Elitist Jerks
Register
Blogs
Forums


Go Back   Elitist Jerks » Public Discussion » Public Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01/20/09, 7:24 AM   #1516
Kaejin
Great Tiger
 
Kaejin's Avatar
 
Troll Death Knight
 
Mal'Ganis
Something I'm interested in is any possible follow-ups to the quest Pure Evil in Zul'Drak (where the various members of the Argent Crusade attempt to study a chunk of Saronite).

Quest:Pure Evil - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft

The message the quest seems to get across is that Saronite is nearly indestructible, at least by conventional methods. The Ashbringer was redeemed through the power of the light, both as raw materials before it was forged, and again at Light's Hope. Saronite on the other hand reacted violently when an attempt to use the Light on it was made.

Is this a property unique to Saronite, or is it common among the all things related to Old Gods/Yogg? Where salvation from the Scourge and the Lich King seem to be somewhat of a regular occurrence, to date I don't believe there has been a quest where anyone suffering from corruption by an Old God has been saved. I'm not so sure Thorim can be redeemed if he' been corrupted.

Moreover, I'm not so sure about the confict between Arthas and Yogg, if you can call it that. It's noted in a quest that mention of Yogg-Saron among the scourge causes unrest, but for all of Arthas's exploitation of Saronite and general abuse, Yogg and his followers seem largely unconcerned with him. Loken and the Iron Dwarves ignore the Scourge completely (or at least there are no encounters between them), for instance. I don't think Arthas has any real power over Yogg. The relationship between the Scourge and Yogg seems mostly like the former are a rodent infestation of some sort.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 7:43 AM   #1517
Faldrath
Piston Honda
 
Faldrath's Avatar
 
Human Warlock
 
Steamwheedle Cartel
Originally Posted by Kaejin View Post
Is this a property unique to Saronite, or is it common among the all things related to Old Gods/Yogg? Where salvation from the Scourge and the Lich King seem to be somewhat of a regular occurrence, to date I don't believe there has been a quest where anyone suffering from corruption by an Old God has been saved. I'm not so sure Thorim can be redeemed if he' been corrupted.
In the AQ quest chain, you (well, Tyrande and Remulos) rescue Eranikus from his corruption, which was supposedly caused by the Old Gods.

Last edited by Faldrath : 01/20/09 at 7:53 AM.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 9:05 AM   #1518
Enova
Great Tiger
 
Enova's Avatar
 
Night Elf Hunter
 
Moonglade (EU)
Originally Posted by Faldrath View Post
In the AQ quest chain, you (well, Tyrande and Remulos) rescue Eranikus from his corruption, which was supposedly caused by the Old Gods.
It's quite interesting, now that you mention it.

While undeath and generally the Scourge are some twisted manipulations of life and can be combated with forces of the Light, the old god corruption are an offense to nature, and can be removed with primal, natural energies? That would actually add some background to the already existing druid - Old God feud, and it would actually hint that you would need Ysera's help before we tackle Yogg'saron. Like I said, quite interesting, and this can very well lead to a lot of possibilities.

Originally Posted by XI- View Post
In summary, TBC raiding is easy. 9/10 encounters can be summarized with 1 phrase. Stay out of the fucking fire. If this is too difficult BWL was still there last I checked, so go have at it for some practice.
Originally Posted by Kaubel View Post
You people are idiots
Guilty as charged ^

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 9:33 AM   #1519
Rerox
Piston Honda
 
Rerox's Avatar
 
Dwarf Rogue
 
Proudmoore (EU)
I am wondering, why noone yet suggested that maybe Loken himself might be the endboss of Ulduar?
OK not the feeble Version you kill in Halls of lightning, but the new, improved, buffed-by-yogg-saron-version.

For me that's much more likely than Thorim. He'll surely be there, and i find the idea of teh four watchers quite compelling, but I don't see Thorim as endboss.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 9:36 AM   #1520
Kaejin
Great Tiger
 
Kaejin's Avatar
 
Troll Death Knight
 
Mal'Ganis
Eranikus was something I completely forgot about. However, as far as nature vs. Old Gods goes, there's still this to consider during the Pure Evil quest:

Eitrigg says: Rayne, Rimblat, what about the power of nature and the elements?
Rimblat Earthshatter says: Let us see if it is truely impervious.
Rimblat casts some nature spell... (Hurricane?) on the pile of saronite
Rimblat Earthshatter says: Nothing.
Rayne says: By the Goddess. It's as if Nature can't touch it!
Perhaps it's just because it's Saronite (the blood or Yogg-Saron, was it?) and hence extra evil.

Something I wonder about is why Yogg doesn't seem to exert any power over Arthas's minions despite such things as ghouls being constructed with shards of Saronite in them and whatnot.

Last edited by Kaejin : 01/20/09 at 9:55 AM. Reason: added more after quote

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 10:01 AM   #1521
Monocle
Don Flamenco
 
Monocle's Avatar
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Durotan
Originally Posted by Rerox View Post
I am wondering, why noone yet suggested that maybe Loken himself might be the endboss of Ulduar?
OK not the feeble Version you kill in Halls of lightning, but the new, improved, buffed-by-yogg-saron-version.

For me that's much more likely than Thorim. He'll surely be there, and i find the idea of teh four watchers quite compelling, but I don't see Thorim as endboss.
As much as I loved Loken, I donlt think we will see him. Bit of a shame, as he had some great build up, and was a entirely new villian. His death pretty much closed his story, other then the light signal blasting on his death.

I wouldn't complain if he did come back though.

You know this is the first raid instance in a long time that has a lot of mystery around it. We have pretty much known stuff about the final bosses of the various raids we have gotten for a long time now. Last time we had a big unknown were the AQ's. I remember what a shcok it was that we were going after an actual old god in AQ40.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 11:48 AM   #1522
songster
Chief Passenger
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Earthen Ring (EU)
Originally Posted by Rerox View Post
I am wondering, why noone yet suggested that maybe Loken himself might be the endboss of Ulduar?
OK not the feeble Version you kill in Halls of lightning, but the new, improved, buffed-by-yogg-saron-version.
This is very very unlikely, for the simple reason that you kill Loken in Halls of Lightning! Blizzard have never put the same boss in two different dungeons without it being explicitly signalled that the boss is not really dead (Kel'thuzad's phylactery, Kael'thas's Verdant Sphere).

Great Britain Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 11:57 AM   #1523
Aezoc
Piston Honda
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Scilla
Originally Posted by songster View Post
This is very very unlikely, for the simple reason that you kill Loken in Halls of Lightning! Blizzard have never put the same boss in two different dungeons without it being explicitly signalled that the boss is not really dead (Kel'thuzad's phylactery, Kael'thas's Verdant Sphere).
Baron Rivendare begs to differ. You even collect his head for a quest. I don't think Blizzard objects to reconning things where they feel its appropriate.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 12:26 PM   #1524
Tyrn
Von Kaiser
 
Tyrn's Avatar
 
Night Elf Warrior
 
Llane
Perhaps Yogg-Saron affects the Scourge because he could be a pure embodiment of chaos itself? In other fantasies (lovecraft comes to mind) there can be a difference with absolute chaos and just being evil. If chaos cannot/does not destroy something, it usually corrupts or drives something insane.

We don't know what the mindset of a Old God is. I don't see why it has to be <stereotypical evil NPC goals>.

I reject your paltry reality and substitute my own.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 12:36 PM   #1525
Enova
Great Tiger
 
Enova's Avatar
 
Night Elf Hunter
 
Moonglade (EU)
If YS' agenda was to enslave every living being on Azeroth, then he would probably be very hostile to the Scourge. However, if it's something larger, like, say, lure the Titans to Azeroth, revenge on whatever faction, or just pure chaos across the world, then the Scourge (as well as the Blue and Black Dragonflights) could very well pave the way towards his end game, either wittingly or otherwise. Hence, it would be in his interest to let things play out and step in at the right time and finish off what was left.

Originally Posted by XI- View Post
In summary, TBC raiding is easy. 9/10 encounters can be summarized with 1 phrase. Stay out of the fucking fire. If this is too difficult BWL was still there last I checked, so go have at it for some practice.
Originally Posted by Kaubel View Post
You people are idiots
Guilty as charged ^

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 12:53 PM   #1526
Blayze
Piston Honda
 
Human Warrior
 
Hellscream (EU)
Looks like blizzplanet broke the street date (5pm Tuesday) on the cover shot and blurb on the new warcraft comic #18 which has Garona on the cover with strange eyes daring people to speculate on her parentage =x
And the peanut gallery keeps growing ever larger, it seems. Issue 18, though? The last I heard of it was issue 14 with Varian Wrynn #1 and #2 combining their powers to form Captain Planet.

We don't know what the mindset of a Old God is.
We can assume the first priority is "Keep myself alive" if things capable of killing it arrive, followed by "Get rid of anything that can kill me".

Far too much stock is placed in the 'explanation' of "We couldn't possibly understand their thoughts", which is -- as far as I care as a writer and reader -- just an excuse not to have to think about character motives at best, and proof of bad writing at worst.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 4:16 PM   #1527
Coffins
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Arthas
Originally Posted by Blayze View Post
Far too much stock is placed in the 'explanation' of "We couldn't possibly understand their thoughts", which is -- as far as I care as a writer and reader -- just an excuse not to have to think about character motives at best, and proof of bad writing at worst.
At the end of the story, sure. You can't really try to humanize (and thus devalue) something that's supposed to be beyond our (read: our character's) understand by pointing out its lack of visible motive. Not to be RP, but the story is interpreted through our characters. If we (as characters in WoW) aren't able to comprehend whatever that is going on, then we won't.

The story isn't over. If after killing/defeating/whatevering Arthas someone decides to point out "Oh hey what about Yogg-Saron," then we can have contempt towards the character/purpose/whatever of a chaotic entity in the story.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 7:59 PM   #1528
Spink
Piston Honda
 
Spink's Avatar
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Frostwolf
Originally Posted by Blayze View Post
And the peanut gallery keeps growing ever larger, it seems. Issue 18, though? The last I heard of it was issue 14 with Varian Wrynn #1 and #2 combining their powers to form Captain Planet.
Calling it #18 based on thread here WoW # 18 - Garona's Affiliation - Scrolls of Lore Forums (lore central)

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 9:53 PM   #1529
Emeraude
Bald Bull
 
Emeraude's Avatar
 
Night Elf Warrior
 
Sargeras
Originally Posted by Spink View Post
Calling it #18 based on thread here WoW # 18 - Garona's Affiliation - Scrolls of Lore Forums (lore central)
Umm, wow.

Yeah we're on Warcraft #14 atm. So a jump to issue 18 is a bit of a leap.

And wow, Garona.

What is the most important thing to you? Won't you grant me the pleasure of taking it away.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 01/20/09, 11:53 PM   #1530
Starfire
Honorary Toastr
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Dragonblight
I don't suppose any of you know of a place to read about the comic books without actually read the comic books. Not that I have issues spending money on that stuff; I just outright hate the format and it makes my eyes hurt.

Originally Posted by arison View Post
Everyone should start from the same place and rise based on their abilities, desires, and schedule. No one plays MMOs to *be* powerful, they play MMOs to *become* powerful. It's the journey, stupid. The rarer loot is, the more cherished it is when you get it, but only so long as there is a reasonable expectation to get it. The rarer loot is, the better it feels when you kill a boss or when $AWESOME_TRINKET drops.

United States Offline
Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Elitist Jerks » Public Discussion » Public Discussion

Thread Tools