Duncan

Nobody really forces you to get all the honor pieces. Especially if 40k out of those 120k is just a very comparable trinket that only got 25 res more than the one you should have by now.

 

Touf

It basically forces you to grind 45k honor right after S4 comes out if you want to be competitive. That's a little crazy. I only get 1k an hour here...

 

Angeron

You can't really be serious can you? One-handers are cheap intellect stat sticks for 2v2 and 3v3 drain setups, or 5v5 team-asia setups. They are cheap so that when you need to break out the +60 int you get from dub 1handers you don't have to spend THREE THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED AND FIFTY POINTS ON THEM. The total cost is 1300? That's how many points I get for 10 games in 5s, so yeah I'd say it's worth it to grab them if my newly-70 hunter needs 2x 1handers for 2v2/3v3 and doesn't want to wait three weeks to get them.

Blizzard gave hunters EVERYTHING in season 3, and is making them the BEST 2v2 class in the game in 2.4.2 (lol instant 30 yard scare beast? Hunter/druid or hunter/priest should be #1 on every battlegroup now as druid/X(not a hunter) is an INSTANT WIN). Cheap ALTERNATIVES (you can still buy your expensive one-handers if you like chum) are a fantastically nice thing for people who don't play enough/do 5s enough to buy a new piece of gear weekly. Don't be a crybaby that they're giving you a NICE CHEAP alternative to the top of the line shit.

Though I can hide my cold gaze, and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours, and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comparable; I simply am not there.

On your server, causing econo-trauma.

 

clavarnway

Well it was my assumption that any serious PVPer that has all the best gear right now has the honor cap and a shit ton of marks stored up, ready to buy the new stuff. From that perspective, it's not too bad, as you can get quite a bit of instant honor with marks (past the "honor cap").

http://sigs.guildlaunch.net/sig.php/1424974uXyta.png

 

Kinv

The point of the 1 hander is they're supposed to be the melee weapons for hunters.... it negates the purpose if the non-hunter 1 handers are better for hunters... just like the 2 hander for season 3 negated the purpose since drain hunters used 2 1 handers. Also lol @ the best 2s class in the game especially coming from a Warrior whos been the #1 seed for all the brackets for the majority of the time since BC came out, even if the change does make that big of an effect(which we don't know for sure if it will or not) it's 1 bracket and has nothing to do with the cost of a hunters equipment.

 

Angeron

You're a level 60 commenting on the viability of stat sticks in a level 70 arena. Hunters use the 2hander to melee (welcome to 1500+ raptor strikes), 1handers are for 30 int. And yes, instant cast fear with a 30 yard range is even more game changing in MULTIPLE brackets than the MS effect on aimed shot AND the dispel effect on arcane shot taken together. Imagine if blizzard gave warriors an instant cast single target stun on a different DR than everything else that lasted 6 seconds and had a 30 yard range? Now put that on a 30 second cooldown and you'd have a similar situation as hunters in 2.4.2

Let's also not forget that the hunter-only 1handers are *barely* worse than the normal onehanders, and in fact, are so barely different that this cryfest is hilarious. You actually gain AP over the non-hunter axes, albeit at the loss of crit and ArPen.

Hunters don't need buffs, they're on par with warriors/warlocks and slightly worse than rogues in terms of arena viability. The fact that they are harder to skillcap than these other faceroll classes has nothing to do with the fact that your crying about a statstick at the same point you get an INCREDIBLE pvp buff.

Though I can hide my cold gaze, and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours, and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comparable; I simply am not there.

On your server, causing econo-trauma.

 

Kinv

How is a fear usable against 2 classes comparable at all to a stun usable against everyone? It'll help against druid teams mainly but it's not nearly as big as Arcane shot dispel or even the Aimed shot MS.

As for the weapons Barely worse or not they are better and in the arena where you are forced to maximize your stats as much as possible to compete it makes a difference. Would you not complain if Hunters had a better 2 hander available then warriors?

It's also not just coincidence that hunters are one of the lower represented classes in top-end arena play, and it's not because most hunters suck.

 

Touf

The mark thing will give you 60 tradeins, or 18.8k honor. So 27k honor after the patch. Moderately doable.

 

Prinsesa

What?

The current honor cap is 75,000.

The Mark of Honor turn-in repeatable quest awards 314 honor per turn-in. With a limit of 100 marks, that's 31,400 honor total, or an indirect cap of 106,400 honor prior to the new season.

Assuming you wanted to be able to buy everything up as soon as the patch hit (based on current prices):
Guardian's Pendant: 15,300
Guardian's Ring: 15,300
Guardian's Belt: 17,850
Guardian's Bracers: 11,794
Guardian's Boots: 17,850
45 Resilience Trinket: 40,000

Total: 118,094 honor, or 11,694 honor above the cap

http://armory.mmo-champion.com.nyud....63815BffMm.png

 

Gearknight

Touf was quoting 60 marks, because you'll need to spend 40 of some marks on the items themselves (in fact 50 EotS marks - 40 for boots and 10 for the neck). However, the point is moot, as you can store marks beyond 100 in your mailbox. Suffice it to say that if you're truly dedicated, you can prepare the honor and marks to buy all of the S4 honor gear on the first day.

 

Aeds

Any knowledge around if requirements for gladiator have changed aside from the 20% played? Im doing a threes atm with my hunter and druid alt. My hunter plays with 2 other dps so the higher ratings aren't reliable to win. So I've been keeping him at 20% played so he can get the glad mount. I'm just wondering with all the new PR and TR changes if it will affect getting glad at all.

 

Touf

That's about 120 marks, including 20 WSG, you really think that's easier than just doing AV the first day? They only last in your mailbox for one day.

 

Angeron

1) Because druids make up 60% or more of the healers in 2k+ rated 2v2 and 3v3 arena and an instant cast 30 yard range CC that affects the highest represented class in those brackets is by anyones consideration an ENORMOUS buff.

2) You're still level 60, I fail to understand how you have a viable opinion on a level 70 game.

3) You didn't read my post, you get the stat sticks early if you aren't very good because they're cheap and 2050 rating is a LOT easier to get in 2s and 3s than maintaining the 2200+rating you'd need for 3 straight weeks to buy your 'normal' weapons.

4) The weapons are a gift, why are you crying?

5) Hunters have low representation in the arena because they have a million tools at their disposal, and most people can't handle more than three buttons to press. And yes, it is ENTIRELY because most hunters just suck.

@Aeds: You need to be within 100 rating of the teams rating to get gladiator as well as th 20% played.

Though I can hide my cold gaze, and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours, and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comparable; I simply am not there.

On your server, causing econo-trauma.

 

• Xei

I have thought up an elegant solution.


THE PROBLEM

Low rated players do not like facing full Season X geared players in their lowbie bracket - getting steamrolled (point selling).

High rated players do not want low rated players to have the same access to their elite items by sucking in 10 games a week(weapons/shoulders).



Personal rating is what caused all the point selling problems - remove it.

Come up with some alternative measure to eliminate the "problems"



Increase the point cost on the weapons/shoulders or whatever ... I mean double them. 2k+ rated players earn over 1000 a week or more so paying 5-6k for a weapon would not be out of the question for them. Also, add another caveat onto the items ... "you must have played X arena games per week in any bracket for your team". Set the X value to something that eliminates those people who play 10 games a week and forget about it.

If you want the weapons, you need a LOT of points and you need to play a LOT of games every week. If you play 10 games a week and gain your 250 points you will basically never be able to get the weapons except right near the end of S4. If you play 100 games a week and gain your 250 points, you will STILL never be able to get the weapons. If you play 100 games and get 1000+ points, wont be long for you.

So someone sells off a 2k+ rated team to scrubs they need to play X games per week - every week - till they reach the number needed. They will nerf the rating down soo hard that they will not get enough points. If you team swap, it will take a while for you to be eligible for the items due to the games per week.


I'm sure there are other solutions to the problem, and mine are not foolproof, but it shows what 10mins of thinking can come up with that solves the problem without the personal rating debacle.

"Being a leader is not a position of power. It is a position of service." ~ Barestomper

WTB Oceanic Horde PvE Players

 

Angeron

They've already 'fixed' point selling, except for those who are going to be buying personal rating items through win-trading in 2s/3s/5s. Bad players will no longer be affected by good players rerolling teams every week, good players will now have the chance to rape PR sellers in the 2200 bracket. Everybody wins.

Though I can hide my cold gaze, and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours, and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comparable; I simply am not there.

On your server, causing econo-trauma.

 

• Xei

That doesn't fix the problem of some battlegroups not having enough 2k teams for people to reach 2200 for shoulders.

As mentioned, there are still several loopholes in their system to enable people to cheese it.

The S4 changes really punish HARD the casual PvPer. 1700 PR/TR, at least in BG9, is unobtainable by casual PvPers, the competition is just too high. This COULD be the result of point sellers (they take up 90% of the ~1800 bracket games I play against).

"Being a leader is not a position of power. It is a position of service." ~ Barestomper

WTB Oceanic Horde PvE Players

 

◊ Vain

Some top teams from other BGs transferred to BG9 to compete in one place, but are BG9's masses of low- and mid-level players supposed to all be better than their equivalents on other battlegroups too?

 

• Xei

Nothing you can really do to fix the problem that is BG9. I know of many many many players who could not break the 1800 barrier on BG9 transferred to another battlegroup, instantly get 2k rating for weapon+shoulders then transfer back when the month is up.

The problem for us is that all the oceanic realms are on BG9 (apart from one Oceanic PvP realm I think) so we do not have any other choice. So we get our 500ms in arena's against sub 50ms powerhouse PvP servers like Tich, Blackrock etc etc.

My focus is PvE, but I do enjoy the PvP aspect of the game - but the current state of arenas and specifically BG9 is making the PvP part less attractive. The 2.4.2 changes MAY help, but as many have pointed out there are still loopholes, and if anyone is going to find/exploit the loopholes it will be BG9.

"Being a leader is not a position of power. It is a position of service." ~ Barestomper

WTB Oceanic Horde PvE Players

 

TheGumbyMan

Has there been any discussion or hints of moving S3 items to also being available with tier tokens with season four commencing? I realise the shoulders require a team/personal arena rating, and I don't see why this couldn't remain intact if the option were available to turn-in Tier 6 instead of arena points.

As it stands, when s4 starts there will be three ways of attaining Merciless Gladiator gear - honor, tier 5 tokens and tier 6 tokens - none of which require arena participation.

 

Ngita

It would have been nice to use the armory to provide something better then anecdotal but their are just too many teams on Bloodlust. What % of teams rated 1450 have played in the last week? for example.

But from my alt's Arena Teams outside of certain timeframes ie before 7pm on a weekday and early afternoon on a weekend, low level teams dont appear to play. So at 13xx rating you get the same sort of teams as 15xx. Mostly S3, some S3 weapons, occasionally S3 shoulders. You just dont lose many points.

 

Zynum

I would like to know what you mean by casual in this context. I recently retired from raiding as a resto shaman, and have been playing elemental in a mix of pvp/pve and ele/resto gear. 1700 is fine, and as I replace my resto-pve items with ele-pvp equivalents, I fully expect to go higher than that.

Similarly, I would classify my rogue as casual, having played 60 games of 2v2 this season, all up (again, a consequence of raiding on the shaman). I'm over 1700 there too, and feel comfortable with the possibility of going higher, given some time and games played.

Are you underestimating the ability of the casual player, or is my interpretation of casual somewhat lenient? (Further possibly relevant information: I am in Australia, working with an oceanic ping).

 

• Xei

I know at least on my server, my guild and my guilds teams (along with VERY few exceptions) are the only horde side teams over 1700 in ANY bracket. I know a lot of guys I chat to around my server who go "wow man, how'd you get 17xx rating". I have played with a few of these guys, they are not uber leet skill