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Old 09/02/08, 5:03 AM   #691
Muggins
Piston Honda
 
Blood Elf Death Knight
 
Frostwhisper (EU)
Originally Posted by Copernicus View Post
Was looking more for a dodge rating food. Agility, Strength, expertise, or even hit all are reasonable options for a tank. But none of them are pure tanking food.
Considering that expertise does more for tanks than anybody else i don't understand why you wouldn't class it as pure tanking food. Tanks are the only people to really take advantage of the parry reduction inherent in expertise allowing increased threat output and more importantly incoming damage reduction through lack of parry gib burst, one of the main tank killers.

Personally, as a tank, i cried for joy when i saw the expertise/stam recipe.

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Old 09/02/08, 3:59 PM   #692
Pharmacon
Von Kaiser
 
Undead Rogue
 
Scilla
While I do agree with you that the expertise/stam food is tank food, I think his point was that same food is great for a Rogue, Fury War, Feral Druid, etc., not just tanks.

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Old 09/02/08, 4:25 PM   #693
Sydane
Don Flamenco
 
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Human Warlock
 
Argent Dawn
The only "tank food" in BC is stam food, and with stam on all the LK food, they at least get to make use of some of the other stats, instead of having 20 spirit that is completely pointless for them. The interesting thing is going to be the question of if casters will be better off with 35 spellpower, or 23 spellpower + 20 Spirit, since the stam is essentially wasted for them. Might see casters and healers still using the BC food in some circumstances. Maybe there will just be another batch of food that has Spirit as a sub-stat to fill that potential hole.

Empathy does not imply approval.

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Old 09/02/08, 6:11 PM   #694
PSGarak
Bald Bull
 
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Undead Warlock
 
Hyjal
With tanking being moved to a much more aggressive DPS/Threat-heavy model, I'm not surprised that "pure" tanking food that's min-maxed stam or stam/avoidance is hard to find. I expect that the stam/expertise or stam/agi is intended to be tank food, and there quite simply won't be any defensive-only food since it would be "backing down" from their current stance on tanking.


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Old 09/03/08, 1:40 AM   #695
Dehn
Von Kaiser
 
Dwarf Paladin
 
Tarren Mill (EU)
Originally Posted by PSGarak View Post
With tanking being moved to a much more aggressive DPS/Threat-heavy model, I'm not surprised that "pure" tanking food that's min-maxed stam or stam/avoidance is hard to find. I expect that the stam/expertise or stam/agi is intended to be tank food, and there quite simply won't be any defensive-only food since it would be "backing down" from their current stance on tanking.
I'd argue that a sta/str food is both nice mitigation and threat for a tank with the new mechanics.

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Old 09/03/08, 10:31 AM   #696
Jubling
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Paladin
 
Argent Dawn (EU)
Originally Posted by Copernicus View Post
Assuming the Northern Spices are not BoP
They aren't.

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Old 09/04/08, 11:11 AM   #697
Korhaug
Von Kaiser
 
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Tauren Druid
 
Mazrigos (EU)
Inscription 1-300 guide is now on wotlk wiki. It's only using druid glyphs as they're the only ones implemented, but the mats for glyphs appear to be set at a uniform 1 ink (3 for higher level) so we can expect it to hold for glyphs for other classes as well. Blizzard may change the cost of glyphs, but it's unlikely that druid glyphs will vary from other same-level glyphs.

The first interesting point is that the amount of herbs you'll need to level inscription to 300 is rougly one and a half of the amount you'd need to level alchemy to 300 (comparison originally by Mortos, who used a random alch power leveling guide for the reference):

7-10 stacks of Alabaster-giving herbs
4-5 stacks of Dusky-giving herbs
3-5 stacks of Golden-giving herbs
4-6 stacks of Emerald-giving herbs
8-12 stacks of Violet-giving herbs
13-19 stacks of Silvery-giving herbs

Vs

60 x Peacebloom , 60 x Silverleaf , 15 x Mageroyal = 6.5 stacks
80 x Briarthorn , 30 x Bruiseweed , 40 x Stranglekelp = 7.5 stacks
30 x Liferoot , 30 x Kingsblood , 5 x Steelbloom = 3 stacks
45 x Goldthorn , 15 x Khadgar's Whisker = 3 stacks
70 x Sungrass , 20 x Arthas' Tears , 40 x Blindweed = 6.5 stacks
40 x Golden Sansam , 40 x Mountain Silversage = 4 stacks

Which gives around 50 stacks for inscription, vs 30 for alchemy (also check out the distributions). This would still place inscription as one of the cheaper crafting professions. It's definitely cheaper then blacksmithing, engineering and jewelcrafting in that level range, and probably still cheaper then all three in the 1-450 range.

The second interesting point is that you produce useful glyphs (for both leveling and endgame) while you level the profession. You can then sell these glyphs, essentially making your leveling free (similar to JC 300-375).

This also means that you'll still need "lowby" herbs well into the endgame. Feral druids are not going to stop wanting that Glyph of Rip, after all. As some old world herbs are notoriously inconveninent to farm, this could have interesting effects on the herb market and the easy availability of certain glyphs.

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Old 09/04/08, 11:33 AM   #698
Sydane
Don Flamenco
 
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Human Warlock
 
Argent Dawn
The biggest difference is the herbs required are each in a range as opposed to having specific requirements. Each of those ranges has at least one herb that is a good bit more common or less expensive than the others, so there should never be an over-inflation or too much demand for one hard to get herb, as people can always just switch to a different one until the prices level out.

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Old 09/04/08, 12:26 PM   #699
Ukerric
Don Flamenco
 
Dwarf Priest
 
Dalaran (EU)
Originally Posted by Korhaug View Post
Inscription 1-300 guide is now on wotlk wiki. It's only using druid glyphs as they're the only ones implemented, but the mats for glyphs appear to be set at a uniform 1 ink (3 for higher level) so we can expect it to hold for glyphs for other classes as well.
Not guaranteed. For example, of the first two 75-skill hunter glyphs, one needs 1 ink, the other needs 3 (where the 2 druid glyphs need 1 each).

I would also not call it optimal. No skillups from making Midnight inks or Lion Ink? You can design a path that uses less glyphs. Of course, given that low level glyphs will be useful, you may probably craft glyphs for most of your guild during levelling, which means you don't care as much about optimal path.

(stat scrolls and other missing recipes will probably change that as well)

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Old 09/06/08, 4:07 AM   #700
PSGarak
Bald Bull
 
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Undead Warlock
 
Hyjal
Some new JC, Alchemy, and Cooking stuff when up on mmo-champion with the release of 8905. Of most particular note:

Alchemy-only (BoP) arena-allowed healing and mana potions. It certainly gives alchemy something to do in arena. Naturally, this can also open up an entire can of worms for arena-sanctions tradeskill perks. Tailoring nets and engineering hand grenades come to mind.

The cooking recipes are cute as well. I don't know if half of them even do anything, but that is perfectly fine with me. Ritual of Food That Makes You Big/Small is quite awesome. Some of them seem to use old-world mats, though.


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Old 09/06/08, 4:43 AM   #701
Nitz
Don Flamenco
 
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Draenei Shaman
 
Ysondre (EU)
Originally Posted by PSGarak View Post
Alchemy-only (BoP) arena-allowed healing and mana potions.
I don't see it making it to live. Alchemy would be mandatory for any mana based class in arena.

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Old 09/06/08, 5:30 AM   #702
Talq
Von Kaiser
 
Troll Mage
 
Aman'Thul
Not necessarily. There are a large number of other trade-skill related bonuses that would be expected to function in the arena (eg the passive gathering skill bonuses, blacksmithing sockets, JC only gems, fur linings). This is arguably balancing alchemy against those boni - as mixology will be of no benefit in arena.

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Old 09/06/08, 7:36 AM   #703
Nerub
Von Kaiser
 
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Orc Death Knight
 
Azshara (EU)
Looking at the Warrior glyphs I'm tempted to grab inscription for the extra major glyph slot now. However, Wowhead does not fully list them yet.

Anybody knows a site which has all the new Warrior glyphs listed including the distinction between minor, lesser and major?

P.S: Toughness - Spell - World of Warcraft was changed to 500 HP instead of 35 Stamina.

Last edited by Nerub : 09/06/08 at 9:58 AM.

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Old 09/06/08, 1:15 PM   #704
Calixtus
Piston Honda
 
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Night Elf Druid
 
Dragonblight (EU)
Anyone care to guess whether the mat costs on the alchemy potions will change or if that's it?

Because honestly, I can see why the actual returns would have to be beaten into the ground with the nerfbat to avoid making alchemy a neccesity. But... A potion that costs two stacks of a regular healing potion, a new vial above imbued? I don't see why such an enormous cost would be warranted for arena; After all, isn't that why consumables were removed from it in the first place?

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Old 09/06/08, 1:23 PM   #705
Lexington
Glass Joe
 
Human Paladin
 
Stormreaver
Originally Posted by Calixtus View Post
Anyone care to guess whether the mat costs on the alchemy potions will change or if that's it?

Because honestly, I can see why the actual returns would have to be beaten into the ground with the nerfbat to avoid making alchemy a neccesity. But... A potion that costs two stacks of a regular healing potion, a new vial above imbued? I don't see why such an enormous cost would be warranted for arena; After all, isn't that why consumables were removed from it in the first place?
The point is that the potion isn't a consumable; it's a reusable inventory item with a clause that allows it to be used in arenas. The name "Endless ____ Potion" and the prohibitive cost of what a single of these potions would otherwise cost can lead us to no other conclusion.

There may very well be an issue with the potency of the Mana potion in arenas, but the healing one probably won't make anyone reroll their profession. As is, it's roughly as good as Wild Growth, which has largely been evaluated as being underwhelming by most everyone.

As for the Cooking stuff, the old world mat requirement on some of the recipes does seem like a potential mistake in the making. However, I have faith that Blizzard learned from the past and that if Mote of Shadow is to remain on a recipe, mobs that drop the new tier of Shadow mat will drop Motes as well. There's a precedent for this with Outland elementals dropping Essences, as well as old world high-level Elementals dropping the Elemental/step above Elemental mat/Essence triad. And hell, Outland spiders still drop Dripping Spider Mandibles.

Last edited by Lexington : 09/06/08 at 1:48 PM.

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