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Old 04/29/09, 5:37 AM   #376
saiyajinmaster
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Ysondre
Decidedly does not work like that. I tank it for my guild, the direction of the laser barrage fire from the center section is an absolute direction in the room, the only reason moving him is bad is because it makes it disorienting and changes the size of the cone, but 'rotating' him if he remains totally stationary doesn't affect the barrage in the slightest. Have done it many times.

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Old 04/29/09, 7:17 AM   #377
Chack
Piston Honda
 
Troll Rogue
 
Twilight's Hammer (EU)
Turning him can't affect the barrage. If the middle section actually turned with the lower section, the tank would never be able to escape barrage if it started to his right.

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Old 04/29/09, 7:25 AM   #378
Zurai
Bald Bull
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Whisperwind
They're absolutely linked in 10-man. The only times we've had haywire barrages are when I've moved the leviathan during the barrage.

Barrages aren't instantly lethal, by the way, not like the rockets are. They can be tanked through with cooldowns and focused healing. The 10 man version hits for ~17k base damage with no resist. I imagine the 25 man version is more like 25-30k, but then you have more available cooldowns, too.

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Old 04/29/09, 8:13 AM   #379
KamPa
Don Flamenco
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Bronzebeard (EU)
They hit multiple times in a single second, they'll most likely blow the tank even with cooldowns. It works somewhat better than it did, since it doesn't always go crazy after killing his first target. Also, rotating works fine, tank can easily sidestep initial blast if it targets him and nothing bad will happen.

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Old 04/29/09, 8:13 AM   #380
Pyros
Bald Bull
 
Pyros's Avatar
 
Undead Death Knight
 
Twisting Nether (EU)
Originally Posted by Zurai View Post
They're absolutely linked in 10-man. The only times we've had haywire barrages are when I've moved the leviathan during the barrage.

Barrages aren't instantly lethal, by the way, not like the rockets are. They can be tanked through with cooldowns and focused healing. The 10 man version hits for ~17k base damage with no resist. I imagine the 25 man version is more like 25-30k, but then you have more available cooldowns, too.
Because you had a random barrage when you moved him doesn't mean they're linked, considering you can move him and not have a random barrage. As for being lethal or not, while the damage of one tick isn't, you do take a lot of ticks very very fast, and even with IBF/VB/AMS up I still die faster than Plasma Beam as far as I could tell. We just turn him around, as it works just fine most of the time, and it quite often bugs even without any moving around anyway(like it bugs right away before the tank even decides to reposition).

I have yet to find a 100%way to reproduce it, while random death during the barrage seem to often trigger it, they also sometimes don't and he sometimes flip out without any death, or head tank being out of range, or lower tank not moving. Seems rather random and more likely linked to the P2 bug when he casts barrage while casting lasers, then stop right away, only that in P4 he doesn't stop the shooting, only the normal rotation(so he targets people with the laser lightning stuff, but instead shoot barrages).

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Old 04/29/09, 9:02 AM   #381
Zurai
Bald Bull
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Whisperwind
Originally Posted by Pyros View Post
Because you had a random barrage when you moved him doesn't mean they're linked, considering you can move him and not have a random barrage.
Every time I moved him, the barrage moved in the same direction to more or less the same degree.

And yes, I realize Barrage is a multi-hit ability. I still think it could be tanked through if it needed to be; people stay in for Shock Blast, after all.

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Old 04/29/09, 11:31 AM   #382
xmod2
Don Flamenco
 
Undead Rogue
 
Emerald Dream
The only time we've seen the barrage really flip out was when the tank ran through him and turned the tank 180 degrees.

The bottom flipped around and the laser up top seemed to swing around the room. Perhaps there is a constraint to the difference between the forward direction of the tank (bottom) and the middle section?

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Old 04/29/09, 11:33 AM   #383
Lucinde
Piston Honda
 
Human Priest
 
Lightbringer (EU)
And yes, I realize Barrage is a multi-hit ability. I still think it could be tanked through if it needed to be; people stay in for Shock Blast, after all.
Barrage hits for 20k every 0,25 second in the 25-men edition, or 80k a second if you want. You're not going to heal through that.

Shock blast, in comparison hits for 100k once, which can be easily shieldwalled / suppressioned or covered with guardian spirit. It's not quite the same.

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Old 04/29/09, 11:33 AM   #384
Tel
Don Flamenco
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Kazzak (EU)
Originally Posted by Zurai View Post
And yes, I realize Barrage is a multi-hit ability. I still think it could be tanked through if it needed to be; people stay in for Shock Blast, after all.
Shock Blast is a single hit ability, therefore using Cd's like Guardian Spirit will prevent it killing you whereas Barrage will eat the GS 'save' on the first or second hit, then destroy you with the next.

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Old 04/29/09, 11:56 AM   #385
MatsT
Don Flamenco
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Frostmane (EU)
From what i can tell, the Barrage will "chase" an individual person. It chooses one person at random when it starts to spin up, and then chases him for the entire duration. If that person dies, it will pick a new target at random and chase that person. Problem is, since there's no spin-up time for him to start running, he'll have no time to escape and the barrage will kill him and continue to pick new targets, killing them off very fast. The times that the barrage does not bug out when someone dies, is when someone other than the chased person dies. As long as he is still alive, the barrage will keep chasing him no matter what happens to the rest of the raid.

If the tank moves the mob sideways while the blast is spinning up, the barrage start cone will also move. This can often make it very hard or even impossible for people to escape it. If the chased person is caught this way and dies, it will bug out. This means that moving the boss while the beam is spinning up is very dangerous, but it does not by itself trigger the bug.

Disclaimer: This "bug" may have been fixed. Haven't fought him in like a week or so, i guess we'll see today if someone fails to run for barrage.

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Old 04/29/09, 11:59 AM   #386
Sparty
Piston Honda
 
Sparty's Avatar
 
Human Paladin
 
Stormrage
Originally Posted by MatsT View Post
From what i can tell, the Barrage will "chase" an individual person. It chooses one person at random when it starts to spin up, and then chases him for the entire duration. If that person dies, it will pick a new target at random and chase that person. Problem is, since there's no spin-up time for him to start running, he'll have no time to escape and the barrage will kill him and continue to pick new targets, killing them off very fast. The times that the barrage does not bug out when someone dies, is when someone other than the chased person dies. As long as he is still alive, the barrage will keep chasing him no matter what happens to the rest of the raid.

.
This is incorrect, and can be shown by a person running counterclockwise.

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Old 04/29/09, 12:13 PM   #387
MatsT
Don Flamenco
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Frostmane (EU)
Originally Posted by Sparty View Post
This is incorrect, and can be shown by a person running counterclockwise.
As far as i know the barrage can turn counterclockwise. It does not do so very often because most people tend to run clockwise. The models and graphics are made so that if you are at the center of the cone (being chased) it feels more natural to escape clockwise. The people who run counterclockwise are generally those at that part of the cone which means they aren't being chased. I'm not 100% sure about this, but i think that if you told everyone in the raid to try to escape counterclockwise, the barrage would move that way.

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Old 04/29/09, 12:24 PM   #388
RootBreaker
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Detheroc
Originally Posted by MatsT View Post
As far as i know the barrage can turn counterclockwise. It does not do so very often because most people tend to run clockwise. The models and graphics are made so that if you are at the center of the cone (being chased) it feels more natural to escape clockwise. The people who run counterclockwise are generally those at that part of the cone which means they aren't being chased. I'm not 100% sure about this, but i think that if you told everyone in the raid to try to escape counterclockwise, the barrage would move that way.
No, this is definitely not true. The barrage can only move clockwise. When the barrage is pointed directly at me, I routinely run counter-clockwise, not because it feels more natural, but because I know that I won't have to move again if I do.

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Old 04/29/09, 12:24 PM   #389
Dralmoo
Don Flamenco
 
Orc Hunter
 
Shadowmoon
Does anyone understand the mechanics of Feral Defender? It's not a huge issue, but it's been annoying me - in particular, it has two different versions of the spell "Feral Rush", and it uses both. (25-man).

This one - Feral Rush - Spell - World of Warcraft hits for about 4,000 damage.
This one - Feral Rush - Spell - World of Warcraft hits for an average of 12,000 damage.

At first I thought people getting hit for 12k had the shadow damage debuff but that is definitely not the case, wws shows the two different spells.

You can see the spell values are pretty low for both but get multiplied by the stacks of Feral Essence. When I look at other guilds WWS i don't see the bigger one ever. It is possible to heal, but it is pretty annyoing to eat a 13k Feral Rush at the same time as a Sonic Screech, it seems out of line with the intended difficulty of the encounter.

Has anyone else seen this?

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Old 04/29/09, 12:47 PM   #390
MatsT
Don Flamenco
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Frostmane (EU)
Originally Posted by Dralmoo View Post
Does anyone understand the mechanics of Feral Defender? It's not a huge issue, but it's been annoying me - in particular, it has two different versions of the spell "Feral Rush", and it uses both. (25-man).

This one - Feral Rush - Spell - World of Warcraft hits for about 4,000 damage.
This one - Feral Rush - Spell - World of Warcraft hits for an average of 12,000 damage.

At first I thought people getting hit for 12k had the shadow damage debuff but that is definitely not the case, wws shows the two different spells.

You can see the spell values are pretty low for both but get multiplied by the stacks of Feral Essence. When I look at other guilds WWS i don't see the bigger one ever. It is possible to heal, but it is pretty annyoing to eat a 13k Feral Rush at the same time as a Sonic Screech, it seems out of line with the intended difficulty of the encounter.

Has anyone else seen this?
The wording on the wowhead tooltips is pretty weird, but reality is the first hit does 12k and the remaining twelve hits do 4k. This can be easily seen from a properly filtered WWS log; example here.

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Old 04/29/09, 12:54 PM   #391
Sparty
Piston Honda
 
Sparty's Avatar
 
Human Paladin
 
Stormrage
Originally Posted by MatsT View Post
As far as i know the barrage can turn counterclockwise. It does not do so very often because most people tend to run clockwise. The models and graphics are made so that if you are at the center of the cone (being chased) it feels more natural to escape clockwise. The people who run counterclockwise are generally those at that part of the cone which means they aren't being chased. I'm not 100% sure about this, but i think that if you told everyone in the raid to try to escape counterclockwise, the barrage would move that way.
If you've never seen it move counterclockwise, then as far as you know, it does not. I've stood there in one place, I've ran counterclockwise(since its less travel distance), and it has always gone clockwise.

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Old 04/29/09, 1:03 PM   #392
Sillia
Don Flamenco
 
Sillia's Avatar
 
Draenei Warrior
 
Kilrogg
Originally Posted by Lucinde View Post
We run 25-men content exclusively and we spent a good few wipes to "bugged laser barrage" in phase 4 figuring out how it works. I'm pretty convinced it works like this, given that our paladin tank can keep generally keep it facing the same direction for the full direction. Also since we noticed it, the turrets have never 'bugged out' anymore. If they start on your tank, he can still move to the far edge of the turrets without spinning the bottom part and then strafe counterclockwise to avoid it.

That said, we one-shot Mimiron this week, so I don't exactly have a lot of empirical data to proof my claims with. I guess we'll see this week. I still don't think it's intended behaviour, but for us it felt controllable.
Did Mimiron do the shock blast immediately into laser barrage for you this week?

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Old 04/29/09, 5:11 PM   #393
Jurik
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Kel'Thuzad
Recently, they changed the timing on Shock Blast and the P3W x2 laser barrage. Initially, these 2 abilities were used at the same time in Phase 4, at least in 10-man. I believe the current incarnation of Mimiron will use them consecutively; there was a blue post regarding this change a little while ago.

After many, many wipes to Mimiron in phase 4, I am fairly confident that the aiming mechanism of the middle turret is completely independent of the directional facing of the tank. When the torso "winds up", the tank can freely rotate around the base in order to avoid the spray, and the turret remains facing the same direction while the base rotates with the tank.

The "spray the raid" behavior in phase 4 seems definitely like a bug. It always seems to come right after someone dies to the barrage. I assume that it is acquiring and facing a new target during the barrage, whereas it should really continue to fire in the same direction until the end of the barrage.

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Old 04/29/09, 10:37 PM   #394
Pyros
Bald Bull
 
Pyros's Avatar
 
Undead Death Knight
 
Twisting Nether (EU)
World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Recent In-Game Fixes - 4/28/09

Fixed an issue where Mimiron could randomly change targets while casting P3Wx2 Laser Barrage in phase 4. It is still possible for it to appear that he is turning quickly for an instant to shoot another direction, but this is just a visual bug that will be resolved in a future patch.

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Old 04/30/09, 12:33 AM   #395
Valerian
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Blackhand
Unfortunately it appears he's constantly doing his heat wave into phase 3 now making it far more difficult to kill him. Haven't gotten him to phase 4 with this bug so I'm not sure if he stops doing it in phase 4.

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Old 04/30/09, 12:49 AM   #396
Zelok
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Dethecus
He keeps spamming it in p4

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Old 04/30/09, 1:36 AM   #397
Zurai
Bald Bull
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Whisperwind
He wasn't doing his heat wave past p2 in our 10 man tonight. Maybe a 25 man only bug?

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Old 04/30/09, 2:53 AM   #398
Xequecal
Piston Honda
 
Dwarf Paladin
 
Khadgar
Originally Posted by Jurik View Post
Recently, they changed the timing on Shock Blast and the P3W x2 laser barrage. Initially, these 2 abilities were used at the same time in Phase 4, at least in 10-man. I believe the current incarnation of Mimiron will use them consecutively; there was a blue post regarding this change a little while ago.

After many, many wipes to Mimiron in phase 4, I am fairly confident that the aiming mechanism of the middle turret is completely independent of the directional facing of the tank. When the torso "winds up", the tank can freely rotate around the base in order to avoid the spray, and the turret remains facing the same direction while the base rotates with the tank.

The "spray the raid" behavior in phase 4 seems definitely like a bug. It always seems to come right after someone dies to the barrage. I assume that it is acquiring and facing a new target during the barrage, whereas it should really continue to fire in the same direction until the end of the barrage.
They can no longer be used simultaneously, but they can be used one right after the other, resulting in a shock blast while he's still pew pewing. If you're tanking him you have to make sure to run straight out and then straight back, or he'll turn anf strafe the entire room.

This is especially nasty when you get that bug that happens with all mobs where, when you exit their melee range and then re-enter it, they'll randomly just spin 180 degrees and appear behind you. Most tanks know what I'm talking about here and this will generally gib two thirds of the raid.

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Old 04/30/09, 5:09 AM   #399
Nakari
Piston Honda
 
Nakari's Avatar
 
Orc Hunter
 
Destromath (EU)
In our last two kills of Auriaya we had no feral defender spawn at all - we pulled her using a hunter trap, killed the four adds, she did the emote ("Auriaya activates the Feral Defender"), but nothing happened afterwards. Ironically, both times we had planned to do Heroic: Nine Lives... did something like that happen to anybody else? I've not read/heard of it before and as far as I know no other raid on my realm had a "problem" like that, so I'm a bit curious what could be causing the Feral Defender not to spawn at all (and I don't think we do anything out of the ordinary in our pull/kill).

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Old 04/30/09, 5:12 AM   #400
Maleficus
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Quel'Thalas (EU)
We killed Auriya tonight on 25 man. Same as you, she emoted activating the Feral Defender but it didn't spawn. We tanked her on the platform just downstairs and to the left of the platform with the teleporter and loot chest. Her initial 4 adds behaved normally and did not respawn. We also used a hunter trap to pull.

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