Thorim - Lightning Charge now inflicts 17344 to 20156 damage. (Up from 13875 to 16125)
Thorim - Chain Lightning now inflicts 4625 to 5375 damage. (Up from 3700 to 4300)
make sure in arena everyone spreads out, and kill the healing/shielding guys single target
Not true, you don't need to have everyone spread out in the arena to be effective. I believe the clump method works very well in the arena.
Our setup was 2 tanks, 5 melee, 2 range and 3 healers and we all clump in the middle of the circle except for tank who is tanking the champion. We assigned 1 rogue and 1 warrior with the rogue stunlock / kick on Evoker and 2 range will DPS the champion which is tank slightly outside of the clump group but within range of the AOE spells.
In our early attempts at Phase 1 we tried all the ranged(very very few) and healers standing under Thorim, and all the melee dealing with the waves in the middle.
This proved problematic because Stormhammer pretty well hit everybody. Eventually all of our healers (4) spread out around the room to avoid that. Also, we found that singling down the Champions as well as (and this is huge) disarming them, worked wonders.
By the time we killed him things were working so smoothly that I ended up not having to heal at all really and started doing some poor DPS.
As for the MC/Aura thing thanks for the heads up on the mechanics of that. Pretty convoluted but I guess that's why it's an achievement.
In our early attempts at Phase 1 we tried all the ranged(very very few) and healers standing under Thorim, and all the melee dealing with the waves in the middle.
This proved problematic because Stormhammer pretty well hit everybody. Eventually all of our healers (4) spread out around the room to avoid that. Also, we found that singling down the Champions as well as (and this is huge) disarming them, worked wonders.
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So then you were tanking the Champions close to the melee group, with melee dmg. focusing on them?
Does disarming them prevent them from whirl-winding?
So then you were tanking the Champions close to the melee group, with melee dmg. focusing on them?
Does disarming them prevent them from whirl-winding?
Yes, all the mobs were in one pile. They still whirlwind, it just hits for absolutely worthless damage while he's disarmed.
We did many many attempts with 0 ranged DPS in the arena and it was perfect. Wipes on those attempts were due to other factors.
Are you guys able to disarm them every time they come down? or just having melee gang bang them just immediately with stuns and such when disarm is on the CD?
Are you guys able to disarm them every time they come down? or just having melee gang bang them just immediately with stuns and such when disarm is on the CD?
We had 2 rogues and a warrior. I know they were rotating. Honestly I don't know about rogue and warrior cooldowns on that stuff so I'm not sure if they can get all of them but all I know is that for us Champions are priority targets and that we're using disarms as a key component.
On a slightly different topic does anybody else think that once the final Hallway miniboss is dead the arena starts spamming champions at you until Thorim is engaged? Maybe not right away, but if your hallway team kills the guy, then drags ass cleaning up trash and getting to Thorim it looked like the Arena just went insane with the spawn times.
For the Thorim encounter, the Runic Colossus should stop channeling Runic Smash once engaged in combat, the Dark Rune Champion should no longer whirlwind after being disarmed, and the Runic Colossus should no longer melee when it charges.
I have never been in the hallway so I don't know what's up, but a healer that spends all her time in the hallway is giddy about these changes to the Colossus. As for the Champion no longer whirlwinding that was a rather meaningless change. While disarmed his damage was moot regardless of if he spun around or not. :p
I have never been in the hallway so I don't know what's up, but a healer that spends all her time in the hallway is giddy about these changes to the Colossus.
I was in corridor in both 10 man and 25 man, and it's a nice change. The colossus lights up either his left or right arm and after a few seconds that side of the hallway explodes (or it's the reversed as he's looking towards you, so his right arm == your left side). The problem is that he used to light up an arm when you engaged him, and as you usually turn him around for tanking it became a bit hard to avoid it at time. Sure you could just remember that he used his right arm and move, but all in all it's a nice change.
When we were killing Thorim last night we've seen one chain lightning (tank / spank phase) interrupted can anybody confirm such behaviour or it's a wow client playing tricks?
The only thing that sustains one through life is the consciousness of the immense inferiority of everybody else, and this is a feeling that I have always cultivated.
Latest from the patch (3.1.1)
Thorim - Lightning Charge now inflicts 17344 to 20156 damage. (Up from 13875 to 16125)
Thorim - Chain Lightning now inflicts 4625 to 5375 damage. (Up from 3700 to 4300)
Very disappointed by these changes, the encounter discourages melee so drastically already. Increasing the damage done by Chain Lightning further alienates these melee dps. As it of last week RNG is the only way more than 6 melee are surviving Hard Mode, with these changes I would hesitate to bring more than 4.
That is unless the Hard Mode is supposed to be farm the AH for greens of Nature Protection and have a "Huhu"fun night.
Very disappointed by these changes, the encounter discourages melee so drastically already. Increasing the damage done by Chain Lightning further alienates these melee dps. As it of last week RNG is the only way more than 6 melee are surviving Hard Mode, with these changes I would hesitate to bring more than 4.
That is unless the Hard Mode is supposed to be farm the AH for greens of Nature Protection and have a "Huhu"fun night.
Hehehe
Well, in my opinion what they should have done is double the CL damage, but keep the damage constant on jumps.
Simple, effective and gets the job done without discouraging melee to the extent it does.
Very disappointed by these changes, the encounter discourages melee so drastically already. Increasing the damage done by Chain Lightning further alienates these melee dps. As it of last week RNG is the only way more than 6 melee are surviving Hard Mode, with these changes I would hesitate to bring more than 4.
That is unless the Hard Mode is supposed to be farm the AH for greens of Nature Protection and have a "Huhu"fun night.
We run 2 tanks in the hall and 2 in the arena, plus 5 melee. Two tanks tank Thorim leaving 7 melee to find homes safe from Chain Lightning. Never going to happen. The first CL is going to kill at least 1, maybe 2. After that the rest may be ok until the stacks reach 8 or so, then the rest will die. Very dumb mechanic.
I suppose our priests could attempt to bubble all of melee.............
We ran 9 melee plus 2 tanks on Thorim last reset. No one died from chain lightning.
We had a pile of three melee at max range to the left, back and right of the boss, and they were able to spread far enough apart that it didn't jump between them ever. Now a 3 bounce chain lightning hurts for sure, but it's not guarenteed death by any means. I think a lot of the people in this thread are underestimating how much space there is around him that melee can use.
One point we noted yesterday was that a druid tank seems to remain crit immune even with unbalancing strike on him. Ours was quite happily tanked Thorim for the entire phase without getting crit once. It could be that he was just lucky, but there's possibly some odd interaction between the 6% crit reduction from talents druids get, and the reduced defence skill from UB strike. Has anyone else experienced this?
We just killed him, again with 8 or 9 melee, plus tanks. No issues at all with chaining of the lightning except when melee groups were moving to avoid the other lightning thingy. If you position correctly, you can negate the big CL nukes.
Yeah, just gotta handle it like frost tomb or whatever from KTZ. Spread the melee out in 3 or 4 clumps and you're fine. If you're running with more then 12 people in melee range, might want to rethink your raid strategy.
As for phase 1, I -highly- suggest frost trap as well.
We did thorim last night, and while we only had 7 melee, CL was not an issue what so ever. So while they did boost its dmg, I think they changed something about how it jumps
The Whirlwind from the Champions is also interruptable by Gouge (or any other incapacitate effect I guess), and they won't re-cast it for a good while, so having a rogue sit on them can nullify the nasty AoE damage if you're low on available disarms.
Obviously, thorim requires that "perfect" class balance. this is what I would recommend to beat the encounter:
6 healers
3-4 tanks
15-16 DPS
Our hallway group consists of 9 people. 2 healers, a warrior tank, and 6 ranged dps. Everyone else is in the arena. Our ranged dps usually includes:
2 elemental shaman
2 mages
2 shadow priests
It would be a bit quicker to go with a 10th (which would be our moonkin, but we've done it both ways so far)
We actaully do go with one cc, this is to prevent early stuns so the warrior doesnt lose aggro. He immediatly starts on one of the melee mobs on every pull. Our casters focus and burn down the caster mob, while the 3rd mob is CC'd. We do not tank the initial caster mob at all, due to our ranged being able to "tank it" while they focus it down.
Thorim is obviously finding the right balance for your individual guild. If you are having difficulty, i would suggest:
Tank everything in the middle and have the champions (i believe they are the WW mobs) tanked right outside the center.
Also, for efficiency, make sure that at least in the hallway, heals are interrupted. You will get overwhelmed if you miss heal after heal. If 10/15 doesnt work, pinpoint what exactly is happening. Are you getting overrun in the main room? Are you not making it to thorim intime?
Those are really the two biggest issues that you can "balance" your raid separation based on.
The tunnel phase is pretty easy if you send mages in there. All of the mobs can be sheeped, so only one tank and one healer is needed. If you're not too worried about getting the hard mode, you could probably send only 4 or 5 DPS in the tunnel and still make due. Last night we also found that the enrage timer for reaching Thorim is 6 minutes, not 5 as DBM is showing.
The top seems way more likely to get overwhelmed. The only 'hard' parts of the tunnel involve not getting hit by Runic Smash (think Utgarde Pinnacle - Left side or Right Side) and when you get to the second Miniboss, you need to run away from whoever gets the debuff (DBM marks a Skull on their head).
The top phase can be done with 1 dedicated Single target tank and one dedicated AOE tank with the whole raid stacking on the center of the arena. As the above posters pointed out, single target DPSing the Champions down quickly helps loads, as the other mobs do not hit very hard nor have very much HP, it's quite feasible to have a tank holding several waves.
Having the whole raid stack in the center also helps for avoiding the Lightning damage. The 4 towers with orbs on them will periodically start channeling a nature damage spell on somebody and it 'arcs' to nearby players, but the range seems to be fairly small and it never hit people who were standing in the middle.
Very disappointed by these changes, the encounter discourages melee so drastically already. Increasing the damage done by Chain Lightning further alienates these melee dps. As it of last week RNG is the only way more than 6 melee are surviving Hard Mode, with these changes I would hesitate to bring more than 4.
That is unless the Hard Mode is supposed to be farm the AH for greens of Nature Protection and have a "Huhu"fun night.
Can state now that you can do Hard mode with 10 melee including the tanks and that you will want to have that many considering much higher DPS melee are on the fight. The point of the chain lightning seems to be just to prevent you from stacking melee which the more you have the easier the fight is if it wasn't for chain lightning (12 melee seems to be about the cap you can take though would say that is not really feasible unless all your melee DPS is rolling with tank saves).
Can state now that you can do Hard mode with 10 melee including the tanks and that you will want to have that many considering much higher DPS melee are on the fight. The point of the chain lightning seems to be just to prevent you from stacking melee which the more you have the easier the fight is if it wasn't for chain lightning (12 melee seems to be about the cap you can take though would say that is not really feasible unless all your melee DPS is rolling with tank saves).
Thorim's chain lightning casts are somewhat predictable, actually. Melee can spread while he's absorbing lightning, losing 5-6 seconds of dps time on average. Are you saying this because of dps requirements, or because in hard mode chain lightnings don't follow a pattern?
04/21/09, 6:16 AM
