Virtue

Our hunter had a case where he used FD righafter he was targetted by conflag, and he didn't get hit by it. So yes it seem to work.I still wouldn't count on it because it can be resisted, especially on 1 camp strat.

 

Zindel

Uhh, there's plenty of ways around this. What we do is have the shaman healing the melee jump down and stand next to the tanks. Most of the time the melee are out of los from the healers up top. The shaman is in LoS of the top camp so if the melee start dipping low, one of the CoH priests can spam CoH off the shaman and that gets all the melee.

Edit: I should mention, the only downfall of this strat is the possibility of a missed shadow nova if it targets the shaman standing in melee. It means people up top will keep their flame touch for an extra 30 seconds. You can salv the shaman and not salv the healers up top to reduce the chance of this happening, but it still happens from time to time if she spams flame sear on the melee. It's hardly game breaking though, we had it happen this week and still got a kill with everyone up.

 

Skinminer

We seem to be experiencing our tanks getting conflagged ( while she should be conflagging the 3rd person on the aggro of Sarcolash right ? ). Before today all was fine until we started attempting them again. Now it seems they do target our tank with conflag.

I made up something because I got no clue why she does that:
She might put a focus on someone 10seconds before she initially casts the Conflag on someone and therefor if someone overaggro's even 1 time it can cause a wipe since its making her put focus on a tank.

Any thoughts on this?

P.S. We are killing them reverse ( with one camp ).

[EDIT] Both Me ( hunter ) and our other hunter are having 2 MD's only instead of 3 somehow. This seems to be bugged ( we thought initially it was bloodrage but it wasn't, neither the shout ). We are testing it now.

 

◊ Penguin

As stated in the sticky at the top of the forum (http://elitistjerks.com/f15/t21348-r...ed_april_30th/), Conflag will target anyone on the aggro list that is in position 2 - 6(ish). Having the OT targeted can and does happen, and occasionally Confounding can line up at the same time as Conflag is casting. It is something that you have to clearly communicate beforehand what the melee and tanks need to do when that happens.

There's not some hidden "but he tries really hard" variable built into the game. -Slake

I always love the "it doesn't fit my style of play" line. There are only two styles of play; Correct, and Incorrect. The only people that ever use this line are people with the incorrect style of play. -Sebudai

 

Warbo

That's odd then. All of our attempts to kill conflag with FD were before the FD bug fixed, which meant that back then FD did not actually work on the encounter. Is this the case with you too? We haven't attempted to try killing conflags with FD after three or so wipes due to conflags going through unresisted FDs.

 

Jarlyn

I can't directly speak for Conflag (we've stuck with the normal strat for 5? kills now), but I know FD will stop a Shadow Nova. As I said I'm not 100% on Conflag as it's not common for a hunter to ever be targeted for one in our strat, but I know for a fact we've wiped more than once to a reactive FD from aggro gain on a Shadow Nova.

 

Mattaos

Can a warrior spell reflect Blaze? or any of the various spells used by Althyess?

 

◊ Penguin

No.

There's not some hidden "but he tries really hard" variable built into the game. -Slake

I always love the "it doesn't fit my style of play" line. There are only two styles of play; Correct, and Incorrect. The only people that ever use this line are people with the incorrect style of play. -Sebudai

 

Shha

As for the 1 camp strat - the ranged group must me REALLY tightly packed against the pillar for it to work. A loose group fo people will get shadowfuries when images cast it on people outside the pack.

Also for the tanking part - Warriors DO get crushed on Sacrolash. She attacks too fast (dual wielding mob), to count on shield block to save you from all crushings. Not with sunwell radiance making you take a lot of hits. If you keep demo though, crushings are manageable.

 

Ana

That's an unblocked hit, not a crushing blow. As far as I know, bosses in sunwell don't crush.

 

Nakari

It was confirmed just one page before in this very thread that Lady Sacrolash can (and as a dual wielder *will*) crush your tank (perhaps with the exception of Paladins).

 

Ayreon

Sacrolash definitely does.

 

MackTheTemp

My guild is wiping, and we're having a hard time figuring out why. Shadowfury + sear seems to result in death far too often - - we're rocking 11 healers, and our gear doesn't suck. My primary concern is the number of shadowfuries hitting the raid. How many shadow image hits are guilds using the reverse strategy successfully suffering? Our guild has been getting sacro down to 60-10% and taking anywhere from 40-120 shadowfury hits using a two group strategy.

How many shadowfury hits should we expect using this strategy?
How many should we expect using a one group strategy hugging the pillar?


Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers, Imago

 

gonthrax

No need for 102.4 w/o holy shield. 127.4 with HS is what is required.

Provided you are a geared member of your progression team, a switch back to the Libram of Repentance, Kael neck and you are most of the way there.

You do make small sacrifices in the armor department but nothing major, this has always been the story though. A bit of mitigation lost for (barring lag/skill) reliable uncrushability.

 

◊ Cadfael

Can't help you with two group but when on one group, you only get a shadowfury on the upper side when Sacrolash is running a bit around due to confounding/conflag on tanks or if there were people targeted that just moved due to conflag and thus shortened the distance. Providing that the tanks hold her in the right position, which really is quite a small space and not easy to find.

On our first kill, we had exactly one shadowfury and it came very early, after a confounding on a tank and subsequent movement of Sacrolash. Our 10 healers recovered fine and nobody died. No more shadowfuries then.

It is important with the one group strat that really everyone hugs the pillar. It requires but one player standing a bit on the side and you get them again or some bad luck when Sacrolash moves around. But if you do everything right, you can do 3 mins without one single shadowfury at the upper balcony. The warlock tank can get one occasionally but that shouldn't be any problem at all.

 

Crass

Does anybody know if the "conflag candidates" are a static number of players below Sacrolash's current agro holder, or is it a pool of players within a percentage of the current agro holder's threat?

 

◊ shorto85

Pretty sure that has been covered before in this thread a few pages back. Any person that is dpsing her and isn't the primary target is an eligible target if you are doing the Sacrolash first strat. The easiest way to think about it is, Grand Warlock Alythess will conflag a target in order to "help" her twin. So if you're killing Alythess first the conflag targets would be the Sacrolash OT and any healers since they are getting healing threat on Sacrolash.

 

Crass

But that's not really how the mechanic works. It's not based off of who is DPSing the target, otherwise "Alythess First" strats wouldn't have to worry about healers getting conflag. It's clearly based off of the opposite twin's threat table, DPSing or not.

What I'm wondering is if the conflag/shadow nova target is always going to be chosen randomly from a static number of players under the highest agro (such as 2nd - 6th) or if it's threat percentage based (which could theoretically be 24 players in size). Basically I'm trying to figure out if the number of available conflag/shadow nova victims can be increased by removing BoS on healers and therefore reducing the possibility of an off-tank getting conflagged considerably.

 

malthrin

 

Wish

We are running one camp. The hardest part was to 1. find the tanking spot, where the tanks are in LoS to the healers and the shadow images aren't in LoS to Sacro, so they despawn before they use shadowfury on the camp and 2. keeping Sacro at exactly this spot, as she has a habbit to run around while casting.

If you succeed in 1. and 2. no shadowfury should hit the raid.

Of couse there a times, if the pull is less then optimal or you have to reposition her mid-fight, that the camp gets hit by shadowfury. Overall in 4 consistent 10% tries plus the kill i would say we got hit 1-2 times with shadowfury.

 

Crass

Thanks for reading my post.

I'm fully aware of the information in this sticky, in fact before I posted I read it again to make sure what I was asking hasn't already been covered. I'm looking for a more exact idea as to who is eligible for conflag/shadow nova.

 

Riot

Are you dense?

Gurg fully answers your question. Conflag and shadow nova targets are based on threat.

Overslept, / So tired. / If late, / Get fired. / Why bother? / Why the pain? / Just go home / Do it again. - The Commuter's Lament
Norman B. Colp

 

Oafijev

Actually, Crass has a great point and I don't believe it's answered in the sticky at all. If you read his post, he clearly knows they're based on threat, what he is asking is the number of eligible targets (and if that can be manipulated). His idea is that increasing the number of eligible conflagration targets will reduce the chances that and OT gets conflag. That being said, I haven't seen any attempt to manipulate the number of eligible targets by manipulating the threat, and my guild hasn't killed Twins enough times to be trying that sort of thing just yet. That doesn't prevent me from making some completely unsupported hypotheses though.

In my opinion (as a healer on that fight), I think it's much more dangerous for a healer to get conflag than for the OT. Having a provision to deal with the OT getting conflag may affect the melee (run out) but if healers are eligible to get it, it means that you'd need a provision to back up every healing assignment (10 or 11 of them probably). I just don't think that the OT getting conflagrated is really that much of a problem.

Furthermore, even if the eligible targets are "over a percentage of top threat", I don't think healers will generate enough threat to make it on this list after the first one or two conflags even if they click off Salvation, unless the percentage threshold is set really low. This is conjecture since I haven't had a chance to analyze the threat meter from this fight yet.

 

◊ Regen

It's become fairly obvious that it targets ~1-6 Ignoring her current target meaning the only time it is ever bad for an OT to get it is if he is confounded. For obvious reasons you wouldn't want a healer getting conflag, however it is quite rare even on the very first cast(reverse).

I think trying to find a way to manipulate conflag (even if it were theoretically possible through %-based threat) is over-complicating the fight to the point where it is a wasted effort. Conflag is simple and an easy mechanic to deal with (once your tards have all wiped the raid at least once).

 

Riot

^ What Regen said.

Run away from other people if you're targetting for Conflagration. Assuming a strategy that places both Twins on the bottom (Fusion positioning, no?) It's really not that hard for your melee DPS on the bottom (or ranged on top) to simply move away from Conflagration if you're going for Sacrolash first.

If you're doing Alythess first...well...why are you doing it that way anyway?

FWIW, if you're killing Sacrolash first and your healers are being targetted for Conflagration first, something is very, very, wrong.

Overslept, / So tired. / If late, / Get fired. / Why bother? / Why the pain? / Just go home / Do it again. - The Commuter's Lament
Norman B. Colp