EJ Forum Community - Zul'aman testing - Page 21

Darkrenown · 11/23/07, 11:44 PM

Originally Posted by Bliss

And that one isn't even a "you lose" timer. My group had a complete failure of a Dragonhawk kill last week, people standing in bombs, hatchers popping eggs during bombs, anything stupid you can think of, we did it. He enraged at like 5% but the 4 people left alive managed to take him down. He barely even seemed to hit the tank that much harder.

I think you're confusing the 5 min enrage with the 10 min berzerk. Enrage is + 50% damage. Berzerk is +500% damage and 200% haste. During his berzerk he hit me for 26k, which was a oneshot.

Edit: Amusingly, we have a hunter named Berzerk in our guild and he was a bit surprised when I shouted about how much "Berzerk" sucked over TS after that hit.

Rasputin · 11/24/07, 5:50 PM

Originally Posted by Darkrenown

I think you're confusing the 5 min enrage with the 10 min berzerk. Enrage is + 50% damage. Berzerk is +500% damage and 200% haste. During his berzerk he hit me for 26k, which was a oneshot.

Edit: Amusingly, we have a hunter named Berzerk in our guild and he was a bit surprised when I shouted about how much "Berzerk" sucked over TS after that hit.

I'm not sure if the ability is bugged or what, but we definitely ran into the 10 minute berserk timer on one of our first clears, and our tank shield walled, only to be hit for some 400, according to him. Shield wall dropped and he was still very healable and we won.

Tunch · 11/24/07, 7:13 PM

I don't think Dragonhawk has a berserk. I know Eagle does tho, 10 minutes.

Roe · 11/24/07, 7:48 PM

Originally Posted by Rasputin

I'm not sure if the ability is bugged or what, but we definitely ran into the 10 minute berserk timer on one of our first clears, and our tank shield walled, only to be hit for some 400, according to him. Shield wall dropped and he was still very healable and we won.

The idea is to make it a timed event. You either beat the boss before he goes into Berserk, or you die soon after.

I think it's probably working as intended if that is indeed what happened. But of course, now that I made my opinion public it won't be right. :P

Rasputin · 11/24/07, 11:40 PM

Originally Posted by Roe

The idea is to make it a timed event. You either beat the boss before he goes into Berserk, or you die soon after.

I think it's probably working as intended if that is indeed what happened. But of course, now that I made my opinion public it won't be right. :P

I think you're correct that the berserk is there to hardcap the event to prevent people from outlasting it and killing 3 egg spawns per hatcher wave. However, I've reached the 10 minute mark on some kills, and have yet to see the Dragonhawk gib the tank. The ability might be bugged or the timers may be wrong, but I haven't seen the dragonhawk do anything special after his 5 minute enrage.

Roywyn · 11/25/07, 6:46 AM

Originally Posted by Rasputin

I think you're correct that the berserk is there to hardcap the event to prevent people from outlasting it and killing 3 egg spawns per hatcher wave. However, I've reached the 10 minute mark on some kills, and have yet to see the Dragonhawk gib the tank. The ability might be bugged or the timers may be wrong, but I haven't seen the dragonhawk do anything special after his 5 minute enrage.

On one of our first pulls, we hit the 10-minute timer and he stomped our T6 tank with around 20k melee hits.
There definately is a "you-lose" berserk timer.

Roywyn · 11/26/07, 8:42 AM

Hex Lord Malacrass - does anyone have issues keeping the ogre add sheeped?

I've had an unhealthy amount of resists, even with more than enough spell it and CoS and a spell penetration enchant.

Worse was the constant random breaking of sheep.
I polymorphed him, ran away for max range - and he broke it to chase me before I could get in place.
I polymorphed him before, during and after the spirit volley, and of course during the normal phase, and he still came lose randomly.

After five tries, we decided to just kill him and keep the elemental add banished as well as possible.

Is anyone else having issues with polymorph breaking early, or getting resisted more often than it should?
Or were we just unlucky with constant breaking after around 10 seconds? Or is there a way to keep it better under control?

koaschten · 11/26/07, 8:48 AM

On one of our runs this week a mage was complaining about random breaking sheeps. We just adjusted so the priest was always close for fear or the paladin to throw a stun. Beside that, i would call it annoying at most.

Darkrenown · 11/26/07, 9:49 AM

Originally Posted by Roywyn

Hex Lord Malacrass - does anyone have issues keeping the ogre add sheeped?

Sheeping has seemed ok to me in our last 2 kills, but for added safety our hunters lay ice traps between the CCed adds and the raid. I normally go taunt them during the AoE too or ask the OT to do so.

Something I hadn't noticed before is that Zul'jin's bear phase can use overpower for ~6k after I dodge. I don't know why it wasn't a problem on our first two kills, but for our 3rd it seemed he was doing a lot more damage during that phase.

BFG · 11/26/07, 10:23 AM

Originally Posted by Tunch

I don't think Dragonhawk has a berserk. I know Eagle does tho, 10 minutes.

Dragonhawk absolutely does have a berserk. Yesterday I killed him in 10 minutes 3 seconds according to DBM addon, and right before the kill he oneshotted our Kara-geared MT with 20k hit.

Whiteknight · 11/26/07, 2:30 PM

Originally Posted by Roywyn

Is anyone else having issues with polymorph breaking early, or getting resisted more often than it should?

We had a similar problem with one of our runs - but on the shackle mob.

I just shield slammed it to put me high on the aggro list - from then on every time shackle broke, it ran across the room to me (tanking malacrass) instead of destroying the priest.

You might try a similar approach for the poly mob. Unless of course your tank is in any danger of dying on malacrass.

Nethris · 11/27/07, 2:16 AM

Originally Posted by Nosf

We've done 2 full clears with 2 healers in mostly kz/t4 gear. Our guild is very casual, so 3/6 and 2/4:

Me: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...runner&n=Mintu
Pallie: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...nner&n=Jorakai

Tank 1: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...n=Mightybeaver
Tank 2: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...nner&n=Tygrana

We missed the timed event both times (had not tried it on PTR before) - the first due to just learning the instance and the 2nd due to a miscommunication between me and the other healer costing us the tank on the bear during the silence.

Having a shadowpriest for both healers was key - a departure from 25's where we try to use the shadowpriests for dps. Most of us were using full consumables - and both Jorakai and I were chain-potting on everything but Bear and Eagle. I found mana to be less of an issue than pure healing output - especially on the bear, Hex Lord, and Zul'Jin p3/p4. The only time mana was an issue for either of us was coming into phase 4 on Zul'Jin (due to the shadowpriest not returning any mana over p3 and me being forced to swap to the melee group and drop healing stream instead of mana stream for p3 only).

To help with output on Bear, Lynx, and Hex Lord, I actually swapped out Alchemist's Stone for the Scarab, and used the spell haste cloak off Hex Lord on the second run. If you run 2 healers in t4, I'd strongly recommend some haste - the extra output made those fights much easier. If the healers are in t5/t6, the extra healing output

Also having the shaman in a pallie group with imp concentration aura makes Hex Lord healing a fair bit easier - no spell pushback at all.

Wow... has anyone else managed to pull off 2 healer runs? That definitely could be interesting... how do you handle healing on dragonhawk though? I'm assuming you have all the hatchlings down before/shortly after he hits his enrage and the tank starts needing major heals. Also, has anyone done it with healers other than a pally + shaman pairing?

Originally Posted by Fafhrd

26:30 Start pulling towards Dragonhawk boss. Take the left path, avoid the bird packs to the right. Stun/root all Scouts.

Hmm, possible slight derail from the more recent discussion here, but does anyone else other than our guild clear through the right area to avoid a bunch of scouts and AoE the birds while tanking/single pulling the trainers? We haven't gotten a timed attempt that far yet, but in general we've found that path easier and faster.

Also, what is likely to be the easiest clear order to get 3/4 of the timed event down? Eagle -> Bear -> Hawk / Bear -> Hawk -> Eagle? Lynx seems to have the longest trash clear, though there are definitely some corners we could be cutting. Personally we've had trouble with dps being too slow to quite get 2 bosses of the timed attempt down, consumables/flasks on everyone + actually having a shaman in raid for heroism should help though, and a number of us would like to get those rings for getting 3/4 down, so I'm trying to push for some more effort along those lines... going to have to suggest the healers taking turns drinking on trash idea as well.

Phantasie · 11/27/07, 2:33 AM

Originally Posted by Roywyn

Hex Lord Malacrass - does anyone have issues keeping the ogre add sheeped?

In my two runs where we got the ogre, yes he seemed to break sheep very often. Often enough where it made it almost impossible to keep him cc'd, especially when he liked to break in the middle of the shadow aoe. We just kill him now if we get him.

SavoryBeetle · 11/28/07, 4:05 PM

Originally Posted by Foofer

If you want to make it a tad bit quicker, don't leave one person behind to loot the chest. Boss dies, everyone picks up their badges, enchanter greeds the purple and everyone else needs/passes and moves on immediately. Loot all the boxes after you're done with your 4th boss.

Just to confirm here, you had one person talk to the NPC after killing each boss to free them, but didn't wait for the chest opening script and just came back later to loot them? I'm afraid that if we miss the time trial, then every NPC will die if we do not break them out of their cages, and I'm not sure if the chests despawn if you leave them.

Kalince · 11/28/07, 4:14 PM

Originally Posted by SavoryBeetle

Just to confirm here, you had one person talk to the NPC after killing each boss to free them, but didn't wait for the chest opening script and just came back later to loot them? I'm afraid that if we miss the time trial, then every NPC will die if we do not break them out of their cages, and I'm not sure if the chests despawn if you leave them.

Our last run no one even talked to the dragonhawk prisoner before the time ran out on our way to lynx. When we went back he was still alive and just waiting in his cage.

Cohren · 11/28/07, 6:47 PM

This might be a stupid question but can I get an confirmation on the order of bosses for the time trial? Last night my guild ran 2 ZA's and we both followed the order of:

Bear
Eagle
Dragonhawk
Lynx

Both groups killed the dragonhawk with like 5-8 mins left on the timer, got our chest but neither groups timer reset thus resulting in a failure of the time trial. If this is indeed the order then is this a bug and has anyone else experienced it? According to the Wowiki on the instance it says lynx is 3rd so in a few days we will try that but if you look at wowhead, the comments say its the above stated order and I'm 99% sure we killed the dragonhawk 3rd on the PTR when we completed the time trial.

◊ Bryne · 11/28/07, 6:55 PM

Neither Jan'alai (dragonhawk) nor Halazzi (lynx) grant extra time when killed, a fact that has been mentioned many times in this thread.

Kasi · 11/28/07, 6:58 PM

The strategy for doing it listed on the previous page had dragonhawk as third with the mention that killing him gave you no time. So I guess the answer is to dps faster and go harder on the first three parts of the event. It would be nice if someone would confirm that Lynx gave time. Would be much nicer if it was bear giving 15, hawk 10 and Lynx 5, leaving a bit more for Dragonhawk.

Edit: Nevermind, apparently killing Lynx doesn't help either. So yeah the answer is to just push faster. Consumables, skip as many pulls as you can, optimize groups or overgear the place.

• Golijov · 11/28/07, 8:51 PM

Can anyone provide insight as to how bear boss's brutal swipe behaves when one of the tanks dodges it? If that happens, does the other tank take the full ~14k hit? If anyone has tested this and knows for sure, it would be appreciated.

◊ Bryne · 11/28/07, 9:09 PM

Brutal Swipe, just like Saber Lash, calculates the split damage before avoidance is taken into account. I know this is a huge problem over on the R&D forums, but 100%, you saw it here, confirmed: Brutal Swipe and Saber Lash do not hit one tank for the full amount if the other tank dodges or parries..

If anyone is having problems with tanks eating full hits it's a positioning/hitbox issue, not a problem from an avoided attack.

Krag · 11/28/07, 10:21 PM

Not that it is needed, but I'll just second what Bryne wrote. I offtank on Lynx and have around 50% dodge in tank gear, if the rumors were anything but rumors I'm sure the warrior I cuddle up against would have been gibbed a few times

Xerophyte · 11/28/07, 10:23 PM

Originally Posted by Golijov

Can anyone provide insight as to how bear boss's brutal swipe behaves when one of the tanks dodges it? If that happens, does the other tank take the full ~14k hit? If anyone has tested this and knows for sure, it would be appreciated.

I can corroborate with random bits of WWS logs. Unfortunately they're likely to go down in a few days, so perhaps not quite evidence for posterity but still pretty conclusive...

Nalorakk
20:11'55.511 Nalorakk's Brutal Swipe dodged by Awnh
20:11'55.511 Nalorakk's Brutal Swipe hits Aarmon for 4832 (355 blocked)

Halazzi
21:25'40.333 Halazzi's Saber Lash dodged by Aarmon
21:25'40.337 Halazzi's Saber Lash hits Awnh for 8484 (601 blocked)

Nayt · 11/29/07, 1:14 PM

I see a lot of people saying Hex Lord is the hardest fight, I've yet to be in a Zul'Jin kill, last night we swapped in more melee (Warrior, Catform, Enhancment Shaman) and had Druid/Priest(Me)/Pally healing. From what I saw the Tornados weren't bad (unless you got trapped in a corner) but Phase 4 the Lynx phase basically meant anyone that got the debuff died. Does anyone stack stam here or group up really close? Just seemed like we couldn't keep up with the damage and by no means were our healers badly geared/skilled. We got to phase 5 with 3 people alive. :-/ Granted our guild has killed Zul'Jin before (I cannot recall our group make up) But is it necessary to change around your raid for a boss that drops above average loot and a wide range of drops? (Melee heavy to burn through the Tornado Phase). I feel like I'm missing something here.

Abarra · 11/29/07, 1:24 PM

The lynx boss is semi-bugged and will sometimes attack with a normal melee hit during a fixate. On this attempt, I was 3rd on threat, and more than 15% down from the tank.

08:03'56.054 Zul'jin's Lynx Rush dots Motrin for 1270 Physical damage
............. 289 Sharwin's Flash of Light crit heals Motrin for 2391
08:03'58.024 Zul'jin's Lynx Rush dots Motrin for 1270 Physical damage
..............461 Motrin gains Libram of Justice
08:04'00.259 Zul'jin's Lynx Rush dots Motrin for 1270 Physical damage
..............947 Zul'jin's Lynx Rush dots Motrin for 1269 Physical damage
08:04'04.073 Zul'jin's Lynx Rush dots Motrin for 1270 Physical damage
..............073 Zul'jin's Melee hits Motrin for 8382
-----------464 Motrin dies

6500ish damage in 8 seconds, then a melee for 95% of my total life.

You have to get lucky and not take a melee hit as a caster, or get lucky and have enough pallys to put BoPs on the casters when they are fixated. Grouping up on him helps, but does not eliminate the problem. Kind of sucks.

Kasi · 11/29/07, 1:28 PM

P3 does favor melee, but not as much as one thinks. Due to that tornadoes tend to be in the middle more, so staying there will get you knocked around more. What can work is having ranged dps that has a high dmg/spell ratio. Fire mages, Desto locks, boomkins, even elemental shamans. Sure they will take dmg for sure from the knockback, but would a melee be able to go in the middle and do 2-3k dmg without taking 1.2k dmg themselves?

As for P4, yes wear stamina gear. It's not that bad. It is 16k damage over 6 seconds. The main thing is getting people topped off coming out of P3. If you do that than it is survivable. If you have 9k health, then you'll need about 6-7k healing done over you in 6 seconds. 3 healers can easily output that much healing. This is the phase to blow dps cooldowns, as you want to get him to easy mode phase 5 asap. A pally with BoP can also make this much easier.