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Old 05/13/09, 5:07 PM   #61
Dollar
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Korgath
Originally Posted by Fabinas View Post
Has anyone tried the [Darkmoon Card: Illusion] on Vezax? Would be nice to know if the triggered mana effect works on this fight.
I really, really doubt it works. No other trinkets of any kind work unless they somehow forgot that one.

"Oh he's a sad little man? He's thrown a kettle over a pub, what have you done?"

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Old 05/13/09, 8:12 PM   #62
Gofa
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Priest
 
Aman'Thul (EU)
According to a posting in *this* thread in the German R&D forum it doesn't work.

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Old 05/14/09, 9:50 PM   #63
Eddyqw
Von Kaiser
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Dreadmaul
Has anyone tried the [Darkmoon Card: Illusion] on Vezax? Would be nice to know if the triggered mana effect works on this fight.
The absorb works, but you're immune to the mana gain effect.

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Old 05/15/09, 5:20 AM   #64
Hellebore
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Dragonblight (EU)
Working mana returns

So far in 10 man, we have tried the following mana regen tricks

[Dark Rune] - Functional 15 min CD
[Lei of Lilies] - Functional shared CD with healthstones

Water Shield - Spell - World of Warcraft - Orbs functional, passive MP5 none functional

[Darkmoon Card: Illusion] - None functional
[Runic Mana Injector] - None functional
Life Tap - Spell - World of Warcraft - None functional

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Old 05/15/09, 6:45 PM   #65
Kewangeder
Piston Honda
 
Ris
Night Elf Druid
 
No WoW Account
Lifebloom - Functional

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Old 05/15/09, 11:54 PM   #66
Mideci
Great Tiger
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Stormrage
I think it's pretty clear that things that discount mana do work and things that create some kind of mana gain don't.

Lifebloom's return is basically a delayed discount; the Darkmoon Card is a "mana return effect". I'm pretty sure the Soul Preserver works as well (it seemed to for me, but I was focused on healing).

As for why Dark Runes and Leis work? My guess is oversight since they are such old items. They also have gigantic cooldowns and together would restore less than 2000 mana over the entire fight.

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Old 05/16/09, 1:04 AM   #67
Kewangeder
Piston Honda
 
Ris
Night Elf Druid
 
No WoW Account
Your theory doesn't explain shamanistic rage and judged wisdom, however. My best theory is simply that things were set to return mana if they would otherwise completely bork certain raiders. As you say, though, they probably forgot about Runes and Leis, as they're old relatively forgettable.

The nice thing about Lifebloom is that it's the cheapest heal aside from judged light. On the downside, it's not something I use frequently - I might bloom a ranged who had a bad crash experience, but that's not supposed to normally happen. I could bloom the tank (may as well), but only the HoT is what I would call reliable, and it's eclipsed by the other healing coming in.

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Old 05/16/09, 3:09 AM   #68
Niug
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
<XW>
Neptulon (EU)
Originally Posted by Kewangeder View Post
Your theory doesn't explain shamanistic rage and judged wisdom, however. My best theory is simply that things were set to return mana if they would otherwise completely bork certain raiders. As you say, though, they probably forgot about Runes and Leis, as they're old relatively forgettable.
Obviously enhancement shaman and ret paladins were meant to function in the same way other melee do on this fight, ie not having to worry about their power bar. It'd be a bit messed up if we were having to run around worrying about taking vapour ticks without having any sort of damage benefit to offset the lost time (and it'd just result in people bringing other classes). This discussion seems a bit pointless anyway, obviously it's intended that healers have to deal with mana in a different way in this fight and looking for ways to circumvent that seems to be against the intent of the fight.

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Old 05/16/09, 11:58 AM   #69
Juli
Don Flamenco
 
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Undead Priest
 
Executus
Tree druids with spark of hope auto-attacking vezax with the "no-kite" strategy for omen of clarity procs is pretty hilariously effective. Between this and disc PW:S with spark of hope inside shadow crash pools, the fight (even hard-mode) becomes one of the easiest in the zone on 10man. I imagine it translates into 25man as well, but we have a pretty relaxed 25man raid schedule (currently 2 days a week) so we haven't bothered with the hard mode there.

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Old 05/16/09, 5:58 PM   #70
Szynszyla
Von Kaiser
 
Troll Druid
 
Sylvanas (EU)
@ Juli

I might have missunderstood shadow crash completly for our last 3-4 kills, but i was under assumption that, healers standing in shadow crash and healing the tank will have their healing output reduced by 70%?

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Old 05/16/09, 7:25 PM   #71
Pyros
Bald Bull
 
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Undead Death Knight
 
Twisting Nether (EU)
Originally Posted by Szynszyla View Post
@ Juli

I might have missunderstood shadow crash completly for our last 3-4 kills, but i was under assumption that, healers standing in shadow crash and healing the tank will have their healing output reduced by 70%?
Shields aren't heals so they're not affected, however they're spells so they get the mana reduction, which combined with the priest talents(Rapture I think it's called?) makes shielding pretty much free/giving back mana. Can step out to Penance and step back in for shields.

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Old 05/16/09, 8:12 PM   #72
caladein
Homer at the Bat
 
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Goblin Hunter
 
Wildhammer
Originally Posted by Pyros View Post
Shields aren't heals so they're not affected, however they're spells so they get the mana reduction, which combined with the priest talents(Rapture I think it's called?) makes shielding pretty much free/giving back mana. Can step out to Penance and step back in for shields.
Rapture's self mana return does not work on this fight (yay Immune!). I can't speak to the "energize" effect on the person being shielded though.

That said, running into the Shadow Crashes for PW: Shield is still really really nice. Doing that shifted the fight from painful to simply unfun.

Originally Posted by Snowy View Post
Lightwell owns even more because there's more charges for you if other people don't use it as much!

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Old 05/17/09, 1:50 AM   #73
Vathral
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Rexxar
delete please, unsure of my data, I'll have to do more testing for improved soul leech since my recount is deceiving, I'll have to run a wws our next hard mode kill.

Last edited by Vathral : 05/17/09 at 2:45 AM.

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Old 05/17/09, 2:45 AM   #74
Thranduil
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Wildhammer
In 25 man Ulduar, how many players must be outside the 15 yard range from General Vezax before he can cast Shadow Crashes on those closer than 15 yards?

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Old 05/17/09, 3:06 AM   #75
Vathral
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Rexxar
3 in 10 man
10 in 25 man

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