To the above poster, to make 600-700 gold per day with three toons on cooldowns, while effective per se, it is just as effective to buy 7-8 epics, cut and resell. It is easy enough with the proper cuts, on off raid nights to spend 30 min in the AH and flip 10-20 gems, for ~100 gold per.

So yes, it is possible to do without cooldowns in 30 minutes. I think the above posters had it right though. Using cooldown/multiple toons is one of the ways to make large scale gold. I would suggest that you try eternal belt buckles off your BS, and meta gems off the alc. If your server has even a somewhat rational economy, at this time I am selling 15 skyflares, 20 earthseige, and if I had a steady supply of buclkes 10+ per day. In terms of gold, for about 3 more minutes (crafting and posting), you would likely double your income. Also, remember that Onyxia drops at least 2 helms normaly, so the Meta gem market is in a nice spike for those servers/guilds without 25 TOC/H25 TOC on farm.

Yes, I'm glad to see the discussion on this board is so educated.

Going more in depth, then, I would put it this way: I hypothesized that the gold/hour value drops precipitously after the first 30-60 minutes of work you do a day. You can still make good money after that time, but I find that I may be making two third as much gold/hour by hour 3 as I did in the hour 1, as an example. It sounds like most understood this point as implicitly stated, but I wanted to make sure it was clear.

However, flipping epic gems is something I haven't tried, and that may yield better gold/hour. As for Alchemy, it is unfortunately true that raw Metas sell for as much or more than almost all cuts: raw metas are 40-50g on my server. I'll need to see what the threshold of saturation is on my server for epic cuts.

I guess I'm not sure on some of your definitions. Are you talking overall, or per profession? And what constitutes work? Scanning the AH? Crafting? Farming? I feel much more comfortable viewing gold/day rather than gold/hour, just because of the power of the 20-hr cds, and the fact that you do not automatically get gold for most work (someone has to buy it first).

I guess if I looked at a day where I only spent one hour (20 hour cds, reposting expired auctions, etc.) and gained 500g the next day, and then looked at a day where I spent an additional hour crafting and gained 800g I would come to the same conclusion. But that over-emphasizes the 20-hour cds, which is should actually be spread over the entire day, not factored into your hourly rate (since you cannot do them more than once a day).

MMO Champion just posted Auction House guide, i.e. how to relist using Auctioneer and Quick Auctions 2 and a couple of profitable "mass production" recipes. I expect input materials to rise in price as newbies join in the fray. The really good stuff hasn't been mentioned (yet) though with what has been given it shouldn't be hard to figure it out.

For old timers, it might be more profitable to switch sides, i.e. sell your stock of materials or even drive it up by relisting. After all, newbies will have a very fresh price history...

As usual, it depends on your server economy - you might already be on a hypercompetitive server. In this case, nothing will change.

Gold/day ignores opportunity cost. We need to measure the value of our time. It's difficult to do because other uses of our WoW time aren't measured in gold -- daily dungeons give you badges and rep, which are hard to measure, BGs give you lots of honor, which are also hard to measure . The value would also vary from person to person, depending on how much you personally cared about Raids/PvP/etc.

Let's look at me as an example. If I make 500g in my first hour of gold accrual, then that is a highly valuable use of my time and I will make that a priority. However, if my second hour of gold accrual I only make 300g/hour, then that is significantly less valuable: the amount of stuff I'm getting done has been nearly cut in half! In that case, it may be better for me to do my BG Daily. Before, when I was making 500g/hour, doing the BG daily was less important, compared to gold farming. But now that gold farming only yields 300g/hour, BG dailies may be a better use of my time. Or perhaps the Daily Heroic. Or perhaps Reputation/Quests.

That's why I'm so concerned with time efficiency: I want to mazimize the amount I get done in the time I have to play. Of course, as already mentioned, this is going to vary from person to person, as some people may not care about raids or don't PvP or what have you. If all you care about is gold, and you don't raid or PvP, then obviously gold farming 100% of your time is the right thing to do because the value of all other activities is 0. Even if you only made 1g/hour, it would still be better than raiding, because that has a value of 0 to you. However, assuming a person is interested in all the sectors of WoW -- let's call them Gold, Dungeons, PvP, and Quests/Rep -- then figuring out how to balance your time amongst those activities in as efficient a manner as possible is a reasonable goal.

How can we turn a profit from the MMO-Champion guide to AH?

As someone stated earlier the basic strategies are dead, especially the enchanting market will take a hit (too bad it was my personal favorite).

Furthermore I think there is a very valid point about gold/hour vs. gold/pay. I personally don't want to sit in AH too long. Ideally the money making daily routine goes like this:
1. Check mail
2. Check AH
3. ???
4. Profit
Repeat ad nauseum 10-30 min / day

Right now the market is flooded with [Tankard O' Terror]. The demand right now is definately less than the supply, so it might be worth it to buy now and repost them in 2-3 weeks. At least I will give it a shot and have bought a few of them.

I’m crafting and selling around 100 different glyphs, as you may guess it can get really difficult to track which ones I already sold and what I need to recraft. I wonder if there is a way to create a list of glyphs I want to sell, and the quantities of each glyph I already have in my inventory + AH (so I can craft some more If I already sold some/all of them).

Any addon/script can do this? I guess it shouldn’t be difficult to get this information out of Auctioneer, but I can’t find a way to do it.

Look at what the guide says to do, and ask yourself, what are these nubs buying?

1. Cobalt Ore
2. Knothide Leather
3. Eternal Earth and Shadow
4. Green gems
5. Abyss crystals (possibly dream shards)
6. Armor and weapon vellums

That's only by memory, as I'm sure there's some other things.

This guide also may cause the scroll market to be more active, as well (both buyers and sellers). So the above poster has a valid point.

Also, since the AH has a deprecatory affect on an economy from a macro perspective (it's a money sink), I'd look for prices on all raid-level consumables to rise a little, if this use becomes widespread.

As I am fairly sure not many people on my server read EJ, or know how to read for that matter.
This also makes me less concerned about the MMO-Champ article. One, it will take someone with Enc/JC. I will gladly sell them all the dusts to PL a proffesion to compete with me. Does anyone remember the insane amount of mats required.

Two, and this may only work on a smaller server, but I make sure that I buy all earths priced <= 5.5 g. On my server this is a good price for both DE uses and to keep others out. Also, I have been able to get more and more people to COD me both saronite and earths, so they avoid the AH completely. This seems to be keeping the price of dust at an acceptable level (~4.25-5 g per), as I can not only undercut deeper than anyone else, but also keep the input costs higher for others.

This does go directly against a previous thread of mine, but as I have been crafting more, I have noticed that many have dropped out of the market.

One other thing to remember is that this thread has been used to make gold off those who do not think for themselves. As such, all the information in the MMO article has been available for a long time and I am not sure how many people it will effect as almost anyone could have been doing this all along.

QuickAuctions is exactly what you're looking for. It will auto-post a set limit of each glyph (mine does 2 of each glyph). The summary window then lists all the glyphs you know, prices, how many you have in inventory, how many are on the AH, and from the same window you can queue them up to craft. The only downside is you can't customize the sorting, but the default is good enough for everyday use.

Abyssal Shatter was hotfixed today for euro servers, so far it seems to yield 2-5 Greater Cosmics or 8-15 Inifinite Dust.

After shattering 40 crystals I got 68 greater eternals and 160 infinite dust. This is 1.7 GE and 4 dust each crystal. On my server this translates into a value of around 45-50g. It's still a relatively small sample size but this should give some idea of what to expect.

There was a trial explosion or 3 reported over on Wowhead. It looks like the expected value of each shatter is going to be awfully close to 2 essence and 4 dust per shatter. You only get dust or essence from each, so you can expect to average 4 essences when you get them or 8 dusts.

It's certainly possible the sample sizes with prove the EV = 2 GCE + 4 ID to be a bit optimistic or pessimistic, but it seems like there is enough data already to use that as an approximate (and it's consistent with Vanadi's numbers given his small sample). On our realm, that would already be a profitless transaction if one bought abyss crystals. Not to say it isn't useful, but there appears to be no current arbitrage.

The arbitrage value for abyss shatters on my realm is minimal at best. Assuming 2 essence & 4 dust per shatter, that's 2x15 + 4x4.5 = 48g. Abyss shards typically sell for around 45g apiece. After deducting AH fees, you'd make 1-2 gold. Hardly worth the effort, esp since the flood of enchant mat sales from this and the MMO article has depressed essence/dust prices. Stocked up guild banks are the main beneficiary of this change, who can now make use of the hundreds/thousands of otherwise "useless" abyss crystals.

EDIT: Had another look at Wowhead, and the odds are closer to 2 essences & 3 dust per shatter, in which case this transform is a loss on my server.

I have had success with this. By gathering more of the entry materials and inflating the costs of the mats for the people trying to follow the guide. Green gems are over 5g already and Abyss Crystals are also selling for more then ever. It seems that a glut of people trying to make money off their enchanting/alchemy skills is making the production market strained. The suppliers have taken advantage of this and Saronite and Eternal prices are higher then ever.

Right now it seems the best bet to make gold is to be on the supply side as very little profit is being made in the production at the moment on my server.

I've followed this thread with some interest for a few months. But I'd like to ask something that might be considered heresy from the point of view of the target audience of this thread

What is gold worth?

The main aim of WoW for me is PvE end content. So everything I do is aimed at maxing my raiding. Blizz have limited that value of gold by making all the most desirable items available from raids, emblems, honor or craftables (who's production availablility is limited by items that drop in raids). Aside from some BoE items you don't gear up with gold.

Hence my gold outputs are repairing, consumables, enchants and gems for new gear. Occationally mats for a new craftable, Mounts. Levelling professions.

The gold I get simply playing the game covers all the above. Yes I'll make use of the AH. I'll basically do whatever makes easy gold but the idea of spending an hour a day or more devoted to that seems pointless. What would I do with it all? I've got my 18K mount. I've got my 6K ring + upgrade costs. My professions were maxed within a couple of weeks of WoTLK release. All my gear is epic gemmed and enchanted. I've got all the best crafted items or better raid drops. So what do I have left to spend my gold on anyway? There isn't a thing left I want to buy

Now in the real world money buys almost anything. There is no ceiling to spending. If I had lots of money I could buy a yacht. Then a helecopter. Then a bigger yacht to fit the helecopter onto. Then maybe a private island in the tropics complete with Bond villain style lair and the obligatory rocket and launch facility. I could even get some kind of giant mamalian creature to ride around town getting stuck under low bridges - if that's what I wanted.

For now I've only got about 2500g, but this climbs 500g+ every week without even trying. I use my tailoring cooldowns, do the odd daily, AH drops, do the jewelcrafting daily sometimes and sell the dragon's eye. But these days I barely bother. Aside for any unknown expenses in 3.3 I'd expect to see my gold gently trend up to about 20 to 30K+ by the time Cataclysm comes along and I'll probably sink most of that into maxing my professions again.

So why are people actively working to amass gold? Surely the gold is "worthless" if there's nothing left for you to buy with it.

Alts and Achievements are two of the bigger reasons for making large quantities of gold.

There's a significant difference between a fresh 80, and a fresh 80 covered in BoE epics. Having the ability to gear a character to be ready for current "normal" content without having to run through heroics/naxx/etc is desirable.

It's also nice to be able to buy items (such as the brewfest mounts) instead of relying solely on a lucky roll to win. You could also do fun little contests/competitions and give away a fun reward like a motorcycle.

The gold isn't worth anything, it's just a way of keeping score.

Why do you raid, when at the end of the day, all that gets you is another instance to fight through? (to pose an equivalent question to you)

That is true, but not everyone is in your situation. For my top two specs (Druid Balance/Resto), I'm at a point where better BoE gear gives me about 1SP/100g. As my gear gets better that number will drop (it was probably 2sp/100g right after ToC came out). For my feral specs and alts, 100g will buy proportionally more (but I care less about them, so that isn't where I spend my gold).

With enough gold, you'll be able to buy 3.3 craftables within the first week of 3.3. So for the first few weeks of 3.3 you'll be a bit more elite than people who didn't spend the gold.

Others may use gold to buy "favors" that lead to gear or achievements (a spot on a good 5v5 team, or a run through a hard mode).

Some people seem to think that turning gold into Euros is worthwhile.

Gold also makes it easier to "be your best" more often. I don't always drop a fish feast in five-mans, and I don't always use my [Drums of Forgotten Kings] each time I rez in a battleground (or use Gift of the Wild if I rez with one other person). If I had enough money, I would always do those things.

Lots of people just do it for fun, or another way of keeping score.

I guess the end product of raiding is simply enjoyment. Much like watching a good film. Ultimately it's all a time sink returning enjoyment but not much other tangible output. So if "winning" in the AH gets you the same sense of enjoyment and satisfaction go for it.

I admit I dabble with that. I enjoyed upon the release of 3.2 and all the buzz on epic gems (which just didn't sell on my server until prices came down) spotting a sudden demand on rares. I dumped all my rares that had been languishing in my pack on the AH for 60 to 70g and watched them dissapear. Then I bought tons of saronite at 13g a pop and made an absolute killing. It only lasted for about 12 hours before enough people got in on it and there was no easy money left, but it was nearly as exciting as a first kill.

I can't speak for others, but there's several reasons, not the least of which is that it's fun.

1. If I don't have time/don't feel like farming for my consumables, I can easily buy them.

2. With a large reserve of cash, it's easy to powerlevel professions if you're so inclined. This can include professions at the start of a new expansion.

3. It's also easier to powerlevel reputations that have any sort of hand in quest available, rather than grinding.

4. If you want to go for certain achievements, such as 100 mounts, you're looking at a very large expense.

5. Unless they offer something besides money, such as reputation or the current ShinyBadgesYouNeed, there's not a pressing NEED to do dailies. Very nice once you've gotten sick of them.

6. If you feel generous, you can help out friends and your guild.

I have no doubt there's plenty more reasons folks in this thread could suggest, so I'll leave that to them.

I've made probably a good half a million gold since WotLK released, and it is like most people say a way of keeping score. I've actually quit playing now, but still login to do a bit of AHing from time to time, it's fun!

I've probably given away a good 50% of that gold, on stuff like handing out BoE epics (bought off AH when they were on there cheap) to obviously newly dinged level 80's, giving away 1000s of gold at a time in various stupid 'events' (I remember a particularly good game of hide and seek back in TBC when I played a rogue that resulted in me giving out about 20k gold to people that found me in various ridiculous locations (ironforge airport anyone?), I've spent 10k on a pair of BT shoulders the week of BT's release, and bought Teebu's for 6k - because it looked cool.

Basically, having infinite, or near infinite gold means you can do whatever the hell you like in game. I've used it to buy spots on full runs, I've used it to push people who've annoyed me out of groups, I've used it as an incentive for pugs to perform.

But ultimately, the main reason for accumulating lots of gold is because you can. It's just another way of proving you're good at what you do. In our case that's playing the AH game, for others it's PVP, or raiding, each to their own