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Old 06/05/09, 2:28 PM   #476
Astrylian
Rawr
 
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Night Elf Druid
 
Stormrage
Originally Posted by GravityDK View Post
Hi all,
I have written a user guide for TankPoints which you all may find helpful for educating non-serious-theorycrafters. The guide should help a person with decisions like which enchant is better for you, what damage reduction you get in Frost resist gear and more.

To save multiple original posts, I am going to maintain this thread at dk.info with the latest version of the file.

I am notifying here because this is the authoritive thread on combat ratings. I have PM'd Whitetooth about this too.
TankPoints is an entirely flawed stat, by design. Why are people still using it, and why are you encouraging people to still use it (and posting about it in an accuracy-focused thread like this one)?

Rawr!

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Old 06/05/09, 8:20 PM   #477
charriu
Piston Honda
 
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Tauren Druid
 
Gorgonnash (EU)
Originally Posted by Astrylian View Post
TankPoints is an entirely flawed stat, by design. Why are people still using it, and why are you encouraging people to still use it (and posting about it in an accuracy-focused thread like this one)?
TankPoints happens to also be an addon, which is what he's describing. And by the way, his guide clearly states that the tank points score isn't really useful for anything except seeing if an item is better or worse than something you already have equipped.

Maybe the addon name could be better.

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Old 06/05/09, 8:35 PM   #478
Astrylian
Rawr
 
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Night Elf Druid
 
Stormrage
Originally Posted by charriu View Post
the tank points score isn't really useful for anything except seeing if an item is better or worse than something you already have equipped.
Except that's the problem. People think that, when it's entirely untrue, and completely misleading. I fully realize that TankPoints is an addon.

Rawr!

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Old 06/06/09, 3:59 AM   #479
GravityDK
Piston Honda
 
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Tauren Death Knight
 
Dath'Remar
Originally Posted by Astrylian View Post
Except that's the problem. People think that, when it's entirely untrue, and completely misleading. I fully realize that TankPoints is an addon.
But TankPoints has many other very valuable features, and it just happens to be named after its least-scientific quality. I'd hope my guide also helps people realise that the TankPoints score per se isn't why you get the addon.

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Old 06/06/09, 5:13 AM   #480
Boevis
Bald Bull
 
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Tauren Druid
 
Lightbringer
Isn't the function of "This item is better than this other item" performed by addons such as Rating Buster without the bias of TankPoints (and others that I can't remember). I understand that you can use it to figure out your damage reduction (armor+stance+buffs) and whatnot, but you can also do that with windows calculator or a piece of paper. Is the "non-serious" theorycrafting community so lazy they need an addon to give the same information as wowwiki?

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Old 06/06/09, 7:52 AM   #481
GravityDK
Piston Honda
 
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Tauren Death Knight
 
Dath'Remar
Originally Posted by Boevis View Post
I understand that you can use it to figure out your damage reduction (armor+stance+buffs) and whatnot, but you can also do that with windows calculator or a piece of paper. Is the "non-serious" theorycrafting community so lazy they need an addon to give the same information as wowwiki?
Not so much as lazy but just that all humans are different. Some like delving into maths, others don't.
Regardless, TankPoints has a very helpful calculator that is much faster at working out (for example) the net DR benefits of changing dodge, parry and defense all at the same time than even we maths people could do it on a normal calculator with wowwiki.

Also useful to estimate damage reduction in your FrR gear, so an abstract value like "355" can be turned into a more meaningful x% reduction.

It's very convenient and its calculator is accurate too.

I think the TankPoints scores are the controversial aspect, and the confusion brought from the addon being named after that construction.

This discussion is probably not very EJ appropriate though; the merits/pro/cons of an addon. Suggest we stick to the thread topic.

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Old 06/07/09, 5:03 AM   #482
ebs2002
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Warrior
 
Sisters of Elune
Just looking for clarification here:
-ArPen is capped at 100%
-Debuffs (FF,Sunder,ShatteringThrow) stack multiplicatively
-Buffs stack additively, and work towards your ArPen cap (ie, with Mace Spec or battle stance, you stop seeing any benefit at 90% armor penetration rating)

I'm fairly certain on the first two, but is the last statement correct? That the arpen rating cap is reduced with mace spec or battle stance?

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Old 06/07/09, 8:24 AM   #483
hellord
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Hellscream (EU)
Originally Posted by ebs2002 View Post
Just looking for clarification here:
-ArPen is capped at 100%
-Debuffs (FF,Sunder,ShatteringThrow) stack multiplicatively
-Buffs stack additively, and work towards your ArPen cap (ie, with Mace Spec or battle stance, you stop seeing any benefit at 90% armor penetration rating)

I'm fairly certain on the first two, but is the last statement correct? That the arpen rating cap is reduced with mace spec or battle stance?
They are all correct at least in 3.1.2+

ArP Whore

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Old 06/09/09, 4:16 PM   #484
Capstone
Piston Honda
 
Human Paladin
 
Lightbringer
Originally Posted by Astrylian View Post
TankPoints is an entirely flawed stat, by design. Why are people still using it, and why are you encouraging people to still use it (and posting about it in an accuracy-focused thread like this one)?
I'm pretty confused by this attitude. What makes you think TankPoints is such a bad addon?

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Old 06/24/09, 4:23 AM   #485
pilger81
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Nethersturm (EU)
In 3.2 Resilience will be buffed.
Are there any numbers yet and a math "genius" able and eager to calculate the new combat ratings at level 80?

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Old 06/25/09, 12:47 AM   #486
Prinsesa
Bald Bull
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Echo Isles
The conversion ratio for resilience did not change at all.

At level 80, 82 resilience rating will reduce your chance to be crit by 1%, reduce all damage you take from players by 1%, reduce crit damage you take by 2.2% and reduce mana drains by 2.2%

The resilience soft-cap is still at 1230 resilience rating, when you hit the 33% crit damage reduction limit.

Crit chance and mana drain reduction remain uncapped, although it is unknown at this time whether the global damage reduction is capped.

"We do want Sanctuary to be the tanking seal"

- Ghostcrawler

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Old 07/08/09, 1:49 AM   #487
Hinalover
Piston Honda
 
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Draenei Mage
 
Windrunner
PTR Build 10072 Patch Notes

Items: General

* Agility: The amount of agility required per percentage of dodge has been increased by 15%. This change required recalibrating the amount of dodge a player has with 0 agility by a slight amount as well, so all players will see their dodge percentage vary a small amount.
* Dodge Rating: The amount of dodge rating required per percentage of dodge has been increased by 15%. This is before diminishing returns. Combined with other changes, this makes dodge rating and parry rating equally potent before diminishing returns apply.
* Parry Rating: The amount of parry rating required per percentage of parry has been reduced by 8%. This is before diminishing returns. Combined with other changes, this makes dodge rating and parry rating equally potent before diminishing returns apply. Parry still diminishes more quickly than dodge.
Just updating this threat with the latest news.

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Old 07/09/09, 11:52 PM   #488
Prinsesa
Bald Bull
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Echo Isles
While I'm not on the PTR to test if the implementation is correct, this would mean that:

* Dodge Rating's conversion rate at level 80 has gone up, from 39.34798813 to 45.25018635
* Parry Rating's conversion rate at level 80 has gone down, from 49.18498611 to 45.25018722

"We do want Sanctuary to be the tanking seal"

- Ghostcrawler

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Old 07/29/09, 9:57 AM   #489
Whitetooth
Piston Honda
 
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Orc Warlock
 
Ner'zhul
New data from build 3.2.0.10147 (7/29/2009).

RatingLevel 60Level 70Level 80
Resilience28.7545.3365440494.27122498
Dodge13.821.7615394545.25018692
Parry13.821.7615394545.25018692

 Base Dodge(3.1.3)Base Dodge(3.2.0)
Warrior3.463603.66400
Paladin3.268503.49430
Hunter-5.45000-4.08730
Rogue-0.590002.09570
Priest3.183003.41780
Deathknight3.463603.66400
Shaman1.675002.10800
Mage3.457503.65870
Warlock2.035002.42110
Druid4.951005.60970

Edit: Some base dodge values were off by 0.04, fixed now.

Last edited by Whitetooth : 08/09/09 at 11:56 AM.

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
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Old 08/04/09, 11:34 AM   #490
Cathela
Still Bald Bull
 
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Human Paladin
 
Earthen Ring
The OP in this thread still shows the 3.1 agility->dodge conversion rates (in the avoidance-DR table). It's confirmed that on the last PTR build the conversion factor for paladins at least has been increased by 15% as stated in the patch notes.

Thanks by the way for maintaining the OP, Whitetooth. It's been very handy for me on many occasions.

My comrades are my weapons, and I am their shield.

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Old 08/06/09, 2:53 PM   #491
GravityDK
Piston Honda
 
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Tauren Death Knight
 
Dath'Remar
Many people are visiting the TankPoints user guide and looking for 3.2 compatible version.

Please update the addon, Whitetooth.

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Old 08/07/09, 10:01 AM   #492
Boevis
Bald Bull
 
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Tauren Druid
 
Lightbringer
As was made apparent in the druid forums, the OP is also still listing ArP as 15.39 when it's infact 12.32 as mentioned earlier in this thread.

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Old 08/09/09, 12:33 PM   #493
Whitetooth
Piston Honda
 
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Orc Warlock
 
Ner'zhul
Originally Posted by Cathela View Post
The OP in this thread still shows the 3.1 agility->dodge conversion rates (in the avoidance-DR table). It's confirmed that on the last PTR build the conversion factor for paladins at least has been increased by 15% as stated in the patch notes.

Thanks by the way for maintaining the OP, Whitetooth. It's been very handy for me on many occasions.
I could use some help with the 3.2 agility -> dodge data, since I only have 1 level 80 character, I'm unable to determine the conversion rate for other classes.

Here's how you can help, get the latest(r66 or newer) LibStatLogic addon: WoW AddOns - LibStatLogic-1.1 - Files - WowAce.com

Log in your level 80 toons and type this in chat: /dump StatLogic:GetDodgePerAgi()

It should give you the dodge/agi for your class at level 80.


Current dodge/agi table:
 Lv80 Dodge/Agi(3.1.3)Lv80 Dodge/Agi(3.2.0)Base Dodge(3.1.3)Base Dodge(3.2.0)
Warrior0.0136000.0118003.463603.66400
Paladin0.0192000.0167003.268503.49430
Hunter0.0133000.011600-5.45000-4.08730
Rogue0.0241000.020900-0.590002.09570
Priest0.0192000.0167003.183003.41780
Deathknight0.0136000.0118003.463603.66400
Shaman0.0192000.0167001.675002.10800
Mage0.0195000.0170003.457503.65870
Warlock0.0192000.0167002.035002.42110
Druid0.0240000.0209004.951005.60970

Thanks to:
TNSe: Priest
Meatnog: Paladin
The Not So Evil: Druid, Shaman
Hinalover: Mage
Ufthak: Hunter

Last edited by Whitetooth : 08/26/09 at 3:48 AM.

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

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Old 08/09/09, 5:29 PM   #494
Meatnog
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Lethon
Paladin prot level 80: 0.0167

(Blakeley on The Venture Co - Horde)

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Old 08/09/09, 6:44 PM   #495
The Not So Evil
Piston Honda
 
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Night Elf Priest
 
Trollbane (EU)
Druid: 0.0209
Shaman: 0.0167

Rawr - Coder of HolyPriest (Healer) and ShadowPriest (DPS) Modules.
Get Your Rawr 2.3.x!

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Old 08/09/09, 9:58 PM   #496
Hinalover
Piston Honda
 
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Draenei Mage
 
Windrunner
Mage: 0.017

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Old 08/15/09, 5:34 PM   #497
GravityDK
Piston Honda
 
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Tauren Death Knight
 
Dath'Remar
Death Knight 0.0073
Hunter 0.0133

used r67 (by replacing the one within RatingBuster with that new Lib)

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Old 08/17/09, 12:05 PM   #498
Archi86
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warrior
 
Bloodhoof (EU)
Rogue 80: 0.0242

Edit: However got following value when completely naked: 0.0366 I used R69

Last edited by Archi86 : 08/17/09 at 12:15 PM.

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Old 08/17/09, 7:35 PM   #499
Hinalover
Piston Honda
 
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Draenei Mage
 
Windrunner
Originally Posted by Archi86 View Post
Rogue 80: 0.0242

Edit: However got following value when completely naked: 0.0366 I used R69
Yea, I got a different number on my feral druid as well.
Night Elf Female: .0208

I can try with nothing on and untalented later if needbe.

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Old 08/17/09, 11:42 PM   #500
Whitetooth
Piston Honda
 
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Orc Warlock
 
Ner'zhul
Originally Posted by Hinalover View Post
Yea, I got a different number on my feral druid as well.
Night Elf Female: .0208

I can try with nothing on and untalented later if needbe.
I'll be interested if anyone gets different numbers and what caused it(most likely some talent or buff modifying dodge I missed), because that means something is broken and I'd like to fix it

I made some fixes to LibStatLogic, please use r69 or newer, thanks!

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

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