One of my recent stupid things was my usual flight off the aldor platform, divebombing towards the ground. On the way down there was a nagging voice at the back of my head telling me that there was something not quite right.
Turns out it is important to distinguish between a bear and a netherdrake.
Which puts me in mind of the guy in our guild who enjoyed jumping off the Aldor platform and shifting into flight form on the way down. If you think distinguishing between a bear and a netherdrake is important, let me tell you - it's not as important as distinguishing between a druid and a hunter.
Which puts me in mind of the guy in our guild who enjoyed jumping off the Aldor platform and shifting into flight form on the way down. If you think distinguishing between a bear and a netherdrake is important, let me tell you - it's not as important as distinguishing between a druid and a hunter.
To top off the tales of aldor rise... when respeccing from feral to moonkin (Gotta do something to keep badgeazhan from getting boring), Ctrl+F5 becomes the hotkey for moonkin.
Not a stupid thing per se, but speaking up in vent when your new guild apparently thinks you're the splitting image (voice?) of Dives (the Onyxia Wipe video guy) wasn't one of my better moments.
Attempting to do Gruul without a mage tank. Also, having two paladin MT's and not enough hunters to give Misdirects all around.
Needless to say, it was a night of frustrating wipes, and I'm still not sure why I didn't just call it when I saw we didn't have a mage that was geared enough to tank.
A few months ago we were doing Maulgar without our usual feral tank for Kiggler. No problem, we have plenty of hunters. I ask two of them to tank Kiggler, and they're a bit nervous, but they agree.
A few seconds into the fight both hunters are dead and we wipe. It turns out the hunters didn't realize they could tank at range, and were actually meleeing to keep his attention on them. Thanks for researching the fight guys!
Turns out it's possible for the tornadoes during the Eagle phase on Zul'jin to knock you out of the platform if you jump at the right (wrong?) time down the stairs.
Yea...
You pay for the whole chair, but you only need the edge.
We have an officer in our guild who tends to be a bit ... different. He can be partially excused because, although most of our guild is from the midwestern US, he is from Quebec and his primary language is French. He has a tendency to be very reckless in our raids, which usually earns him the ire of most of the group. On Prince last night, though, he totally took the cake. On our first attempt, he fell over dead at some point - which was understandable to us, because we had terribad infernal drops and we wiped pretty hard in P1. I made the comment about having to shift him to the left a couple of feet (towards the raid in our setup), and told the raid that they would have to cram in closer to the door in order to still outrange the shadow nova if I did that. The following exchange then took place:
Frenchy: Wait, does that mean I am supposed to run towards healers?
Me: Uhh, yes.... You've done this fight before, you know this.
Frenchy: Oh. Well, I was standing on other side of him, so I ran in other direction and I still died.
Me: /facepalm
Today, we've been continueing our efforts to clear Zul'aman with our fresh guild (and succeeded, yay).
However, somehow, on Jan'Alai, our hunter kept dying on the bombs.
It looked more or less like this:
First hatchers - hunter puts down trap
Dragonhawks - Hunter runs around
First Bombs - Hunter dies
Battleres - Hunter takes it
Flame Breath - Hunter dies
Battleres 2 - Hunter takes it
Dragonhawks 2 - Hunter manages to live
Bombs 2 - Hunter dies.
Made up gor a good laugh. Next time I'll make sure he gets an SS.
Afterwards, we shifted the raid a bit to accomodate for connection problems, and proceeded for Hex Lord Malacress. This was our second night on him with this guild, and half of the people had never been there. This is the result
A 1 shot indeed.
Afterwards the raid proceeded to 2 shot Zul'jin. setting our progression a step forward.
A few months ago we were doing Maulgar without our usual feral tank for Kiggler. No problem, we have plenty of hunters. I ask two of them to tank Kiggler, and they're a bit nervous, but they agree.
A few seconds into the fight both hunters are dead and we wipe. It turns out the hunters didn't realize they could tank at range, and were actually meleeing to keep his attention on them. Thanks for researching the fight guys!
I would have thought that assuming people who aren't exactly confident know what they're meant to do and not actually explaining it to them would come under the "stupid things raid leaders do" section.
Had a pretty amusing misunderstanding this weekend. Joined a Kara group that had just finished Chess for a shot at the Mindblade off Prince. We wipe on attempt 1 due to an infernal on the tank right when phase 2 started. I'd moved a ways away from the door in anticipation of the tank moving there.
Me: "Hmmmmmmm, I may have to run."
*silence, everyone but me rezzed*
Me: "Hey, see if I'm in range for a rez."
RL: "Dude you're leaving anyways just release and get out of our instance"
Me: "Oh?"
Me: "OH!"
Me: "I meant run as in release and run back, not run as in leave after 1 attempt."
Much laughter, got him on next try. No Mindblade though
Well, here we go with another one from my lovely guild: yesterday we had an unscheduled ZA "speed run" (for us a speed run means 3 timed chests since the only T5 items people have are shoulders, the rest is in T4/Badges gear). I grabbed 2 fresh recruits to see them in action.
Anyway, Eagle went well and Bear died so we had about 18 minutes left on the timer. Plenty of time for a 3rd chest, right? Well, no, not if you had a tank die at the end of the Bear boss and the freshly recruited resto shaman manages to cast Ancestral Recall instead of Ancestral Spirit.
Oh well, two chests are better than none and it was still a nice and easy clear afterwards.
[10:05:49] <Nat> how do u know if a unicorn is a virgin?
I would have thought that assuming people who aren't exactly confident know what they're meant to do and not actually explaining it to them would come under the "stupid things raid leaders do" section.
I'll have to second this one very strongly.
I make an effort to read up on bosses and raids when I get invited as I am a little overgeared for my guild (which is just learning Kara) and have earned invites to Gruul's/Mag's and ZA from people I first met in PuGs and now group with on a regular basis.
Without a doubt the best runs are the ones where the Raid Leader explains the fight first. There's a big difference between saying "do you know this fight?" and actually describing what happens and what is expected of people. This is especially true in my experience, which is in early 25-mans and Kara, where a guild will often bring in a few people at the last minute and wipes can be frustrating because people assume things will be easy and are known by everyone.
Running right past Krosh Firehand and dieing to his Fire Blast might usually qualify as a stupid thing, but what if you have never done Gruul's before and the raid leader did not bother to remind you and the various PuGgers not to go near him? A warlock guildie of mine did this the other day - ran after a felpuppy to enslave it and died to Fire Blast. He did an excellent job overall but having not been told to avoid running through that spot he contributed to that wipe by dieing early and making it more difficult to keep the fel puppies under control. His fault or the raid leader's?
My own stupidity at the beginning, but it ends up rather humorous. I was healer leader for this run.
Pull goes off for Maulgar without a hitch. Blind-Eye is just falling when a mistake in my assignments comes to light. I had accidentally assigned only Druid healers to our mage-tank, and the incredibly spiky nature of the damage he takes makes this less than optimal. Anyway, one too many shots goes through, and the mage-tank drops as the raid starts to take on Olm.
What is interesting to note here is that I had been standing nearby, having assigned myself to heal Maulgar's tank (I outgear the place, just there to help others). That, combined with the occasional hain Heal thrown into the raid, was sufficient for me to be second on Krosh Firehand's aggro list. Sounds like a recepe for disaster, right? Well, not quite. I am 8/0/53, the 8 is specifically to get the Elemental Warding talent. Combined with a 9.5k health pool, I was JUST able to soak the attacks. Say what you will, my guild's healers are VERY fast to react, so I found myself the effective mage-tank until Krosh went down. Whatever works, I guess, and it makes me wonder if bringing a high-geared Elemental Shaman would obviate the need for mages there
To teach and to learn, to laugh and make others laugh. This is my purpose, and any day in which I don't wasn't worth the time it took to get through.
the freshly recruited resto shaman manages to cast Ancestral Recall instead of Ancestral Spirit.
I used to have these buttons next to each other. I never had any trouble, until one night in Kara, I ported myself instead of resurrecting our feral tank after Netherspite. Then later in the week, he was on his warlock alt, and I ninja'd out after a BM run instead of bringing him back. It was embarrassing enough that I finally moved Recall to my Professions bar.
Turns out it's possible for the tornadoes during the Eagle phase on Zul'jin to knock you out of the platform if you jump at the right (wrong?) time down the stairs.
This can happen if you're standing right in front of the fire wall, too. I don't think it's someone's fault when they get kicked out, but maybe I'm just saying that because I'm the only one it's happened to in our ZA raids.
That said, the first time this happened to me, we had a wipe at 1%, because I was too stupid to say anything. We were using three healers that night, but the priest kept trying to heal me, and after we died I got a nice "VIRGO WHERE WERE YOU, I COULDN'T SEE YOU" in /rw.
So we're cooking right along in ZA; it's farmed to the point that except for one or two elusive drops (the tanking shield, for instance), the only reason people are there now is the quest for the bear mount and badges. First two bosses go down, Recount shows me at >1900 DPS for both the first two fights. We get to Dragonhawk, with plenty of time, and we just *know* it's our week. I throw on my Dragonhawk killing outfit, which basically has about four pieces of FR (so I don't freakin' DIE to stupid hawks), we proceed to murder the boss, and have a good 15 minutes on the clock. Just enough time, right? Not quite. We end up failing with about 1.5 minutes left, and I check Recount. Only 1340 or so DPS. And that just seems odd, because we've killed him under 4 minutes before...and I should have had a way higher DPS for the fight.
It's not until we come back from popping all the chests and the frogs that I realized something...you guessed it, for Lynx and his trash, I still had my Dragonhawk outfit on. Erg.
Last night we were supposed to clear Hyjal, only we didn't have quite the right balance of classes, so our RL called for us to go to BT instead. Since I'm the only person that has the ability to neck out to BT, I pop on my Medallion and get my ass out there so I can help summon.
Fast forward ~20 minutes or so, we get to Naj, so I swap out one of my dps trinkets for a stam one. Got Naj down, in an uncharacteristically messy show, and head on to a clean one shot of Supremus. So far so good, right?
Port up for Akama, someone forgets that the mobs aren't friendly until AFTER you down Akama, and cue a partial wipe. I get a hearth off to avoid dura, and go to equip my neck so I can get back quickly-- Only to discover that not only hase it been equipped since before I even entered the instance (meaning I was ~1% undercapped), but that I'm still wearing [Commendation of Kael'thas] as well.
It's not until we come back from popping all the chests and the frogs that I realized something...you guessed it, for Lynx and his trash, I still had my Dragonhawk outfit on. Erg.
Our paladin tank has been guilty of this before. Typically someone notices during the Lynx fight.
"Gosh, Faryal, Halazzi's fire attacks seem to be doing less damage to you than usual. Why is that?"
You know the old saying, "You don't know what you have until it's gone?" Yeah, we had a case of that last night. Our boomkin class lead stepped out of our Kara farm raid last night to bring in one of our lesser-geared boomkins for raid experience and gear. She just happened to step out for the Maiden fight, which - unbeknownst to most of us, except for me and a couple of others - she usually spends about half her time tossing random heals on people to keep them topped up until the priest could dispel Holy Fire. In retrospect, it wasn't the wisest choice - we ended the fight with three people alive, all paladins.
Without a doubt the best runs are the ones where the Raid Leader explains the fight first. There's a big difference between saying "do you know this fight?" and actually describing what happens and what is expected of people. This is especially true in my experience, which is in early 25-mans and Kara, where a guild will often bring in a few people at the last minute and wipes can be frustrating because people assume things will be easy and are known by everyone.
Running right past Krosh Firehand and dieing to his Fire Blast might usually qualify as a stupid thing, but what if you have never done Gruul's before and the raid leader did not bother to remind you and the various PuGgers not to go near him? A warlock guildie of mine did this the other day - ran after a felpuppy to enslave it and died to Fire Blast. He did an excellent job overall but having not been told to avoid running through that spot he contributed to that wipe by dieing early and making it more difficult to keep the fel puppies under control. His fault or the raid leader's?
While I'm usually one to endorse the saying "There's enough blame to go around", I'm afraid I sympathize more with the OP than your ilk. While I'm sure you and 1000 of your friends all see WoW as this new and exciting place of magical joy and mystery, there are a vast number of people that can 8-man Karazhan faster than most full PuGs. These people have been playing for more than a year and have actually made it their personal mission to make themselves better players. They read fights on WoWWiki and fill in gaps in knowledge with questions and learning. They take pride in being competent and savvy. So when they enter something as basic as the nerfed Magtheridon and Gruul's fights, it seems almost given to these people that they will accomplish their mission.
Here's the hitch: there are endless supplies of "infiltrators" that manage to wheedle their way into the 24th or 25th slot in a PuG of dedicated players without knowing anything about the game. They have either been carried or handed equipment by guildies or well-meaning friends or they simply roam around BGs collecting welfare. During the course of the PuG, these infiltrators attempt to keep up all appearances that they are competent and know what's going on. Then when the fight goes down, they pray that they'll be able to sort of figure things out as they go along or just bumble through a half-assed participation. Then when the raid wipes, they don't tell anybody about problems they were having or things that went wrong so that they can be corrected, they simply stay silent and permit the raid to suffer from "ghost" problems. In other words, that the kill isn't occurring because of some phantom failure that is hard to track down with everybody saying "I dunno, I did my job". This is especially problematic with DPS classes.
So when this raid leader assigns two hunters a task, it was the HUNTERS job to say that they didn't know anything about the fight and they weren't competent enough to perform the task they were given. Of course, they're not going to say that because they are hoping that whatever job they were given is easy enough that they can collect their purples without anybody noticing they didn't know what the hell they were doing. It's not terribly pompous for a raid leader to assume that people know the ridiculously easy Mag / Gruul fights by now, given the nerfs and how long they've been up. But there's no way for the raid leader to distinguish a casual 70 that can play from a brand new 70 main that doesn't know shit from shineola, short of telling everyone in the PuG to fill out a 6 page questionnaire.
If a raid leader assigns me to tank Brutallus, I'm going to tell him that I can't not only because of my inexperience, but that I am the wrong class to be doing so. I'm not going to say "Uh, OK...heh heh" and play along because I want to be there for looting. Blaming raid leaders for PuGs not knowing what the hell they're doing is ridiculous and a reflection of a "victims first" ideology. These infiltrator's phantom slots ruin PuGs over and over. If you truly want to join a PuG to "learn" Mag and Gruuls on 24 other people's dime, simply announce it to a badge farming Raid beforehand and see how long you last. Otherwise, read up on the fight, ask questions, join PuGs for gearing, and don't take major roles under the guise of a competent member of the raid. At least then you can function as a half-man instead of simply filling a slot, putting out 200dps, and rolling on loot.
Remember, if you're not bringing experience, savvy, or organizational skills to a raid, you're basically mooching. Don't act like participation counts as equal on all levels. DPS / HPS meters were invented for a reason.
It's the raidleader's job to make sure people know what they're doing. This is one of the signs of a good raidleader. I'm not sure what would inspire the hunters to go melee, though, seems very counter-intuitive.
But this is pretty off-topic.
"Any sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from malice."
- Clark's Law
Without a doubt the best runs are the ones where the Raid Leader explains the fight first.
When you've done the fight dozens of times, you may change your tune when you realize 1/3 of your night is being wasted on the raid leader explaining the fight to the couple of people too lazy to ready wowwiki or whatever and have even the slightest clue what they're doing.
It's not the raid leader's responsibility to explain the fight. It's the raid leaders responsibility to tell you before hand what strat they will be running and where to read up on it. It's your responsibility from there.
I formed an alt ZA yesterday, before the main raid. All was looking well, the group formed quite fast. Our alt runs often get bears too, so there is typically enough interest for a half decent raid. It then dawned on me that the speed that the raid formed might not be so good.
I had just finished 5 runs of Deadmines for a Defias Rapier to go with my new Bloodsail set. (the Rapier is a 3% chance drop off of only 2 mobs in the instance). Unbeknownst to me, raid instances suffer the same 5/hour limit that 5 mans do. I was annoyed to say the least, my mage is still in half blues and half badge/heroic items, ZA (plus a chance of a bear) would be a gold mine! So I sucked it up and just logged onto my main so I wouldnt keep the raid waiting.
"You have entered too many instances recently", while I was on my main! Sure enough, it's account based.
20 minutes later, and I join my patient raid group who had been playing god-knows-what games inside the ZA foyer. In the end we were 1 minute too slow on the bear... I DC'ed on the Dragonhawk boss, which caused some instability I guess, as one of our healers died and they ended up killing it with only a rogue/warlock/mage/Spirit of Redemption alive. I didnt feel like the model raider, thats for sure.
05/22/08, 3:01 PM
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