Nurru

I realize they change their mind sometimes, but didn't they solemnly swear this would never happen and that Mages needed to suck it up and value spirit?

< Aislinana> Why would it be my job to sleep with vontre? Don't I have standards?

 

Brute

An idea would be to give it the same sort of cooldown debuff on the recipient that PW:S has.

 

Tempestra

Beaten to the punch on more mage changes. Sorry.

 

◊ Vectivus

This was spoken to specifically at the Class review panel at BlizzCon. We knew the Pain Suppression change was coming - in the beginning, it was actually going to remain 60%, and be reduced to a 1-minute cooldown.



Also, just found this:

No more Mage coefficient nerf.

WoW Forums -> What is in store for 2.3? Cherry pie Here!

 

• constantius

The implication I saw for the Pain Suppression change was *very* long-term ... more like a WotLK thing, not a "oh, just around the corner". It's a needed change, I agree - I'm just shocked that for once, they did something intelligent as a change to a top-tier talent in a priest tree. I'm looking forward to playing with it in Arenas ... I normally go 44/17/0 for 2v2, and having a *targetable* Pain Suppression is going to be oh-so-much-fun.

 

Keline

Said the guy with the 15 second snare without DRs? This is bringing frost shock on par with every other snare in the game. It was the very only snare with DRs, this change makes perfect sense in one way.

I don't get why they're throwing ALL these positive information at us the day the previous patch went live. Many of these changes can't be too hard to code and clearly could have made it in 2.2

 

Smd

I agree, the first thing I thought of when I saw that was how easy it will be to trivialize Kael's Pyroblasts with 2 disc priests, 5% threat reduction/minute is hardly anything serious.

 

Natural

Why 4? The cooldown is 2 minutes and the duration is 8 seconds.

 

Igniter

Something for our misery.

 

Kasi

Kind of sad to see no help for elemental shamans here. Perhaps I'm not seeing it in people's parses of fights, but it seems like right now enhancement and elemental shamans are pretty much neck and neck, with maybe enhancement a bit ahead because of the abundance of melee friendly fights coming out now. Also depends on if enhancement shamans now are capped because of threat or because of abilities/gear.

 

Gonkish

While the Frost Shock change is undoubtedly awesome for Enhance PvP, I'm going to weep if Hunters don't get some way of dealing with endless snare spam.

Nerf Draenei please!

Why Hunters suffer...
Benefactor's Bar learns you some goodness quicklike...

 

ceoc

Today Drysc post the upcoming changes for rogue class regarding pvp arena mobility:

"
Q u o t e:
Yeah Drysc, what is it? Tell us!

Do you mean the amazing change to Shadowstep so that it can now be used at any time, not only while stealthed? In addition, after use of Shadowstep threat caused by the next Ambush, Garrote or Backstab will be reduced by 50%. The cooldown will however be increased to 40seconds.

Also on the Subtlety front is a change to Dirty Deeds so that it will also be increasing damage of special attacks by 10/20% against targets that are below 35% health.

We're also taking a look at bumping up Hemorrhage a bit, but no details yet on what that may be."

Source: WoW Forums -> Mobility change?


I really like the Dirty Deeds change, Shadowstep and threat relation is kind of weird imo...

 

• constantius

Tanks don't insta-gib every 10 seconds on any given fight. Take (for example) Morogrim Tidewalker, in T4 gear, as an example.

When is he going to nuke the tank's face? Every time Earthquake goes off, and eats up all of his shield block charges, and he then proceeds to double-crush. That's going to hurt. Nothing else really matters. So burn Pain Suppression on every earthquake (if you had 4 priests, as Gurg suggested), and you trivialize the healing.

No boss hits super-super-hard all the time without some mechanic to make sure it isn't heal-able. And if you can trivialize their specials (like Broodlord's Mortal Strike mechanic) by burning a 2-minute cooldown for your tank ... over and over ... you reduce a ton of the healing load.

Or are you saying that when your tank takes 2 straight 8k hits, there's not enough reaction time to hit the Pain Suppression before he takes yet another hit? Just wait for the spike, and use it. And save the tank.

And I believe the point about 4 priests was just to ensure you had the cooldown every 30 seconds, which is roughly the time between "OH SHIT" moments while tank-healing, give or take.

 

◊ Vectivus

Well, holy hell, they're just going all-out:

WoW Forums -> Sunder Armor: NEGATIVE Threat?

 

Maikel

I would be psyched to see the Retribution changes in 2.3, especially since the word on the street is that it will be next month.

Some nice Retribution talent spec changes would be similar to the Shaman talent tree changes such as the passive 30% threat reduction, 30%(?) damage reduction, and coupling that with the apparent six second Crusader Strike and avoiding further speculation, might see Paladins as a more viable DPS support class.

I'm getting excited about these blue posts for 2.3!

 

• constantius

I think that's the point. They *know* they screwed up with 2.2, and the insane amount of time it took to go live because they insisted on getting the sound system integrated with everything else (like hotfixable boss mechanics ... gg). They're trying to make up for it by playing a big PR game, and ensuring us all that *big* changes will happen in 2.3 ... keep playing, we love you, don't take your money away!

There have been appearance in almost all class forums in the last 24 hours, hyping the new changes, and pushing how awesome 2.3 will be. I really hope they pull it off and actually release a good, solid, tested, balanced patch, for once in their WoW careers.

 

Natural

Here are some quick rough numbers if you used 4 priests, suppression every cooldown staggered every 30 seconds (extreme case):

Assuming 1000 TPS and a 5 minute fight:

No suppression = ~300k threat
Chain suppression = ~230k threat (10 casts of suppression).

That's a 23% reduction in threat. If you extend this to a 10 minute fight, the gap widens to 39% threat reduction. This is because a pain suppression later on in the fight affects the total threat significantly.

It will be amazingly useful, especially in burst damage like Kael's pyroblast, however I do not think chain casting this on a MT is feasible in most situations.

Edit: Here's a graphical representation:

Using pain suppression to react to burst damage a few times in a fight is perfectly fine, but chain casting it has a noticeable impact.

 

MattHock

Official word on Mace Spec: Reduced stun chance, but increased rage generation
WoW Warrior Forums

 

rochan

They'll probably add some sort of Forbearance type debuff for Pain Suppression. But then again they might not have to because of the 5% threat loss.

 

SaintDemoniac

Warriors getting sunder armor effect added in with devastate

MS/Fury warriors getting additional threat from MS and Bloodfury in defensive stance, with Tactical Mastery

WoW Forums -> Sunder Armor: NEGATIVE Threat?

 

Trouble

There's a more complete list of changes being maintained here: WoW Forums -> 2.3 "Official" Patch Notes

 

• Maestroquark

Color me unimpressed with the Rogue changes.

Blind not costing a reagent? Good, about time. But it's going to be a complete physical attack, according to Kalgan. Not being cleansable is good, but it'll miss more often than it was previously cleansed. Dodge/Parry/Block, anyone?

Shadowstep out of stealth to improve mobility. Once every 40 seconds may or may not be enough. But it forces you to go 41 Subtlety. It prevents you from getting Quick Recovery. The threat change simply makes no sense at all. Shadowstep rogues don't raid.

Deadly Throw +1 seconds? I don't think it'll help that much. When I get in a kite it typically takes 2 long Deadly Throws or an extra short 3rd to break the kite. Now it'll still take ... 2 Deadly Throws, which requires a talent proccing.

I'm worried about Rogues becoming stronger in 2v2 and even weaker in 5v5.

What are you waiting for, a certain shade of green?

 

songster

I strongly suspect (part of) the intent is to trivialise existing content. There's more raid content coming, and they want to get people through the existing content.

 

Docjowles

It seems early to be passing judgement on these changes. The complete changelog for 2.3 is going to make 2.1's rather extensive notes look like a 3 page children's story .

 

Ghando

This is exactly why I blew off rumors of this change after Blizzcon. 40% is huge. Even if it's only an 8-second buff on a 2-minute cooldown, it still seems so powerful that they'd have to balance every single raid encounter around it. 5% is a completely trivial amount. I'm extremely skeptical of this making it as-is into the live version of 2.3.

Regarding the Frost Shock DR change...it's the only snare in the entire game that's subject to DR. Considering that a Shaman has no "escapes" of any kind whatsoever, they should never be able to get away from a melee class in the first place apart from some serious outside help.