Elitist Jerks Combat Ratings at level 85 (Cataclysm)

09/30/10, 10:23 PM   #541
Warrok
Von Kaiser

Orc Warrior

Antonidas (EU)
 Originally Posted by Kurtov Does this mean that parry still has a lower cap than dodge, even though they now have the same mechanics? Logically, parry should have the same cap as dodge.
A quick test on the PTR tells me that the cap was changed. I took a DK with ~880 dodge and ~690 parry and reforged some dodge to parry. My avoidance totals (dodge + parry) grew up to some point (at which parry was slightly higher than dodge which I find a bit odd but anyway) until after the total declined again. So this is not really exact but they appear to be somewhat equalized.

I actually wanted to test it on the warrior as I have a lot more gear available, though the PTR decided to permanently disconnect me on this character. Maybe someone else can do a little bit more in depth analysis.

09/30/10, 11:14 PM   #542
Whitetooth
Piston Honda

Orc Warlock

Ner'zhul
 Originally Posted by Warrok A quick test on the PTR tells me that the cap was changed. I took a DK with ~880 dodge and ~690 parry and reforged some dodge to parry. My avoidance totals (dodge + parry) grew up to some point (at which parry was slightly higher than dodge which I find a bit odd but anyway) until after the total declined again. So this is not really exact but they appear to be somewhat equalized. I actually wanted to test it on the warrior as I have a lot more gear available, though the PTR decided to permanently disconnect me on this character. Maybe someone else can do a little bit more in depth analysis.
I'll try do some tests this weekend if I get the time too.

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

 10/01/10, 5:24 AM #543 Yörgle Piston Honda     Yorgle Pandaren Monk   Elune (EU) I'd appreciate the ratio between agility and dodge for war / pal / dk who are 85 if somebody can provide that. =) If I level 85 with my DK before it's posted, i'll give the ratio for this class.
 10/02/10, 5:13 AM #544 Whitetooth Piston Honda     Hotdogee Orc Warlock   Ner'zhul First post updated with 4.0.1.13117 base dodge values, this is needed for dodge/agi. Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US Author of RatingBuster
10/02/10, 10:40 AM   #545
Whitetooth
Piston Honda

Orc Warlock

Ner'zhul
I stumbled upon something else when checking avoidance dr caps, and I took a detour of figuring out the resistance formula for all levels up to level 88.

Thanks to Shamgarr's great post on the "Resistance Mechanics in WotLK", we have two good formulas that accurately describe:
1. The average damage reduction($\overline{DR}$), given the resistance value($Resist$) and a level dependent constant($C_R$):

$\overline{DR}=\frac{Resist}{Resist+C_R}$

2. The probability of each partial resist($P(X)$), given the average damage reduction:

$P(X)=0.5-2.5\times|X - \overline{DR}|$

But there was one last piece of the puzzle that was left unsolved, the formula for the level dependent resistance constant which I shell show in this post.

First, I have verified that the average damage reduction formula in Cataclysm (4.0.3.13117) hasn't changed and that the level 80 constant is indeed 400.
Up until now, the level 83 constant(for wotlk bosses) has not been accurately identified, it was narrowed down to somewhere between 506 and 514 and assumed to be 510.
My findings show that the constant for level 83 is exactly 506.5.

In 4.0.1, Blizzard added a new API that takes a level and a resistance value and returns the average damage reduction percentage.
The resistance constant is actually the given resistance value, where you get a average damage reduction of 50%.
So I quickly whipped up some addon code that gives me the 50% resistance value from level 1 to 100, and it gave me this:

50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,52.5,55,57.5,60,62.5,65,67.5,70,72.5,75,77.5,80,82.5,85,87.5,90,92.5,95,97.5,100,102.5,105,107.5,110,112.5,115,117.5,120,122.5,125,127.5,130,132.5,135,137.5,140,142.5,145,147.5,150,143.5,139,136.5,136,137.5,141,146.5,154,163.5,175,188.5,204,221.5,241,262.5,286,311.5,339,368.5,400,433.5,469,506.5,546,587.5,631,676.5,724,773.5,825,878.5,934,991.5,1051,1112.5,1176,1241.5,1309,1378.5,1450
From these numbers we can derive the resistance constant formula to be:
Level 1 to 20: $C_R=50$
Level 21 to 60: $C_R=50 + (level - 20) \times 2.5$
Level 61 to 100: $C_R=150 + (level - 60) \times (level - 67.5)$

Using this formula, we can calculate the resistance constant at level 83 to be 150+(83-60)*(83-67.5)=506.5

And a quick reference table:
 Resistance Values (Rounded to the first decimal) Average Damage Reduction \ Levels 60 70 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 5% 7.9 9.2 21.1 22.8 24.7 26.7 28.7 30.9 33.2 35.6 38.1 10% 16.7 19.4 44.4 48.2 52.1 56.3 60.7 65.3 70.1 75.2 80.4 15% 26.5 30.9 70.6 76.5 82.8 89.4 96.4 103.7 111.4 119.4 127.8 20% 37.5 43.8 100.0 108.4 117.3 126.6 136.5 146.9 157.8 169.1 181.0 25% 50.0 58.3 133.3 144.5 156.3 168.8 182.0 195.8 210.3 225.5 241.3 30% 64.3 75.0 171.4 185.8 201.0 217.1 234.0 251.8 270.4 289.9 310.3 35% 80.8 94.2 215.4 233.4 252.5 272.7 294.0 316.3 339.8 364.3 389.8 40% 100.0 116.7 266.7 289.0 312.7 337.7 364.0 391.7 420.7 451.0 482.7 45% 122.7 143.2 327.3 354.7 383.7 414.4 446.7 480.7 516.3 553.5 592.4 50%(Resistance Constant) 150.0 175.0 400.0 433.5 469.0 506.5 546.0 587.5 631.0 676.5 724.0 55% 183.3 213.9 488.9 529.8 573.2 619.1 667.3 718.1 771.2 826.8 884.9 60% 225.0 262.5 600.0 650.3 703.5 759.8 819.0 881.3 946.5 1014.8 1086.0 65% 278.6 325.0 742.9 805.1 871.0 940.6 1014.0 1091.1 1171.9 1256.4 1344.6 70% 350.0 408.3 933.3 1011.5 1094.3 1181.8 1274.0 1370.8 1472.3 1578.5 1689.3 75% 450.0 525.0 1200.0 1300.5 1407.0 1519.5 1638.0 1762.5 1893.0 2029.5 2172.0

Also using this API, we can varify that the damage reduction is capped at 75% like armor reduction.

Last edited by Whitetooth : 10/03/10 at 2:30 AM.

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

10/03/10, 1:02 PM   #546
Whitetooth
Piston Honda

Orc Warlock

Ner'zhul
Avoidance DR Mechanics in Cataclysm

The DR formula remains the same:

$\frac{1}{x'} = \frac{1}{c}+\frac{k}{x}}$

where
$x'$ is the avoidance after DR.
$x$ is the avoidance before DR.
$c$ is a class dependent cap of the stat.
$k$ is also a class dependent constant.

What has changed:
1. Dodge and Parry caps($C_d$,$C_p$) for Warriors, Paladins, and Death Knights are now the same.
2. With Defense Rating removed, there is no longer a way to increase chance to be missed. Therefore $C_m$ is also removed.

Warriors, Paladins, and Death Knights now all get 25% Strength as Parry Rating as a base skill, with all decimals floored.

The updated table for 4.0.3.13117:
$k$$C_p$$1/C_p$$C_d$$1/C_d$
Warrior 0.956065.631440 0.0152366065.631440 0.01523660
Hunter 0.9880145.5604080.006870 145.5604080.006870
Rogue 0.9880145.5604080.006870 145.5604080.006870
Priest 0.9830N/A N/A 150.3759400.006650
Death Knight0.956065.631440 0.0152366065.631440 0.01523660
Shaman 0.9880145.5604080.006870 145.5604080.006870
Mage 0.9830N/A N/A 150.3759400.006650
Warlock 0.9830N/A N/A 150.3759400.006650
Druid 0.9720N/A N/A 116.8907070.008555

Base Dodge and Dodge/Agi table for 4.0

Base Agi Lv80 Dodge/Agi Lv80 Agi/1%Dodge Lv85 Dodge/Agi Lv85 Agi/1%Dodge
Warrior 3.7580 0.01359620 73.54996004 0.002321840 430.69289874
Paladin 3.6520 0.01923890 51.97802369 0.003283990 304.50762639
Hunter -5.450 0.01332660 75.03789414 0.002272730 439.99947200
Rogue -0.590 0.02405370 41.57364309 0.004106500 243.51637648
Priest 3.1830 0.01923660 51.98423838 0.003289470 304.00034048
Death Knight 3.6640 0.01359620 73.54996249 0.002321840 430.69289874
Shaman 1.6750 0.01923660 51.98423594 0.003289470 304.00034048
Mage 3.4575 0.01952530 51.21560232 0.003331530 300.16238785
Warlock 2.0350 0.01923660 51.98423838 0.003285640 304.35470715
Druid 4.9510 0.02404580 41.58730423 0.004105380 243.58281085

Thanks to:
• Hinalover: Level 80 data from different races for Mage, Priest, and Death Knight. (source)
• Althor: Level 85 data from different races for Shaman, Hunter, Rogue, and Warlock. (source)

Just like before, I'm unable to complete the whole table by myself. Because I can only have so many premades, I'm looking for a few contributors to fill in the missing cells.

If you'd like to contribute but don't want to waste time on the calculations, I've coded all the required math in my addon LibStatLogic.
2. Log on one of the class/level combinations with missing data
3. Unlearn all talents
4. Make sure you DON'T have any buffs on you(especially Kings and MotW!)
5. Take off all of your gear(Unless you are a 85 hunter, then you need to have enough gear on so you don't have 0% dodge)
6. Type:
/dump StatLogic:GetDodgePerAgi()
7. You should see something like this: (This is the result for a level 80 Hunter)
Thanks!

Last edited by Whitetooth : 10/22/10 at 10:36 AM.

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

 10/03/10, 11:07 PM #547 ziff Piston Honda   Wormwart Orc Shaman   Feathermoon I noticed that there was a new calculation for the armor mitigiation constant on the top posting. So is the current theory that the following calculation is no longer relevant for level 81 - 85? C=400+85*targetlevel+4.5*85*(targetlevel-59) I'm specifically referring to the constant used to figure out effective armor pentatration from, Armor penetration - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft. Using that calculation, the constant would be 17570 but it seems the new proposed constant is 26070. Am I correct in thinking that we should be using 26070 as the constant to figure out the effective armor penetration?
10/04/10, 1:22 AM   #548
Whitetooth
Piston Honda

Orc Warlock

Ner'zhul
 Originally Posted by ziff I noticed that there was a new calculation for the armor mitigiation constant on the top posting. So is the current theory that the following calculation is no longer relevant for level 81 - 85? C=400+85*targetlevel+4.5*85*(targetlevel-59) I'm specifically referring to the constant used to figure out effective armor pentatration from, Armor penetration - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft. Using that calculation, the constant would be 17570 but it seems the new proposed constant is 26070. Am I correct in thinking that we should be using 26070 as the constant to figure out the effective armor penetration?
Correct. But the ArP stat has been removed. Are there classes that still has ArP?

Last edited by Whitetooth : 10/04/10 at 1:35 AM.

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

 10/04/10, 2:03 AM #549 dustdog Piston Honda   Mizan Draenei Paladin   Arthas Colossus Smash(trainable ability) for warriors allows them to bypass all armour for 6 seconds, 20 second cooldown. Seems like that might be about it.
10/04/10, 3:29 AM   #550
Shan
Piston Honda

Draenei Warrior

Ravencrest (EU)
 Originally Posted by Whitetooth Correct. But the ArP stat has been removed. Are there classes that still has ArP?
While technically not ArP, Shattering Throw still reduces armor by 20%.

 10/04/10, 8:34 PM #551 Hinalover Don Flamenco     Delritha Pandaren Monk   Kil'Jaeden Using 4.0.1 PTR (13131) Release version I had the race change option available and wanted to see if there was any variation to race/class combo. There is a small variation but it doesn't look all that major. 80 Mage Troll - 0.01952594409858 Undead - 0.019525306515577 BE - 0.019525294409858 Human - 0.019525305725807 Gnome - 0.01952594409858 Draenei - 0.019525300979614 80 Priest Human - 0.01923603755577 Dwarf - 0.01923659639412 NE - 0.019236600910534 Draenei - 0.019236606200536 80 DK Human - 0.013596198695047 Dwarf - 0.013596199494821 NE - 0.013596202061094 Gnome - 0.013596196224815 Draenei - 0.013596198195711 Orc - 0.013596198195711 Undead - 0.013596196920222 Tauren - 0.013596199494821 Troll - 0.013596196224815 BE - 0.013596196224815 If you want I can do this for druids, hunters, and paladins as well, since those are the other 3 classes I have on the PTR. Edit: created a few premades; updating info for priests and DKs Last edited by Hinalover : 10/05/10 at 1:39 AM.
10/05/10, 11:36 AM   #552
Whitetooth
Piston Honda

Orc Warlock

Ner'zhul
 Originally Posted by Hinalover Using 4.0.1 PTR (13131) Release version I had the race change option available and wanted to see if there was any variation to race/class combo. There is a small variation but it doesn't look all that major. 80 Mage Troll - 0.01952594409858 Undead - 0.019525306515577 BE - 0.019525294409858 Human - 0.019525305725807 Gnome - 0.01952594409858 Draenei - 0.019525300979614 80 Priest Human - 0.01923603755577 Dwarf - 0.01923659639412 NE - 0.019236600910534 Draenei - 0.019236606200536 80 DK Human - 0.013596198695047 Dwarf - 0.013596199494821 NE - 0.013596202061094 Gnome - 0.013596196224815 Draenei - 0.013596198195711 Orc - 0.013596198195711 Undead - 0.013596196920222 Tauren - 0.013596199494821 Troll - 0.013596196224815 BE - 0.013596196224815 If you want I can do this for druids, hunters, and paladins as well, since those are the other 3 classes I have on the PTR. Edit: created a few premades; updating info for priests and DKs
Thanks for the complete data for Mage, Priest, and Death Knight, I've updated the table with your numbers.
Would be great if you could provide data for Druids and Hunters for verification(Paladins have been verified).
Note that Hunters are a bit tricky, if the hunter has 0% dodge, you need to put on enough gear until it has more then 0% dodge before running the script.

Last edited by Whitetooth : 10/05/10 at 11:47 AM.

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

 10/05/10, 12:11 PM #553 Hinalover Don Flamenco     Delritha Pandaren Monk   Kil'Jaeden 80 Druid NE - 0.024045796993167 Tauren - 0.024045794120202 80 Hunter Dwarf - 0.013326600433262 NE - 0.013326600822697 Draenei - 0.013326600669595 Orc - 0.01332660066595 Tauren - 0.013326600433262 Troll - 0.013326600495986 BE - 0.013326600495986 80 Priest (Horde) Undead - 0.019236605352285 Troll - 0.019236602279375 BE - 0.019236602279375 Lastly I do have a few more transfers I can do. I can do this also for Rogues, and any 2 other premades you want me to make. I could quickly finish leveling my warlock from 77 to 80 and get those numbers as well Last edited by Hinalover : 10/05/10 at 3:07 PM.
10/05/10, 5:11 PM   #554
Rouncer

Orc Shaman

Mal'Ganis
 Originally Posted by Whitetooth Correct. But the ArP stat has been removed. Are there classes that still has ArP?
It's more about sorting out the DR for bosses for EnhSim and determining what armor value we should be including in the default level 85 config.

I did some playing around with the Raid Boss Dummy on the Beta at level 85 and determined it was running 31.55% damage reduction. White 2H Axe with a damage range of 1367 - 1373 on the character panel gave a damage range of 936 - 940 on that Dummy. Using that new formula showed an armor value of 12016 and Ziff just wanted to check on that new formula before it gets incorporated into the sim.

Anecdotally Gonk beast lored a level 87 beast mob in a normal instance run and it showed 11682 armor.

10/06/10, 1:02 AM   #555
Whitetooth
Piston Honda

Orc Warlock

Ner'zhul
 Originally Posted by Hinalover 80 Druid NE - 0.024045796993167 Tauren - 0.024045794120202 80 Hunter Dwarf - 0.013326600433262 NE - 0.013326600822697 Draenei - 0.013326600669595 Orc - 0.01332660066595 Tauren - 0.013326600433262 Troll - 0.013326600495986 BE - 0.013326600495986 80 Priest (Horde) Undead - 0.019236605352285 Troll - 0.019236602279375 BE - 0.019236602279375 Lastly I do have a few more transfers I can do. I can do this also for Rogues, and any 2 other premades you want me to make. I could quickly finish leveling my warlock from 77 to 80 and get those numbers as well
Very nice, that confirms all level 80 values except Rogue. Please do Rogues if you have time, thanks

Hotdogee@Ner'zhul US <Bahamut>
Author of RatingBuster

 Elitist Jerks Combat Ratings at level 85 (Cataclysm)