he is flooding the market and i dont know what to do. can anyone offer some kind of advice of how to deal with a moron like this??
This has already been commented on, but seriously, this is just competition. If you aren't interested in competing in this way, you are in the wrong business
There may also be a way to co-exist. Try listing your items for the same prices as he does. If he undercuts you, relist and match his prices again. It has worked for me in a few markets, although they tend to be ones where there is limited competition and you are really only competing with 1 or 2 competitors. Infinite Dust is a much more competitive market and will be tougher to come to any type of agreement.
im starting to think i would make more gold by doing herb routes around storm peaks since my server has unually high herb prices and 3.1 is iminent.
At any given time, it is pretty common to find someone who places practically zero value on their time and is quite willing to happily sell items at a loss - they might not even realize it since "they farmed the mats themselves and it is all profit to them". There are *tons* of markets where it really honestly is not worth your time to compete so you should always be ready to go find something else to do if that is the case. Pick and choose your battles and stick to activities where you are not wasting your time.
If anyone is interested I kept on matching that guys prices and eventually he has given up selling. Regarding the type of person he is i really think he is the moron type, although you can argue maybe he was trying to force competition out if you see his gem/gear/spec choices I think you would also conclude he simply doesnt value his time.
Regarding diversifying into selling enchant scrolls, is there any that anyone can recomend as i really dont have a limit to the amount of enchant mats I can produce the only limit on this market is the amount that i can sell without devalueing it too much.
Also after word got out about makeing spellthreads on my server the price of them devalued after the market got flooded and profit from them dropped. I noticed that the people who were makeing them settled down a bit after the initial rush wore off and i managed to pick some up cheap that im slowly reselling. Be on the lookout on your server because this went a bit sour after dominate your server revealed this but its picking back up.
I have tryied to sell several enchant scrolls and the one that sells the easiest is [Enchant Cloak - Major Agility]. Every Physical DPS (i think) use this enchant + Tanks.
8 Dusts = 8 * 5.5 = 44 G
2 Essences = 2 * 15 = 30 G
2 Shards = 2 * 20 = 40 G
1 Scroll = 10 G
I have tryied to sell several enchant scrolls and the one that sells the easiest is [Enchant Cloak - Major Agility]. Every Physical DPS (i think) use this enchant + Tanks.
8 Dusts = 8 * 5.5 = 44 G
2 Essences = 2 * 15 = 30 G
2 Shards = 2 * 20 = 40 G
1 Scroll = 10 G
Total = 124 G
=> I sold them for around 175 / 200 G.
Come 3.1 the Haste back enchant will be much more competitive. At the very least DPS DKs will be using it over Agility.
What I lack in intelligence I make up for in verbosity.
On my server, once a market dies/crashes, it stays dead. A large part of that is that we have at least one CGF who is literally on 24 hours a day farming the AH. Fatfish generally floods and crashes new markets, slash and burn style as opposed to crop rotation style ( to use the very apt farming analogy). Even with verticle integration the profit margins on those crashed markets (which never recover) is so clsoe to zero that, as bumper stickers say, " I'd rather be fishing."
It isn't all fatfish, of coruse. The markets tend to be hyper competative in that the average time till undercut on medium volume items is about 15 minutes, which is why they never recover once crashed.
Beyond focusing on some specialty markets that fatfish hasn't noticed, the only real method I can think of for dealing with this sort of "player" is to try and get them banned. Has any one else found themselves in competition with a chinese gold farmer/farmign alliance( it has to be more than one person due to their 24 hour activity cycle)? If so what did you do?
Cut your losses and sell all your stock to them for a +% on the AH price. If they ever quit the market retake it from there. But if someone has the cash to outlast you and wants to do it, and the server economy permits it, you are out of luck. So use them as a sponge, and feed them anything you can and move on.
The profitable enchant scrolls will be entirely market and timing driven. For example, that above cloak enchant has never been profitable on my server. It's a low volume market so it's very sensitive to just a few producers. Which ones I can sell at a profit constantly changes. In general, offensive stats sell better. Mana regen enchants (spirit, mp5, vitality) are total losers for me. +8 stats to chest is the only somewhat high volume one I've found as it's cheap and not class specific.
I was doing really well with a couple of the higher end AP ones but then a couple people flooded the market with about 20 of them. I think these two people foolishly leveled enchanting by producing the same enchant repeatedly. I've been watching them undercut each other for a couple of weeks while selling 1 or 2 a day total. They are below mats cost now. If I had balls I'd buy them out and slowly release them back into the market. I expect a healthy demand for ready to use enchants once 3.1 hits.
The profitable enchant scrolls will be entirely market and timing driven. For example, that above cloak enchant has never been profitable on my server. It's a low volume market so it's very sensitive to just a few producers. Which ones I can sell at a profit constantly changes. In general, offensive stats sell better. Mana regen enchants (spirit, mp5, vitality) are total losers for me. +8 stats to chest is the only somewhat high volume one I've found as it's cheap and not class specific.
I was doing really well with a couple of the higher end AP ones but then a couple people flooded the market with about 20 of them. I think these two people foolishly leveled enchanting by producing the same enchant repeatedly. I've been watching them undercut each other for a couple of weeks while selling 1 or 2 a day total. They are below mats cost now. If I had balls I'd buy them out and slowly release them back into the market. I expect a healthy demand for ready to use enchants once 3.1 hits.
You would probably just enable them by making them think it's working. Most of the markets that people want to move in right now have a tonne of raw mats behind them. You buy all 15 scrolls and 15 more will spring up an hour later.
If you really want to make the money in 3.1, you'll have to sit on your inventory till 3.1 .
There's no beating someone who'll happily lose gold each sale, much less a pair of them.
I suspect selling enchanting scrolls will vary server by server widely. The absolute trick is to corner a market in which no one else is selling. It's also possible to find high premium niches because of this. It does take some balls however, but if the enchant is viable it should always have some sort of use.
What do I mean by this? an enchant like Berserker will sell; however it'll probably sell very slowly. A lot of people aren't willing to shell out money for a premium enchant unless they've got some sort of KT weapon. Because this is a slow seller, it's highly possible (again, depends on server) there won't be any scrolls on the AH. This enables you to be the sole supplier and put the enchant up at a huge markup. It will sell. But it also means don't be dumb; don't put up an enchant like Black Magic - it's currently useless in any conceivable situation.
Now assuming more fluid enchants: If someone suddenly starts selling [and is undercutting you badly] there's two possibilities (usually).
1.) It's someone who is leveling enchanting and is selling the enchant at a lost to fuel his rapid power leveling.
-- If this is the case, the person should disappear after his current enchants sell, so give the market a few days.
2.) It's someone who is also out to corner the market. And who most likely either does not value their time OR has access to mats cheaper than you do.
-- If this is the case, then it's best to move to a new enchant. Seriously. The way you can tell if this is the case is to see how long this person is listing their enchants. People from case 1 will usually disappear in a few days. People of case 2 will persist longer.
Originally Posted by arison
Everyone should start from the same place and rise based on their abilities, desires, and schedule. No one plays MMOs to *be* powerful, they play MMOs to *become* powerful. It's the journey, stupid. The rarer loot is, the more cherished it is when you get it, but only so long as there is a reasonable expectation to get it. The rarer loot is, the better it feels when you kill a boss or when $AWESOME_TRINKET drops.
@Eldessya -- have you checked on the cross-faction market? It may be somewhere that this guy hasn't bothered to invest, so you may have luck.
I've tried to get back into the speculation game lately, and it's not gone so well. Few people are buying lower level or low quality weapons (especially blue 80 gear); and armor is overrun by badge gear sellers, raids dumping their BOEs, and crafters. I need to do some more research into gear wishlists for DKs, but outside of that, I don't see any amazing places for money making.
I have been lucky, however, to watch Saronite ore drop at the end of every weekend by a large amount (on the order of 20%); so I plan to invest some money there and either resell the ore or send it to my JC alt for prospecting (hold gems for 3.1). I see the Dragon Eye market as oversaturated right now, so I'm going to use the tokens to buy recipes (the char just recently hit >400 skill anyway); and work on rep.
Edit: Has anyone heard any reports about cloth drop rates in Ulduar?
* Find Herbs no longer tracks Glowcaps. * Northrend herbs now yield more herbs on average.
* The herbalism requirement for gathering Tiger Lily has been reduced to 375. * The time it takes to gather herbs has been reduced.
I wonder what kind of impact this will have on the market, especially in the flask department. I built up a rather large stockpile of flasks and the herbs involved making flasks. My question is: will this change negate the impact from the increased demand for flasks or is the difference so small that it doesn't make much of a difference? It would be nice if someone could test how much faster you can gather herbs on the PTR compared to live servers.
I would assume that it'll be reduced to 3 seconds to match mining. Having an herbalist/miner myself, I've found that ever since the change to mining to be 1 hit only, picking herbs has felt like it takes too long. I am curious to find out what "more herbs on average" means. I guess it would be less single herbs and more 2 and 3, but was it ever out of whack before? (i mean were they dropping single herbs more often then they should?)
I am curious to find out what "more herbs on average" means. I guess it would be less single herbs and more 2 and 3, but was it ever out of whack before? (i mean were they dropping single herbs more often then they should?)
You are correct, and its simply to get down herb prices across the board I'd guess.
I would assume that it'll be reduced to 3 seconds to match mining. Having an herbalist/miner myself, I've found that ever since the change to mining to be 1 hit only, picking herbs has felt like it takes too long. I am curious to find out what "more herbs on average" means. I guess it would be less single herbs and more 2 and 3, but was it ever out of whack before? (i mean were they dropping single herbs more often then they should?)
My concern is Frost Lotuses. For months they were 10g each, now 20g+ and 30g during the middle of the week. From my rather limited point of view, everyone uses flasks but people don't often use potions unless it's an emergency, they are undergeared, they are going for a timed achievement or the boss is a DPS check (which also might just indicate they are undergeared).
Are Frost Lotuses the bottleneck rather than the Icethorn and Lichbloom?
I don't believe frost lotuses are the bottleneck, and the inflated prices you are seeing are just server economy based. I feel this is just a move to get it more in line with the changes the dev's have made to mining.
Are Frost Lotuses the bottleneck rather than the Icethorn and Lichbloom?
Shouldn't be considering the excess Frost Lotuses people get from farming for Nobles Decks. I've got over a 100 frost lotus after farming for my Nobles deck and started selling flasks as a result to use some up.
This might be a bit cross-topic from Achievements - but its fairly fitting.
I was wondering about a different topic - loss minimization for Darkmoon rep farming.
Appreciating input if costs can be minimized - and also how one can make money of those grinders.
I´ve looked into the 3 possible deck options(60/70/80) and considered 2 ways to get my 108 decks done for the fair amount of only 30.000 gold and less.
Snipe out [60]Aces as the rest of them are random drops.
Ignore 70 decks as they are fairly unlikely to get done with Aces from instance bosses and 5-8 from instances only.
Focus on 80 decks. Darkmoon Card of the North - Spell - World of Warcraft
It is hard to verify how accurate that calculation is over time, but I´m currently estimating 4 stacks of herbs per card + 30g for eternals - thats roughly 200g.
With nobles prices still above 800g through the deck it appears I can safely sell 1/4th of my cards and sponsor the other 3 quaters from that money back.
Usually I also snipe out any [80]card for 30g and less - which are actually a lot.
Anyone that can check up on above mats or has done something similar?
On Mar 6th, in The icy art of making gold I requested guidance on how to move about 55,000g from server A to server B without excessive risk and while following Blizzard rules. My goal was to buy items on A that would sell for the same or more on B, keeping in mind that 3.1 is not far away.
Now, 10 days later, I'm reporting back with what I did. This is not a recommendation on how YOU should do thing, nor is it advice on 3.1 item speculation (though perhaps implicitly it is, but use it at your own risk). I learned a ton over the past 10 days, reading this forum and others, and studying the AHs on servers A and B. I ended up moving 16,104g on my lvl 70 along with the items listed below.
*When bought on Horde AH and sold on Alliance AH
**Prices listed are for mats; I bought the mats on A and had them crafted; they stack to 20
Notes: Leg kits stack well, but were too pricey on A due to the Orb cost. Some epics were available on A, but with 3.1 looming, epics are dropping fast in perceived value and not moving well. Vanity pets tend to retain value, but I wanted items that would move faster. Twink items are often a good investment, but with the vast changes on PTR to twinks, this market is too risky (eg, Libram enchants just got a lvl 50 min on PTR... librams should now plummet in value). A mechano-hog was discussed above, but I wanted to try and MAKE money on this venture, so I didn't pursue this option.
I ended up with 21 extra inventory slots despite buying some cheaper items above. I bought a few items above that I did not list, such as a [Design: Champion's Monarch Topaz] for 400g since I wouldn't necessarily put this on a snatch list.
Thanks to everyone who offered comments. I hope I didn't over-invest in some items or I'm going to lose my shirt on this. But I can't imagine (for example) Frost Lotuses going below 9g unless Blizz makes them drop in 10-stacks from every herb in Northrend.
This might be a bit cross-topic from Achievements - but its fairly fitting.
I was wondering about a different topic - loss minimization for Darkmoon rep farming.
Appreciating input if costs can be minimized - and also how one can make money of those grinders.
Focus on 80 decks. Darkmoon Card of the North - Spell - World of Warcraft
It is hard to verify how accurate that calculation is over time, but I´m currently estimating 4 stacks of herbs per card + 30g for eternals - thats roughly 200g.
With nobles prices still above 800g through the deck it appears I can safely sell 1/4th of my cards and sponsor the other 3 quaters from that money back.
Usually I also snipe out any [80]card for 30g and less - which are actually a lot.
Anyone that can check up on above mats or has done something similar?
If indeed 1/4 of the cards you create sell for 4 times what it costs you to make the cards (and you turn in the remaing 3/4 for rep), you should break even. However, when you're mass producing cards, chances are your mats will go up in price, and the price of nobles card will go down. The RNG can be pretty streaky, which can work in your favor or make the whole venture very expensive if you sit on a ton of duplicates you produced for 200g a pop that go in the AH for 10g or so.
On my server, the two and the eight of Nobles trade at a substantial premium over the other Nobles cards, which doesn't give me fuzzy feelings when banking on the RNG to bail me out.
The approach I took (especially since I don't have a toon with 400+ Inscription) was to level an alt to 110 Inscription and start cranking out Rogue Decks.
One Milling of Bruiseweed, Mageroyal, Briarthorn, Swiftthistle or Stranglekelp gives you:
100% chance for 2-4 Dusky Pigment
50% chance for 1-3 Verdant Pigment
One milling gives you 3 Dusky Pigments and 0.75 Verdant Pigment on average, and you need 2 Dusky Pigments (= 1 Midnight Ink) and 1 Verdant Pigment (= 1 Hunter's Ink) to make a Rogue's card.
Following this math and my server's prices, it takes me about 8g to make a Rogue Deck, or about 32 silver per point of reputation. There are only three possible cards (Ace, two, three), instead of 32 cards as with Darkmoon Card of the North, so you have a lot less "leftovers" to deal with.
You don't have the upside of hitting it lucky with many nobles cards, but you limit your downside risk.
For 100 Aces I made, I got 127 Twos and 113 Threes.
On Mar 6th, in The icy art of making gold I requested guidance on how to move about 55,000g from server A to server B without excessive risk and while following Blizzard rules. My goal was to buy items on A that would sell for the same or more on B, keeping in mind that 3.1 is not far away.
It's really easier to just mass buy the cheaper left over noble cards 1 week after the monthly darkmoon faire. I have transferred 200k twice that way, with about 5-10% quick and easy profit.
Your approach work okay, but will take too long to cash out those items.
On Mar 6th, in The icy art of making gold I requested guidance on how to move about 55,000g from server A to server B without excessive risk and while following Blizzard rules. My goal was to buy items on A that would sell for the same or more on B, keeping in mind that 3.1 is not far away.
Now, 10 days later, I'm reporting back with what I did. This is not a recommendation on how YOU should do thing, nor is it advice on 3.1 item speculation (though perhaps implicitly it is, but use it at your own risk). I learned a ton over the past 10 days, reading this forum and others, and studying the AHs on servers A and B. I ended up moving 16,104g on my lvl 70 along with the items listed below.
Congratulations on the move and thanks for the follow through.
Your goods look nicely diversified. Please keep it coming. I'm very interested in reading about your experiences actually selling the items post-move. This is the part where, in the past, my own server-move plans have fallen apart. Usually I'm torn between "sell now before the market moves" and "don't flood the market".
Congratulations on the move and thanks for the follow through.
Your goods look nicely diversified. Please keep it coming. I'm very interested in reading about your experiences actually selling the items post-move. This is the part where, in the past, my own server-move plans have fallen apart. Usually I'm torn between "sell now before the market moves" and "don't flood the market".
I'm committed to just sitting on these items until 3.1. I will be watching the AH very closely in the first week after 3.1 to try and properly pace the selling of these things so as to not flood the market, but to make sure I can capitalize on prices at their peak.
I've been keeping track of how much I've invested... I'll report back (if people care) with my net after 3.1 arrives.
Regarding BoE recipes: does anyone have any experience on buy/selling them right after the patch drop? I'm curious if there's a way to make some short-term money by grabbing the first 2-3 BOE recipes (are the BS ones BOE?) to show up on the AH; or do people usually list them at outrageous prices like 8k gold per?
Ozweepay, It might be a safer idea to unload the Frost Lotuses before 3.1 if you get a good market opportunity. With the patch futzing herb drops, I'd expect supply to swing way up. If you don't get a good market opening to unload some stock, I'd say build flasks and sell those instead of just the lotus. Hopefully people will be hitting Ulduar hard and dropping decent money on buffs.
Regarding BoE recipes: does anyone have any experience on buy/selling them right after the patch drop? I'm curious if there's a way to make some short-term money by grabbing the first 2-3 BOE recipes (are the BS ones BOE?) to show up on the AH; or do people usually list them at outrageous prices like 8k gold per?
Since they require drops from Ulduar to craft, I doubt that they will be too popular in the secondary markets in the early going, though I guess it all boils down to how rare they are...if they end up like Sunwell patterns, you might be able to own a market for long enough that an expensive pattern is worth the price.
03/09/09, 1:15 PM
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