I have been thinking about this for a while now and would like the input of these esteemed board members.
Upon reaching level 40 you may embark upon a quest to matriculate in the arts of a subclass different from ones primary class.
Subclasses are limited to 1/2 the level of ones Primary class. Thus at level 40, once one has completed the subclass acquisition quest, one may choose a subclass and attain the level of 20 within that subclass. Each subsequent 2 levels of ones primary class attained thereafter would grant 1 level in ones subclass with experience accrued and applied to ones subclass in a fashion similar to Hunter pets.
Subclasses are limited to those classes available to ones race. I.E. no Night Elf Mage and no Blood Elf Warrior subclasses.
One may learn the maximum rank spells acquired with ones subclass based on the level of ones primary class. I.E if you are Level 70 Human Warrior/35 Mage you can learn up to level 70 version of Scorch(Rank 9) but couldn't learn Rank 1 of Dragon's Breath or Rank 1Molten Armor etc.
Subclasses would accrue talent points and have identical talent trees to primary classes, with the obvious limitation of lesser points available to fill talent trees with.
One may learn the passive abilities and weapon skills of ones subclass. I.E. Block, Parry, Mail, Plate, Two Handed Maces etc.
Racial abilities are only granted for ones Primary class. I.E. a 70 Draenei Mage/40 Warrior would only have Spell Hit Heroic Presence.
Hero Classes are only available as a primary class.
The idea is to diversify the classes more and have the subclasses make an impact but not subvert the primary classes. I have weighed the pros and cons, what do you think of this? What are the pros and cons you would consider?
Thank you for your time.
Last edited by Dejablue : 06/13/08 at 4:58 AM.
Reason: Spelling error
I think this is how it's implemented in another game whose name I can't quite remember. Most helpful comment of the year, right there. I'd be interested to know how they did this, though.
I love the general idea but how useful would certain combos be? A shadowpriest with level 40 warlock spells? Does a priest/warrior wear plate? What a nightmare for itemisation. Not to mention game balance (warrior with vanish, even lvl 40 slice and dice, Night Elf warrior with bear form and plate armor :P).
I'm pretty certain this idea goes against Blizzard's general design brief. i.e. they don't want to punish people for "making a mistake" or close down what paths are available to you - i.e. I put my first talent point in protection but you can respec instead of making another warrior". Would you be able to respec subclass?
This idea could be done with player controlled humanoid pets though. Maybe when we get to level 90, Blizzard will let us make and level a serf.
My overwhelming impression is that this would be stupendously complicated and therefore all but impossible to balance (both in PvE and PvP, but especially the latter), plus the amount of information to be considered would be so overwhelming that most people would just come to a site like this, learn that the highest DPS combination is primary rogue/sub-warrior, and then choose that (primary shaman/sub-rogue? Warlock/shadow priest? Whatever...). It seems like many classes already are looking to have a huge number of tools at their disposal at 80, and adding an entire new level of maybe-broken, maybe-redundant spells and abilities to each through a subclass is not needed or particularly helpful.
What I don't like much about this idea is that a choice you'd make at level 40 for example, which could be two years ago when you didn't know much, would determine your character forever. Sounds a bit like a permanent spec.
This is a silly and useless idea tbh. It would break balance in a million different ways. You should stop the arm chair game designing, or at least keep it to the official suggestions forum, which is the dungheap of useless arm chair game design.
It's hard enough to differentiate between the classes as is already (one need only think of the fake Shadow Priest 'ultimate' talent that turned one into a Warlock instead) and some combinations would be incredibly out of whack.
A Druid/Warrior that can Parry, Block, Wear a shield and Plate and hit 100k armour as well as 40% dodge ?
A Shaman/Warrior that can Stormstrike/Mortal Strike/Windfury/Macestun ?
Priest/Rogue ? Vanish if you get a wipe and res up.
I could continue with completely ridiculous over-the-top combinations quite effortlessly. In fact, pretty much every single combination would be stupendously overpowered for some aspects of this game.
I beleive it is Dungeons and Dragons where you can have up to 3 classes but your levels are spread between them all. Also EQ has the same spells available to several classes etc. There are precedents abound.
I thought about the above concerns beforehand. My rationale was that if spells are limited to the level 40 version then there would be little point as the spells would be so weak. Do you think level 40 fireballs and such would make a big impact or just be a silly pet type of cool character feature? If you cant go beyond 1/2 the primary level then you could never have all the spells of a primary class, that was the reasoning behind primary level versions of spells for sub classes just limiting availability of spells via level acquisition so that the spells you do have are viable.
But perhaps for balance sake a simpler version:
You can only learn the passive abilities, weapon skills and armor class of your primary class.
You can do a quest or pay to change your subclass similar to professions masteries.
For balance sake perhaps Hybrid classes can only be Primary classes and you must pair hybrid with any sub class, Melee with caster?
So on one side you have rogue and warrior on the other magi, priests and warlocks and you can pick one from each side, one melee one caster and hybrids can be matched with any class but must be the primary class.
I can see where balance could be an issue but I think by simplifying it and making restrictions that this could diversify the characters and make them more unique.
Of course there will be people that will come to forums like this and theory-craft the highest dps or healing combo, but they do that already.
I understand that we will be embarking upon level 80 soon, but each expansion does not have to include 10 more levels. Many MMOs release simply new spells and abilities and more content. I think this would help to make the game less linear.
Thoughts, feedback, suggestions for changes?
Also don't think of WotLk, it is done, think beyond that.
This is fun and I cant think of a better place to swirl around ideas such as this to make them into something concrete and viable than these very forums.
Thanks for your time and input guys, greatly appreciated!