindblast/SW: Death crit chance.
Only thing I can say about foofoo is he has no idea how to play his class. He needs more +spell hit on his gear(not penetration). Most if not all of his gear is socketed with +spell crit and +spell pene, he needs to drop that and go for +spell hit and spell damage. However, for gruul he has more than enough spell damage and being frost he should be fine so he doesn't need to over-haul his gear for this fight, he just needs to play better.
Your entire raid needs to get better at shatters.
Also, you need a shaman. Even resto shamans add windfury to your rogues/warriors and theres no question that if you had a shaman you would of have downed him.
I don't really know what to look out for on the healing front. Any suggestions for our guild are appreciated.
1. In general, a Shaman will really help your raid out.
2. Holy Priests - Kailana is doing really well, but I'm really not sure Jadenn has a clue. 63% overhealing using Flash Heal. If his intention is to proc Inspiration, he's still better off using a ranked down Greater Heal to spam. He's blowing through his mana, unnecessarily. If the intention is to have split up "types of healing", a Paladin is better suited to the small / fast heals.
3. Holy Paladins - Helen did well. Sturmbb looked like he was splitting his time between your MT and HST and therefore was late (overhealing) on most every cast. Dove also looked to be really slow any time he chose to use Holy Light. I'm not sure if his choice seemed to be after huge damage, but at 81% overheal, he might have been better off keeping to his FOL spamming that he seemed to prefer in the first place.
4. Your Druid did well.
Malan is right, Foofoo really seems to have no idea what he is doing. I don't even know where to begin. Go find my post a page or 2 back about "mage bootcamp". His spec is just weird, he isn't even selecting spells that make sense within that spec, he has low hit and crit stats, his DPS time is low...The fact that he seems to die early almost every time doesn't help, either.
It also seems like if Shyyanne could find a way to cast more often, she would rocket up the charts. For example, on try 2, Eve fit 11 more fireballs and 6 more scorches into the same time as Shyy. That alone probably accounts for almost all of the difference in their damage. I'm not sure if there are mitigating factors (Eve has a good safe spot for ground slam or something).
Foofoo is just incredibly poorly specced. I sincerely hope you alert him to these suggestions.
First, he needs to respec. He is 40 Arcane and doesn't have Arcane Power? I can't even begin to fathom that. If he wishes to remain Arcane (although I can't imagine he's beholden to the spec given that he's missing one of the key fun things about it) / Frost, have him try this spec:
Also note the inclusion of 5/5 Arcane Focus - if you're deep Arcane, you should be using Arcane Blast in your rotation, which I'll get to later. Improved Arcane Missiles is wasted points. I can think of no good raiding spec where Arcane Missiles should ever be a casting consideration.
As for his rotation, he should go Arcane Blast -> Arcane Blast -> Frostbolts until Arcane Blast is down, and continue. Now, if by chance you do have a Winter's Chill Mage in the raid, then sure, he can just go all out Frostbolts, but only if you have a WC Mage helping. At the end of the fight, he should Arcane Blast down to no mana, hopefully as the boss is falling over.
As for gear, his Chest and Boots are unenchanted: fix this. Those are 2 pieces of gear whose enchants are incredibly cheap. On the Gloves, replace the +8 spell crit gem with Veiled Noble Topaz (+5 dmg, +4 spell hit) and replace all 3 gems on the Pants AND Boots with Veiled Noble Topazes. That should put him right around the hit cap in the Arcane Tree (not the Frost tree, and this is because of Arcane Focus).
Personally, I think he should replace the Occulus of the Hidden Eye with the crafted Alchemy Trinket - at least in a raid setting.
Your first shadow priest: Yunalesc must be a moron.
I appreciate the content in your post, but this judgement seems abusive and non-constructive to me. "Has no idea how to play his/her class" is one thing, but "moron" is another.
I appreciate the content in your post, but this judgement seems abusive and non-constructive to me. "Has no idea how to play his/her class" is one thing, but "moron" is another.
Maybe "moron" is strong, but having 2 points in improved fade certainly betrays a lack of understanding about something fundamental. It's one of:
Choice A: They believe fade is a permanent threat reduction, not temporary. Choice B: They believe they will have aggro only once in 24 seconds but twice in less than 30 seconds and that fade will be enough to make them lose aggro.
At any rate, the first belief is incorrect, and the second is highly unlikely to occur. Unlikely enough that you're better off with other talents.
Our guild just started to use WWS last week to see if it would help us out with our progression and I believe we have already gained some valuable information from the reports. While we have discovered some things on our own I was hoping that we could also gain a better understanding by seeking help outside of the guild.
Typically our raid dps starts out rather slow on new encounters, but it eventually picks up to the point where we are able to beat enrage timers, however, it feels like it could be doing a lot better. Especially on fights that don't have enrage timers it feels like we take double the amount of time necessary.
Our first night on Void Reaver, took about 5 tries, with, I believe, 3 of the wipes failing to make enrage timer (only recorded final 3 attempts, Attempt 3 was our kill, but was only recorded by 1 player that night). http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report=14q46ltjhep3k
I'd really appreciate comments/advice, anything you can think of would be helpful.
Your melee and your OT need to improve on Gruul a bit. Your enhance shaman dodged a Hateful Strike and ate another, which led to a death. Looks like he ankhed and then died again to a 5 stack Shatter. So either your OT died or wasn't generating enough threat, and your melee are not doing a very good job of avoiding shatters.
His Totem Relic choice on the Armory right now is a healing totem - if that's really the case he needs to improve that for raids ASAP because that is really not helping him out. (Hint - Heroic Mana Tombs) He needs to remove all those +Hit gems he has and replace them with +Str or +Str/Crit gems, he has plenty of +Hit right now to play around with. If he was using that -Threat trinket on the Gruul kill, really not needed considering his DPS was pretty moderate, he should be using a DPS trinket instead. (That particular trinket only drops around 900 threat on a 2 min cooldown, not very good!)
Moctezuma used feint 40 times. That pretty much explains his poor dps. He has also reapplied slice and dice 27 times after it had dropped, I'd wager a guess that he isn't really cycling too well. His spec doesn't seem that great either.
The setup for the fight was
2 MT (Borodin & Ardante)
3 on Naga Elites (Timtoo, Brissa, Burzar)
6 on Striders (Yezechiel, Xantis, Twinker, Tiera, Ryari and Quagmire who is also kiting it)
We were using frostbolts for snaring.
4 on a elementals in a quadrant each (Sammael, Bralkur, Susanne, Inudian)
2 on assisting on elementals, one on each side (Elmindreda, Morghus)
I cant really answer for the healing assignments as I wasnt involved in creating the strategy for that.
Now I know we are definitely having issues with both killing Tainted elementals (althought I think thats improving) and in particular handling cores.
What concerns me though is what seems to be fairly low dps for our casters.
I'd really appreciate comments/advice, anything you can think of would be helpful.
Looks to me like the only problem your having is threat issues. 2 rogues dying from hatefuls and a warlock pulling aggro?
If this is the case, just remember to give them BoS and make sure warlocks soul shatter and rogues vanish at appropriate times -- appropriate being 20% or if the OT dodges a couple hatefuls and doesnt have the rage to keep up his threat.
Your melee and your OT need to improve on Gruul a bit. Your enhance shaman dodged a Hateful Strike and ate another, which led to a death. Looks like he ankhed and then died again to a 5 stack Shatter. So either your OT died or wasn't generating enough threat, and your melee are not doing a very good job of avoiding shatters.
Thanks for pointing that out, the enhance shaman should definitely not eat any Hateful Strikes and since he did and the OT didn't die untill the end of the fight, I'm guessing the OT needs to work on his aggro generation a bit. About the shatters, yeah we need to work on that as well. Not sure if it really shows that well, but I think certain individuals have problems with Cave Ins as well, Team Speak is always filled with "X move out of the damn Cave In, don't just stand there and take it"
Originally Posted by Malan
His Totem Relic choice on the Armory right now is a healing totem - if that's really the case he needs to improve that for raids ASAP because that is really not helping him out. (Hint - Heroic Mana Tombs) He needs to remove all those +Hit gems he has and replace them with +Str or +Str/Crit gems, he has plenty of +Hit right now to play around with. If he was using that -Threat trinket on the Gruul kill, really not needed considering his DPS was pretty moderate, he should be using a DPS trinket instead. (That particular trinket only drops around 900 threat on a 2 min cooldown, not very good!)
Thanks, I'm not sure what trinkets/totem he used during this particular fight, but I'll definitely talk to him about that and switching out his +Hit gems as soon as possible.
Originally Posted by Advice
Looks to me like the only problem your having is threat issues. 2 rogues dying from hatefuls and a warlock pulling aggro?
If this is the case, just remember to give them BoS and make sure warlocks soul shatter and rogues vanish at appropriate times -- appropriate being 20% or if the OT dodges a couple hatefuls and doesnt have the rage to keep up his threat.
We ran with 3 paladins this night so everyone (that should have it) got BoS, not sure if they vanish/soul shatter though. We do tend to run in to threat issues from time to time on different encounters, most of the times I think it's just pure negligence to KTM rather than our MTs doing a bad job.
Last edited by Leene : 07/02/07 at 7:41 PM.
Reason: Keeping the replies in one post rather than making a second one
[/quote]We ran with 3 paladins this night so everyone (that should have it) got BoS, not sure if they vanish/soul shatter though. We do tend to run in to threat issues from time to time on different encounters, most of the times I think it's just pure negligence to KTM rather than our MTs doing a bad job.
[/quote]
As I read the log, the rogues both died around the same time so my best guess is that they out-stripped the OT and took hatefuls. Easiest way to combat this is to just make sure your OT is calling out if he dodges a hateful. Also, it could help him if you put him in the same group with the enhancement shaman for windfury and giving the rogues BS.
Also the best OT for this fight is a druid, less mitigation and more HP than a warrior so he will get more rage and be able to survive longer.
Now I know we are definitely having issues with both killing Tainted elementals (althought I think thats improving) and in particular handling cores.
What concerns me though is what seems to be fairly low dps for our casters.
The thing that really pops out at me is what your casters are hitting. Your strider guys are doing almost no damage to the Elites, they're doing 90-100% of their damage to striders. Now, the Elite spawns first. And when the guy kiting the Strider grabs it, he still needs some time to build threat on it before you can go all-out. During that time, Strider DPS should nuke the Elite. It's stationary, it's being tanked. The key to high DPS on Vashj for ANY role (but especially casters) is to be nuking at all times. If you're on Elementals and run out of live spawns, turn and nuke a Strider for a couple seconds. If a Strider just spawned, nuke an Elite until aggro's secure enough to start burning it. Any time you spend not actively casting a spell is wasted. The melee do so well because they ALWAYS have something to hit, whether it's Vashj or an Elite or the occasional loose elemental. Your caster DPS can be much more efficient (and their presence is suffering as a result).
If a good soul could have a look at our sad attempt on Void Reaver (actually it was decent but we lacked DPS) and make some suggestions what can be improved especially in DPS department. Mind you i guess it iwll be a lot of errors and mistakes to point out. so beware
If a good soul could have a look at our sad attempt on Void Reaver (actually it was decent but we lacked DPS) and make some suggestions what can be improved especially in DPS department. Mind you i guess it iwll be a lot of errors and mistakes to point out. so beware
First thing I notice is that you don't have a shadow priest, that alone is huge for your caster dps. 15% extra dmg for your locks and 5% for your mage is pretty huge, not to mention the mana and hp regen they provide, also it looks like your mage isn't getting coe yet he is still out dpsing all the locks, that is pretty sad. Investing in a enhance shaman for your melee would probably help allot too as would replacing some of the hunters with higher dps class, and that MS warriors dps is really really sad.
07/02/07, 12:16 PM
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