Combat mechanics reference - Page 2

◊ Praetorian · 12/24/05, 7:31 PM

It's in the first post:

Base spell hit chance = .96, .95, .94, .83 against level 60,61,62,63 mobs.

genjuro · 12/24/05, 8:04 PM

Some more crit numbers.

On my 60 orc warrior, with no gear equipped except for a grey weapon I get

77 agi+305 weapon skill = 4.05% crit
77 agi+300 weapon skill = 3.85% crit
77 agi+244 weapon skill = 1.61% crit
77 agi+243 weapon skill = 1.57% crit

This warrior has zero talent points spent, so no cruelty, parry, etc.

It appears the base crit% chance is zero with +3.85% from the agility, then +0.05% crit for each point of weapon skill above 300, and -0.04% chance for each point below. This probably holds true for other character levels and the max weapon skill for that level

Now on my 60 dwarf priest, also with no gear equipped except for a grey weapon I get

36 agi+300 weapon skill = 4.8% crit
36 agi+299 weapon skill = 4.76% crit

Agility accounts for 1.8% of the crit, giving a base chance of 3%.

• Arawethion · 01/01/06, 6:10 PM

So, for 60 warrs, you have Agi/20 + (Skill-300)/25

Or, equivalently, Agi/20 + Skill/25 - 12, although the first way is probably more informative.

My 41 Warr with 69 Agi and 204/205 Skill has 5.03% to crit before items/talents. This seems to indicate she gets a crit% for each 13.6 (=20*41/60) Agi.

She Parries at 4.88% (with 202/205 Def, ignoring Deflection), regardless of Agi.

She Dodges at 4.00% with 56 Agi and 4.95% with 69 Agi. Again, seeming to indicate a Agi/13.6 for a level 41.

She Blocks at 4.88%, regarless of Agi.
------
My 60 Mage with 38 Agi and 289/305 Skill crits at 4.71%. He'd be at 5.15% with 300 Skill. A base chance of 4.25% without Agi? Ok.

• Arawethion · 01/01/06, 8:06 PM

Originally Posted by Arawethion,January 1st, 2006 @ 5:10PM

A base chance of 4.25% without Agi?

Er, 3.25%, that is. Still, it's odd. The dependence on Agi and Skill seems pretty clearly worked out, but there's a constant term that seems to vary by class (and is 0 for classes where it actually counts). Probably just put there so that casters still have nonvanishing melee crit chances.

It looks like crit% is given by:

X + Agi/(Y*Lvl/60) + (Skill-TargetDefense)/25 , where X and Y depend on class.

Elethiomel · 01/13/06, 3:42 AM

As for

As far as I can tell, a 63 mob crushes your 60 tank at 15%, regardless of defense (for practical purposes).

Blizzard has confirmed (although I can't actually find the post at this time) that for purposes of determining crushing blows the defense level is capped at your normal maximum. In other words, high defense will not affect crushing blows, but lower than full defense will.
Wether this cap covers Anticipation as well is a bit uncertain, but my guess would be that Anticipation does indeed help against crushing blows, but this is almost solely based on the fact that without Anticipation your defense skill is reported as x/300 while with 5 points in Anticipation your defense skill is reported as x/310.

◊ Drauk · 01/13/06, 7:22 AM

What is the formulas for probabalites to resist 25%, 50%, 75% and 100% of spel damage , based on spell level and resist ?

Elethiomel · 01/13/06, 10:12 AM

www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/basics/resistances.html

◊ Drauk · 01/13/06, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by Elethiomel,January 13th, 2006 @ 9:12AM

www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/basics/resistances.html

Not quite im looking for, since its

1) For level 50 spells
2) Give resistance probabality with increment of 50, while i want to find probabality for any value of resistance i might have.

XI- · 01/13/06, 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by Drauk,January 13th, 2006 @ 9:16AM

Originally Posted by Elethiomel,January 13th, 2006 @ 9:12AM

www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/basics/resistances.html

Not quite im looking for, since its

1) For level 50 spells
2) Give resistance probabality with increment of 50, while i want to find probabality for any value of resistance i might have.

It's 5x lvl, so for lvl 60 spells its 300.

Since 300 gives 75% resistance, I'd assume that its resistance / 400.

Thus say 127 resistance would generate (127 / 400) * 100 = 31.75% overall resistance.

• Arawethion · 01/13/06, 2:37 PM

Originally Posted by XI-,January 13th, 2006 @ 9:35AM

1) For level 50 spells
2) Give resistance probabality with increment of 50, while i want to find probabality for any value of resistance i might have.

It's 5x lvl, so for lvl 60 spells its 300.

Since 300 gives 75% resistance, I'd assume that its resistance / 400.

Thus say 127 resistance would generate (127 / 400) * 100 = 31.75% overall resistance. [/quote]
This is essentially what I assumed in my original post. But it still doesn't asnwer the question of the exact breakdown of partial resistances.

XI- · 01/13/06, 2:45 PM

Originally Posted by Arawethion,January 13th, 2006 @ 1:37PM

Originally Posted by XI-,January 13th, 2006 @ 9:35AM

1) For level 50 spells
2) Give resistance probabality with increment of 50, while i want to find probabality for any value of resistance i might have.

It's 5x lvl, so for lvl 60 spells its 300.

Since 300 gives 75% resistance, I'd assume that its resistance / 400.

Thus say 127 resistance would generate (127 / 400) * 100 = 31.75% overall resistance.

This is essentially what I assumed in my original post. But it still doesn't asnwer the question of the exact breakdown of partial resistances. [/quote]
Resistances only break down in 0/25/50/75/100, so its really impossible given the large luck factor to determine how exactly the resist table is applied.

◊ Praetorian · 01/13/06, 2:48 PM

Well, there's clearly some formula -- I can't imagine it'd be too hard to engineer. The average expected reduction will always be (resist/level)*15%, capped at 75%, but the question of "What % of the time will I get a 75% resist if I have 141 FR vs. a level 63 mob?" should be answerable. Not really important to answer, but answerable nevertheless.

• Arawethion · 01/13/06, 2:53 PM

Originally Posted by Praetorian,January 13th, 2006 @ 1:48PM

Well, there's clearly some formula -- I can't imagine it'd be too hard to engineer. The average expected reduction will always be (resist/level)*15%, capped at 75%, but the question of "What % of the time will I get a 75% resist if I have 141 FR vs. a level 63 mob?" should be answerable. Not really important to answer, but answerable nevertheless.

Yeah, I just never really saw a reason to care.

• Arawethion · 01/13/06, 2:59 PM

Originally Posted by Arawethion,January 1st, 2006 @ 7:06PM

Er, 3.25%, that is. Still, it's odd. The dependence on Agi and Skill seems pretty clearly worked out, but there's a constant term that seems to vary by class (and is 0 for classes where it actually counts). Probably just put there so that casters still have nonvanishing melee crit chances.

It looks like crit% is given by:

X + Agi/(Y*Lvl/60) + (Skill-TargetDefense)/25 , where X and Y depend on class.

Well, it seems to be 0.9% for Druids, which is at least significant. It's 0 for all other classes who actually care about melee crit (although I've forgotten to ask a Paladin or Shaman).

• Arawethion · 01/13/06, 3:02 PM

The big question still missing here is chance to hit (or miss). How is it affected by level and skill (and anything else)?

Also, do chance to miss, dodge, block, and parry all stack additively? Can any melee user with a combat log parser confirm this?

• Zellyn · 01/13/06, 6:37 PM

Originally Posted by Arawethion,January 13th, 2006 @ 2:02PM

The big question still missing here is chance to hit (or miss). How is it affected by level and skill (and anything else)?

Also, do chance to miss, dodge, block, and parry all stack additively? Can any melee user with a combat log parser confirm this?

Well, first of all, miss is supposed to be purely player based, unlike dodge, whatever is being attacked is irrelevant. Basic attacks (one-handed and two-handed) versus an equal level monster is 5% chance to miss. This is increased to 24% when dual-wielding, but instant attacks (unsure about on-next-hit) retain the 5% miss rate.

For dodge/parry/block, each point in defence over your opponent's weapon skill adds a 0.04% modifier.

The way that I have seen crit/hit/miss shown (from player perspective) is that it exists within a bar,

---------------------------------------------------------------------
|             Hit            |  Crit   |
---------------------------------------------------------------------

It's like rolling a D20 in D&D; below a certain threshold you're missing (or if your DM is an ass, cutting off your own feet :angry: ), otherwise you hit normally, and if you're lucky, you crit.

Based on the above, and since Blizzard is unlikely to design two completely seperate combat calculation systems, I would assume it acts something like this:

---------------------------------------------------------------------
| Parry | Dodge | Block |         Get Hit          |
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Of course, Parry and Block are reliant on being able to, ie: having a shield and training in parry or getting it via talents.

One last thing to note is that all special effects; parry, block, dodge and crit are calculated as a portion of misses. Even if you missed the monster, you might still have rolled a critical. This just means that your critical strike missed. It sounds silly, but this is from the mouth of a CM.

XI- · 01/13/06, 7:07 PM

You're misunderstanding the CM.

Here's how WoW rolls. For example 30% crit 5% miss would be like this

1-30 crit
31-95 hit
95-100 miss

If we add 5% more crit it becomes

1-35 crit
36-95 hit
95-100 miss

You can never miss a crit. The interesting theory that no one's been able to test is what happens if your crit exceeds 100 - Miss %.

Ultramax · 01/13/06, 7:15 PM

http://www.thottbot.com/index.cgi?sp=1719

Should give you over 100% crit. Equip two weapons and go duel someone. Or stick with 1 weapon and keep your hit% gear on.

• Zellyn · 01/13/06, 7:16 PM

What about abilities like Elemental Mastery and Cold Blood which are supposed to cause a 100% crit chance?

Edit: According to Thottbot, EM and CB have a seperate modifier function "Apply Flat Modifier", while Recklessness has "Mob Crit Percent", which is the same thing that +crit equipment have as a modifier. As such, I think that CB and EM may be calculated as criticals after they hit (if they hit).

hamlet · 01/13/06, 7:19 PM

hmm that is an interesting question. I am curious how you determined that a crit cannot miss. Did blizzard state it? Or are you going off the parseing of data. I really would like to know what happens at that point and wonder when blizzard will change it's mechanics.

XI- · 01/13/06, 7:30 PM

Originally Posted by hamlet,January 13th, 2006 @ 6:19PM

hmm that is an interesting question. I am curious how you determined that a crit cannot miss. Did blizzard state it? Or are you going off the parseing of data. I really would like to know what happens at that point and wonder when blizzard will change it's mechanics.

Read the post he linked, the information is correct, he merely misinterpreted it.

• Arawethion · 01/13/06, 7:45 PM

The way crits and misses interact has already been discussed. I'm wondering whether anyone has good info on how Dodge, Block, and Parry (and Crushing) tie in. Also, on exact computation of miss rate.

• Zellyn · 01/13/06, 9:10 PM

This website, (http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thre...rchive-en&t=15) from earlier in the thread, has this to say about crushing blows.

After submitting testing results, Blizzard has officially responded to the results. They kindly gave an expanded description of defense that includes how defense works for crushing blows, which can be found here. In a nutshell:

* Defense ONLY affects your chance to receive crushing blows if your defense (including gear) is lower than its maximum for your level (e.g. less than 300 defense at level 60) - The Anticipation talent increases your natural maximum defense, it does not reduce your chance to receive crushing blows

* Defense skill added by gear does not affect your chance to receive crushing blows - you have the same chance to receive a crushing blow at 500 defense as you do at 300 defense

* There is a minimum 15% chance that you will be hit by a crushing blow by a mob 3 or more levels higher than you

I'm still looking for insight into how hit% is influenced by level changes.

Claudius · 01/18/06, 5:05 PM

Originally Posted by Praetorian,December 24th, 2005 @ 4:49PM

A crit generates a random amount of extra aggro, that averages out to around 50% extra. I think it's something like 133%-167% of the aggro the attack should generate, in my experience.

So if you crit one shadowbolt for 2000, that generates an average of 3000 aggro.
If you cast two shadowbolts for 1000 each, that generates 2000 aggro.

Does this go for healing as well?

If it does, hypothetically: Tank has 5000/6000 hp crithealing him for 1500 would get me the amount of threat as healing for 1334-1667.

Graham · 01/18/06, 5:11 PM

Originally Posted by Claudius,January 18th, 2006 @ 4:05PM

Does this go for healing as well?

No. Critical heals generate aggro exactly as linearly as non-critical heals.