Oh, and here's some numbers regarding Improved Demo Shout in regards to a more PvP environment.

For the MS math, I used (average weapon damage) + (bonus MS damage) + (AP*speed / 14). Is this correct?

yes, if "speed" is "normalized speed."

Whoops. Yea, I meant to say I used a 3.3 constant.

Sulf works great for fury, its a nice change of pace and was a considerable dps increase for me as far as pve goes. This was my spec with 2h fury (duel wield now) and if you miss imp charge you can go 2 points into intercept instead of one witch more than makes up for the loss.

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classe...000000000000000

the biggest problem i have with fury is that you cant change back and forth between all dps and defiance without missing out on tact mastery and imp overpower, witch is very painfull for me :<

Well now, isn't this interesting. Perhaps you can lend some support to my cause.

wouldnt that be nice :D

At the top end of gear 2H Fury doesn't really lack the Arms 'burst damage', just the MS debuff, which depending on the fight, can be either worthless, or the most valuable contribution the warrior is making.

For sustained damage, especially horde with windfury totems, 2H Fury shines. Flurry increases DPS way more than weapon specs, and fully raid buffed warriors have enough AP than Bloodthirst is an efficient rage dump.

The biggest drawback isn't DPS, its flexibility, especially if you like having prot talents and overpower/tm. The DPS increase isn't enough for me to be able to give that up, especially with last-stand + lifegiving gem proving to be a powerful counter to trinket mages/locks/shamans.

I havnt seen any official statement from blizz about the AM nerf. I have heard something about the issue with warriors filling up they'r ragebar with bloodrage and autoattack, will indeed be fixed in the upcoming patch.

How blizzard are planning on fixing this beats me and if they nerf the warrior at the same time, that wouldnt really suprise me abit. They will prolly sit with the feeling: "Good job bob, we fixed 2 issues in one solution here"

They bether fix the issue with taking us out of combat after bloodrage are done nomather autoattack or not, damn nublets.

The GC is defently 1sec, not 1.5sec.

Thanks for the replyes on my issue. :P
Keep coming with comments please.

About that spamming hamstring(without any cost reducement) with wf, that doesnt sound very clever in my eye's. Let me elaborate.
Say you do it 10times, you should then have 2proccs since its 20% proc ratio. That will cost you 100rage to those 10hamstrings, what will you get for 100 rage used on hamstring? You will get to extra instant attacks, meaning it will cost about 50rage for a gimped MS(and without the debuff ofc).
Aint that abit expensive? Yeah, sure you fill up u'r ragebar in some sort of degree when it proccs, but wouldnt it be full anyways? Since you wasted alot of rage on hamstring.

With my weapon I have som issues getting enough rage when doing execute, its just to slow for execute spam with the GC tick. Since I also wanted to make recklessness as efficient possible. I could allways get some decent 1h for dw when execute spam, but currently I dont have that and I wanted to test something else out.
So what I tryed; fill up ragebar, pop recklessness go spam slam. There you go, quite good damage boost. Havnt really calculated on it, but sounds like a quite good use of recklessness, any thoughs?

To fast written reply and no edit button(or am I infact blind?), excuse my english :)

If don't rage dump in raids, my bar is always full and can not be emptied.

So I don't really see what difference your math makes - you spamstring rage dump to use up rage in the hopes of more damage.

ehehehehehehehhe

Those percentages are independent and not additive, I believe. Basically, HoJ + Sword Spec != 7% chance for an extra attack simply because HoJ can proc from SS and vice versa.

I haven't really churned out the math, but would they be multiplicative rather than additive?

I'm not sure whether or not SS/HoJ can proc off of itself (with all the recent Warrior changes and whatnot), either. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

Judging from the way everything works in this game, it's probably additive.

One of the more crazy people I've become friends with is a troll warrior named Bartar, who was the second person on our server to get High Warlord. He currently mainhands the HW sword, and offhands the dagger, with around +12% to hit from gear, and boy is his damage output insane.

I am always a bit taken back by people claiming that fury isn't as viable for PvP as arms. True, fury lacks the ms debuff, but in return you get 10s off intercept, more damage from execute (ok, minimal but more), and 10 free rage every 30s from zerk rage. On top of this you get +20% damage and fear immunity for 30s every three mins, and then every time you crit, you attack 30% faster, which reeks havoc with casters, especially if you dual wield. A fury spec warrior should absolutley obliterate a priest and warlock every time simple because they screw up casting and can't be feared away (just let the lock burn deathcoil first). Lastly, but certainly not least, you get an instant attack that scales better with gear than ms, and can be used even if you are disarmed.

The biggest knock on fury spec is that you can't also spec deep into protection if you want to pick up tactical mastery. Of course if you are spec'ing for raiding, the amount of stance dancing you are going to do is minimal at least through BWL. So in that regard you cold just forgo tac mastery and pick up last stand.

Its not that fury isnt doable in pvp, rather that the massive burst damage + the debuff is so godly.

Quick question regarding the new ranks of HS and Revenge: Is there any data available that gives an exact or estimated change in hate generation of either skill?

I didn't want to create a whole new thread for this, so sorry for the slight OT-ness.

They arent additive I think. The chance to nt get an additional attack is:
0.8 * 0.95 * 0.98 = 0.7448 so the chance to get an additional attack is 25.52 percent. Included are the chances to get two extra attacks and an extra attack + windfury proc. And you could trigger another windfury proc/extra attack with the extra attack/windfury proc...

Hamstring spam relays greatly on chance and is only viable with windfury imo. The sure way would be to use a mortal strike but because it has a cooldown you could do hamstrings while you wait for the next ms if your rage is sufficent.

GC is 1 sec for rogues and 1.5 sec for everyone esle. Don't forget that visual represenation of cooldown is skewed by ping. GetActionCooldown() is your friend.

Wodin would beg to differ :P

http://www.fohguild.org/forums/mmorpg-gene...p-vs-pve-2.html

(and the post above it)

I liked the first post on that page:

QFT

Lets all hope they make Diablo 3 a good game ;)

On the topic: only because someone in that forum writes "armageddon is tomorrow" will you waste your whole money today?

I mean its no proof in there is it?

A proof would be spamming one (instant) button and taking a defined time in which you count how many instants are used. The problem there is you dont have enough enrgy/rage to constantly spam instants besides in the vael encounter.

Let a warrior hamstring spam and a rogue sinister strike spam for a defined time during the vael encounter, if they have the same amount of instants, they have the same global cooldown.

The instants of all mana classes have long cooldowns anyways so its unimportant there.

I know that weapon swapping for rogues triggers a 1 second cooldown, where it triggers a 1.5 sec cooldown for all other classes (thats listed in some patch notes I am just too lazy to quote it :P). My guess is that poster you re referring to got that mixed up. Just test it at the next vael encounter bring your numbers along. That would be a proof.