Rivkah

I don't think the fur lining is intended to stack with enchants. Based on the stats it gives, it's clear they are taking into account the loss of an enchant into the value. For example, the AP bracer enchant is 114 AP, which would be much better than any other profession if it stacked with enchants, but the 50 AP bracer enchant subtracted from that gives 64 AP, which is exactly the same as what you get from most professions.

I can't say about fur lining stacking with blacksmithing bracer socket though, I don't expect there are a lot of LW/BS out there to test that out.

 

Rivkah

I'm not sure that the one daily that gives 2 rewards is bugged- it is the only one which requires any materials other than chilled meat, which means it requires more farming than the others. So it's possible they left in an extra bonus on that one on purpose to compensate for that.

In regards to the feast, I don't think it has a certain number of charges but actually goes away after a set period of time. I'm not positive about this but I don't think I've ever seen a feast disappear even in a 25 man raid from everyone eating it, it just would disappear after a set time has expired. It's possible that it has more than 25 charges though. It is placed kind of like a mage table, then when people click on it, it sits them down and they start eating and get the buff if they eat long enough to be wellf ed.

 

Zupal

I could definitely see this being the case particularly with the argent dawn stones/oils. 170AP/100spellpower is a lot of item budget which might the balance over for certain classes. For instance, the math might work out for a dual-wield hunter with both AP stones on lower level gear.

I'm vaguely annoyed I spent a few days farming the scourge invasion for stones for use in Naxx but whatever.

 

Rivkah

Just tested to confirm, I created an enchant scroll for my LW hunter on beta, and tried to apply it over my fur lining on my bracers. It asked me if I wanted to replace the enchant. So it doesn't look like enchants stack with fur lining, which is not surprising. Still no information on how the blacksmithing interacts with it. I would assume that if it was designed properly, that blacksmithing sockets would not interfere with enchants (given the way the stat balance works for professions, it seems designed to expect that you can have an extra socket and an enchant at the same time), and that the fur lining should be treated just like an enchant, so I would think they should work together just fine, but that's a guess at the mechanics not based on testing.

 

Copernicus

Blacksmithing sockets are separate and do not overwrite enchants. I don't believe anyone has bothered with Leatherworking and Blacksmithing to double-buff a Wrist, but if they don't stack it would be a bug.

 

stalah

Does anyone have any idea if the new Fire Seed's put anything else on CD like Health stones or mana gems (similiar to what flamecaps do now)? If not do flamecaps stack with fireseeds?

 

Roywyn

Fire Seed have a 1 minute cooldown, not shared with Mana Gems.

According to [Fire Seed], it's in the same cooldown category as dynamite, drums, nets and similar clicky targets.


What's more important is that it doesn't actually do anything in game.
No increase is spell power, damage done by fixed damage spells, wands, melee, no change in armour or resistances.
It has never done anything for me. Not at 80, and not before.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

panny

I'm actually BW/LW right now (dropped mining for LW for Muru). Unfortunately, I'm stuck with no miner on beta, so I can't test. If any one wants to know for sure, send me a fuckload of Cobalt/Saronite/Titansteel/whatever (Hortez on Lich King).

 

Yaha

I keep reading that Inscription's glyph-discovery abilities (Minor & Northrend Inscription Research) are on 20-hour cooldowns.

Can anyone clarify: does using one type of research proc the cooldown on both the abilities or just on itself?

 

Roywyn

The cooldowns are separate, like the special cloth for tailoring.

So you log on, do both researches and log off for 20 hours on yur alt.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

Bismar

An Umbral Shiv, socketted with 2 WOTLK epic gems, and enchanted with Exception agility, and an AD stone, comes in at about: 232 AP, 13 hit, and 33 crit rating.

Comparing to the ilvl 226 items in WOTLK, two of them are slightly worse than Betrayer of Humanity (2H) with 110 AP enchant, and significantly better than two of "Sinister Revenge" with the Agi enchant.

It's not a bad idea.

 

evisania

I've leveled inscription 295/300 so far on an alt and making decent money selling glyphs in the AH. So far I've been farming herbs (or using stored herbs) on another character, then milling on the scribe, making the ink, and crafting the glyph. Looking forward I'm a little concerned about marketing inscription other than with finished glyphs. Specifically, how to handle requests for specific glyphs from another player. The original materials (herbs) are really far removed from the ink actually called for in the glyph recipe. And the ink isn't obviously associated by name to the herbs (e.g. like mithril ore --> mithril bar, or even mithril ore --> mithril casing).

Does anyone else see this as a challenge? Will there be less "LF scribe for XXX glyph, have mats" for this profession, and more of just buying the lowest priced items off the AH? Anyone focusing on selling inks on the AH (as the final mat players would look for) at this point or just keeping your supplies to craft glyphs yourself?

"This is no game. This is real. It’s as real as a beggar squatting by the side of the road, begging, and then you realize, uh-oh, he’s not begging."

 

Vazu

Hold onto all of your extra white "common" ink and send the green "uncommon" ink to an alt. The green stuff is basically worthless right now. Many minor glyphs (which sell the best) require very low level ink. For example, Lion's Ink is one of the most valuable, and I think it mills off of Kingsblood and that tier of herbs. Most of the lower level inks are used for minor glyphs. The higher level inks are used to create higher level majors like Crusader Strike and stuff like that. Those can sell well, but you have to play the auction house and find a good time where supply is low. Even then, I'd only bother with majors if they are very good. Stuff like Ice Block, Seal of Command and Water Mastery are examples of majors that sell well when supply is limited and prices are somewhat high.

 

Copernicus

So based on the current information (for reference - http://elitistjerks.com/904932-post854.html )

All tanks should be leatherworkers, because there's no WotLK bracer enchant for Stamina and the 90 Stamina bonus on Fur Lining is insane. This also gives a minor boost with the resist enchants in case a resist fight shows up.

Until epic gems are introduced, Jewelcrafting gives the biggest boost because of metagem and socketing bonuses. It also has the side effect of being customizable in case a different stat is better than raw SP or AP. If or when epic gems are introduced, Jewelcrafting becomes very average and requires justification by eliminating bad gem colors.

Blacksmithing is arguably the second best profession for non-tanks. The two bonus gem slots are comparable to the bonuses other professions give (with rare gems) and become much more powerful with epic gems. The customization is probably what pushes it over the top. If you can get by with raw SP or AP, then Inscription/Leatherworking/Alchemy are all reasonable alternatives to Blacksmithing.

---

Summary-

Tanks: Jewelcrafting and Leatherworking
Non-tanks that want not-AP/SP: Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing
Non-tanks with AP/SP only: Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing/Inscription/Alchemy/Leatherworking/Enchanting

Things that can cause this to change - epic gems (kills the power of Jewelcrafting and greatly increases the power of Blacksmithing) and a bracer enchant that's 48 stamina worse than Fur Lining- Stamina.

 

Roywyn

Two things:

[1) Enchanting is on par with Scribe/Alchemists, or am I missing something?] Ah, you edited that in.

2) Tailoring is good for ... Warriors/DKs I think? Basically for classes that get more out of "100 average AP" than "[22 agi or 23 haste] + another profession".

I'm quite certain it's better than BS for the classes listed above, and possibly for some more classes at some or most gear levels. It's a nontrivial choice though, and may or may not yield more than the other professions.

Lightweave is junk.

Darkweave depends on the cooldown. Some classes may get a lot more out of whatever amount of mp5 it gives than "[23 haste or 10 spirit] + another profession" give.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

Copernicus

1. I forgot enchanting, and edited it back in.

2. Yeah, Darkglow is possibly useful for healers with mana issues. The blacksmith alternatives are 12 mana/5 or 32 Spirit (plus 10 spirit or 23 Haste). Swordguard is an option for classes that don't like Agility or Haste - but even so, the blacksmithing option could be better because it gives it in Strength or rating instead of raw AP. I really haven't kept up on spreadsheet analysis for other classes though.

3. The Engineering gloves enchant could be really good with other burst abilities. It's a ton of haste (340 haste over 8 seconds every 2 minutes). But then again, that's another individualized spreadsheet thing.

 

Kemortia

I think Blacksmithing / Jewelcrafting is going to be a pretty solid combination for tanking types. It's extremely difficult to make a good judgment on this however since it seems pretty obvious professions aren't done. The complete lack of any specialty crafting for Blacksmithing / Leatherworking, no epic alchemy stones or trinkets from JCing, etc. I was really hoping Blizzard would get this done before they shut down the beta, but no such luck there.

Eek, Shaman

 

Roywyn

Those things get pretty close to splitting hairs and being very situational.
The Engineering Gloves barely break even with normal enchants.

I think Tailoring slightly beats Smithing for exactly those classes, that are traditional smiths.
It's pretty close, and quite mind-boggling really


Engineering has the benefit of getting a great early headpiece.
Inscription has the benefit of also saving you a 40-day reputation grind for Sons of Hodir.
Or giving you a further noticable advantage in your first 2 months or for alts.

The last point is a rather strong point for rerolls I think, or raiding alts.
It's moot if you assume infinte time for rep grinds. But it is a point in the early game.
It's unlikely that relevant Server/World First content will appear in that time though, all content in game right now is generally considered. Except Onyx Sanctuary with multiple drakes up.
Similarly, Attack/Spell Power become weaker over time compared to ratings when you get better gear over time.

I'll stop now before we start splitting hairs on a complex topic. I think that the Inscription rep/time advantage deserves mentioning though, because "Sons of Hodir" rep is such a painfully slow grind.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

Grubsnik

Sorry if this has been mentioned earlier, search didn't show anything on the subject though.

I've got an alt with 362 in enchanting. Looking at WoWhead, i noted that the mats for a runed eternium rod were getting a big reduction, and that there would be skill 350+ enchants working on northrend mats. However... All these enchants require a runed eternium rod. Meaning the nice skill-up spells abilities from wrath are effectively out of reach, until you no longer need them.

Does anyone know if this is just wowhead being slow on the updates, or blizzard missed something big?

 

Fqubed

Blizzard has made this mistake a couple of times, Inscription requires skill 300 mats to get to 300 (or skill up on the last point of green recepie). So bug report it and hope they fix it before next week.

 

Ukerric

Not all of them. You have cheap northrend enchants with a runed adamantite rod. They don't "appear", because wowhead doesn't has the min skill for them, but things like Enchant Cloak - Speed - Spell - World of Warcraft should be on your levelling path (starts at 350).

I noticed wowhead's wotlk site had sometimes problem getting the trainers correct: its inscription set (my main interest) was always correct regarding skill and reagents, but did not update from the revisions of the trainer (leading to trainable skills that did not appear as trainable, or trainable at a rank different from what it was in the game). The information stayed out of date. For example, it still lists all "tier 1" glyphs as trainable at 75: Inscription - Recipes - World of Warcraft even though the glyphs require 75, 80, 85 or 90 to train, and have done so since weeks before 3.0.2 went live.

Of course, it's no longer possible to check in the beta...

 

boomix

I've found that thottbot.com/wotlk site is far better resource then wowhead lately. They have full listing on Blacksmithing with materials and end products. Same goes for almost all of the professions.

One thing that was weird was the Titanuim Bar, it was listed as created by Alchemy and Smelting. Alchemy one was 92 hour cooldown and required a lot more materials then just smelting the bar. Can someone fill in details on this one?

Last night was pessimistic skydive in a foolish narcotic shell

 

Pharmacon

This is on wowhead as well. Transmute gives just another way to make the bars as even the smelting is on a 20 hr CD.

 

Copernicus

Titanium Ore is rare, much like Khorium in TBC. The Alchemy transmute uses common metals to make a Titanium bar.

The smelting transmute with a cooldown converts Titanium (and other materials) to make a Titansteel bar.

 

Pharmacon

Misread something in wowhead. Thanks.

While it does use common metals and makes Titanium, 92 hour CD seems a bit steep, even if it's on a separate CD from other transmutes. 44 or even 68 hours seems more reasonable. Would still give the feeling of it being uncommon.