Trouble

We were getting ready to drop SSC and TK but for the moment we decided against it. We pushed hard to get both cleared in one night and did it tuesday so they escaped the death sentence for now. We can clear them in a day, Hyjal in a day, and BT through Reliquary in a day so that leaves two days out of our five day raiding schedule for progression which is a good fit for us.

It's almost that collector/pack rat mentality that keeps people excited to do SSC and TK for us I think. Those choice items, like Tsunami talisman. Or getting two peace tier 5 for our arcane mages (HORRIBLE luck we've had with T5 drops, massive defender drops), 4 piece tier 5 for our pallies, etc. I know they won't make or break the progression, we've already passed any gear check that might exist in BT, but people enjoy it. I mean hell, what good is Tier 6 once you defeat Illidan? It's sort of the same idea, there's no REAL reason to do it, but the collection aspect or perfection of your character. Anyway, it's enough to keep people playing top notch in SSC and TK just as much as they do in BT. Whatever works.

On a side note, SSC and TK are making a fortune for our guild bank. 40k+ gold made selling patterns and nether vortexes. It's not like it used to be before when everyone needed mass potions, but it's still nice to be able to hand our infinite mana pots, fel mana pots, haste potions, flasks, etc so people in the guild get a nice break from the farming we did way back when. It's also nice to be able to hand out goodies like expensive Blessings cards to people just because we have so much gold that we can't spend it all.

 

◊ Quigon

Just a quick question. I got saber lashed tonight for 24k without a knockback, without anything abnormal happening. Both tanks were standing right on top of me, one feral tauren, one orc warrior, and me as a tauren. I've since taken deviate fish, but is that just a bug? Our targeting reticules were superimposed.

Anyway, the shahraz fight isn't that bad - but could use some tuning obviously.

 

Stormheart

After working in BT a bit, i have to re-assess my earlier statement on teron. Teron is fairly weaksauce when you take 8 healers, so is clearly worth doing over archi. Out of curiousity, knowing what some of you know now, what would you say about RoS vs. Archimonde? We got to p2 of RoS in 3 tries, but basically we were just testing it out and not expecting to make real progress since it was winding down the last hour of the raid. It seems like a challenging fight, but at the same time we've heard endless nightmare horror stories about archimonde.

 

Lila

If you have a lot of shamans; go Archimonde. If not you might as well work on Reliquary.

 

• Fogbug

this happened to us on our first pull. I think shahraz will stop at the very edge of your hitbox, so her lash will reach you but not the other two tanks. have them stand a little forward

or just use deviates, that's what we always do now I think

 

Amera

Nothing has ever indicated that Black Temple is anything but the last raid instance of TBC. The entire premise of the expansion is a build up to kill Illidan. I find it unlikely there will be any serious raid content before the next expansion, aka next year, at the earliest. I assume you will see Zul'Aman in August, the new arena season in Oct (with T6 clone gear), and some other class review patch with mostly 5man or solo content in there somewhere. Maybe Blizzcon will shatter this hypothesis, but I have no idea what they would add to the TBC since all the lore is wrapped up at this point.

Aren't any Illidan-killing guilds worried they will have massive attrition in the next 5-6 months while they just farm and wait for content? I'm sure Zulaman will be well-made, but it is only 10 man and will likely be cleared the week it is released, if not a few days after, by most T6 guilds.

 

dukes

Yes, that's what's happening. We used to just have the OT's forward of the MT and then have him step into them, but we've just been using deviates for the last 3 or 4 kills as it makes it more reliable.

As for SSC/TK - we've just done Hyjal and BT up to (but not including) Illidan in two days. We probably could've done the whole lot, but screwed up on a few fights (wipe to Akama! I blame the mage who disconnected). It certainly seems like it's worth dropping SSC and TK until you get BT done fully - the gear isn't necessary to kill the bosses, and you'll get more return out of doing the bosses and the trash in between in BT (trash epics/hearts/rep ftw). If you're up to the point where you can do Hyjal and all of BT now, there's very little in the other instances that is a significant upgrade on the items available.

It's always possible half the guild will go inactive in the period between now and the next expansion - some people have other plans (playing alliance PvP on other servers, PvPing on our own server, playing other games) that will keep them busy in the meantime. I doubt there'll be any serious attrition due to everyone knowing each other quite well and so keeping in contact on Ventrilo/forums even if they do disappear for a bit to play other games. I'm sure people will continue to play alts, raid the days we decide to do instances, and enjoy the time off. We've been raiding for at least 4 days a week, up to 7 at times and I'm sure people will appreciate a bit of time off. I'll certainly appreciate the time to play World in Conflict, and if it's out before the next expansion Starcraft 2 as well.

We can always hope for some decent info to come out at Blizzcon for what's going on in terms of "new stuff".

 

◊ Quigon

It feels like we wipe more to akama than anything before shahraz. That pretty much sums up a farm night for us. I remember in Naxx we could one shot everything through kel'thuzad yet wipe on grobbulus. Good times. Although, I think the reason we wiped on Grobbulus is the same reason I dread farming SSC/TK25.

 

Mondragon

Why is it my guild can oneshot 4 bosses in Hyjal, and all the way up to Teron...but Archi/Gurtogg, though close/Souls are just too far?

Possibly we spread ourselves too thinly on focus for each one ( the reason I am in this thread )

http://hosted.filefront.com/mrpboy/ - My WoW PVE Movies. SSC/TK/BT

 

• Chicken

That sounds hauntingly familiar. I even have a macro that's basically "/rw Okay guys I know %t is an easy boss, but he won't die if you don't make any effort whatsoever". It's always the easy bosses that seem to cause the most problems on farm nights.

 

◊ Quigon

Well, the first 3 bosses in BT are easier than trash in most other zones.
Hyjal bosses are just as simple, but learning the trash IS the fight - and very repeatable. Teron and bloodboil are where things get a little bit more difficult. Thankfully though, every BT fight up to Shahraz is extremely repeatable, and execution and player skill trumps any randomness. And supposedly Illdari and Illidan are relatively straightforward for repeat kills as well.

But if you can kill kael'thas, you can beat this game. Most guilds spend more time and effort on him than any other boss in BC.

I don't get why you'd be stuck on RoS either - its really a rather simple fight once you understand the mechanics and have a decent strategy for interrupts/backup (if you kill phase 2 cleanly you basically win - and you should kill phase 2 "cleanly" anytime you don't let back to back interrupts get through).

 

Mondragon

Spread too thinly I guess. We havent done more than 2 hours on it..but it felt like head banging. Ignore me im just being emo, its Friday and I have nothing to do at work all day. Gurtogg we are much closer.

I also have a nagging feeling that a combination of summer and these tricky fights will leave us being overgeared for the fights after it. Honestly not something I would prefer.

Curse that Archimonde though. no FW priests and not enough people have trinket yet ( myself included) ..just cant see it.

( and yeh Kaelthas was our biggest challenge yet, maybe 5 nights on him, two other guilds on our server just got him down 8+ weeks after we got him. Finally they get the reward bosses)

http://hosted.filefront.com/mrpboy/ - My WoW PVE Movies. SSC/TK/BT

 

Edgewalker

Blizzard has hinted at it pretty strongly, and they even built it into current progression...

"Progress
You heard my call? Yes...
Completion
<A'dal's thoughts intermingle with your own.>

The sphere... Strange. Did you know that he lived? Yes. It is here - in the sphere itself. Maimed for certain. He calls to a higher power now. No, not Illidan.

Higher.

Kil'jaeden the Deceiver comes...

Not here...

<A'dal points your mind elsewhere.>

Azeroth. Unknown."

 

Rasputin

None of this requires that the Kil'Jaeden encounter be included in a TBC patch. It could easily be in the next expansion.

 

Urraca

Is anyone getting weird bursts out of nowhere form Anetheron? (or has he always been like that?)

My guild has the trash mastered, then 2x times last night, the MT just got rocked--and no it's not gear, Teron isn't even a problem. He seems easy enough, on our first real attempt ever we got him to 45% (MT death) and really just have to adjust our positioning.

it would go something like this:

19:53:19 - Anetheron hits you for 5300 (you block 580)
19:53:20 - You parry
19:53:21 - Anetheron hits you for 5800 (block x)
19:53:21 - Anetheron hits you for 5400 (block x)
19:53:23 - Anetheron hits you for 5700 (block x)

Oh what is also fun is wiping because the Knights try attack and tank one of the adds in the middle of the melee group with zero time to escape/kite it over to the OT.

 

◊ Praetorian

NPCs hitting Anetheron from the front and causing parry chains?

That's not the NPCs' fault, that's your fault for not having the Infernal-targeted person run out of the clump and towards a tank ASAP.

 

Russta

I have no idea how wrong or right I am but I simply put what I percieved as weird damage spikes on Anetheron down to the NPC's attacking him from the front. Can they be parried and cause swing timer resets in the same way any player can be?

 

• Vykromond

Yes. The Juggernaut guys were very put out when Orc Peon wiped them on Azgalor, if I recall correctly.

 

Urraca

Yeah, we assumed it was parry chains as well. So what is the best solution to counteract the npcs from attacking from the front?

 

◊ Praetorian

Position him such that no NPCs are in front of him? If any are, drag him back a bit so that they're behind him. Much easier to do this with Anetheron than with, say, Azgalor, who is the size of a small building.

 

Urraca

I dunno, that strategy sounds incredibly complex and difficult. Got something easier?

 

Flamingcloud

What are some minimum numbers for doing Winterchill the first time? (in terms of tanks, healers, cc, aoe, dps, etc and overall)

 

• Shifft

If you play really well I'd say 5 healers, 3 tanks (for the trash) and the rest DPS. CC's relatively unnecessary for Rage waves, but a mage or two to sheep necromancers can't hurt, and bring at least 2-3 rogues. 20 people would be a good lower limit for raid size.

Edit: Funny how we said pretty much the exact same thing

 

◊ Praetorian

If you have like 20 people who were competent enough to kill Kael and are Hyjal-attuned, you can do Winterchill. He himself can probably be 10-manned with a few good healers. The trash before him will take ~20+. If you have 3 people who can tank things, a few priests, 5-6 healers, and any other warm bodies, you're fine.

 

Schneeb

Taking 20 to the boss wouldnt be a problem, however the waves are going to have a severe learning curve with limited dps - have fun trying though (it wont be fun at all!)