Protection Warriors - Page 2

Anglakel · 04/02/06, 4:47 PM

Originally Posted by EgaL,April 2nd, 2006 @ 3:00PM

I d like to highlight this post of Quigon in the cq forum it explained me a lot.

And this is what i had to say to him

I've always felt what Quigon said was true even though it has been hammered into the psyche of raiding warriors that sunder is junk. I have always used sunder, and I can't concieve of tanking with heroic strike/revenge alone like some other warriors claim they do.

However, calling heroic a 30 rage ability is a bit steep considering the fact that in defensive stance with tanking gear I would get 15 rage off the white damage i replaced heroic with in my wildest fantasy. Additionally, when anything that's worth holding agro against is attacking me in a 40 man raid, the rage situation is healthy to say the least. Also new heroic strike from AQ20 would seem to make it just a little bit more enticing.

And putting 5/5 in 1h spec seems a bit silly when most of the builds i look at on allakhazam don't have iron will (which is infinitley more useful in pve and pvp) but to each his own.

He has a lot of good imput but he's got a bit of a vendeta against heroic strike. :-/

Ultramax · 04/02/06, 5:10 PM

I used to love Iron Will, but she's acted like a bitch lately.

Legato · 04/02/06, 6:23 PM

When I was Prot, I went with this.
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classe...250110530020101

Lord BEEF · 04/02/06, 7:39 PM

That chart is wacked. The 1050 number for sunder comes from the amount of points a priest needs to heal to take aggro from a defiance specced warrior.

I'm pretty sure the bonus threat from sunder is equivalent to about 250 damage.

If that chart was correct, one sunder from a defiance specced warrior would be enough to keep aggro over a mage that lands a 1500 damage spell, and that doesn't happen.

Plus Quigon mentions the DPS increase from sunder but doesn't mention the fact that the DPS increase of any sunder beyond 5 is precisely zero

Also has anyone worked out the hate values of the new heroic strike and revenge yet?

Brell · 04/02/06, 8:26 PM

Praetorian, what would a build like that look like, where would you put the talent points for a 31/5/15 hybrid build?

Anglakel · 04/02/06, 8:31 PM

Originally Posted by Brell,April 2nd, 2006 @ 7:26PM

Praetorian, what would a build like that look like, where would you put the talent points for a 31/5/15 hybrid build?

I'm not Gurgthock but I used this spec for all of the learning phase of BWL
PS: I'm filthy and alliance, horde may wanna consider the other 2 points in defiance at the expense of cruelty, depending on how often you actually get to tank.

• moz · 04/02/06, 8:40 PM

Quigon is dumb

Rachel · 04/02/06, 11:56 PM

Originally Posted by Lord BEEF,April 2nd, 2006 @ 6:39PM

That chart is wacked. The 1050 number for sunder comes from the amount of points a priest needs to heal to take aggro from a defiance specced warrior.

I'm pretty sure the bonus threat from sunder is equivalent to about 250 damage.

Truth~. When offtanking, my 600-ish Mortal Strikes generate way more threat than Sunder does.

But anyway, Brell, this is my current 31/5/15 build. I don't think it's the ideal one, since it lacks Last Stand and Imp Shield Block, but I'm stubborn about my 10k armor, and I at least have a Gem for bursty fights. But it still seems to work well enough for both dealing damage and tanking.

Ultramax · 04/03/06, 1:29 AM

Can your puny minds comprehend the magnificent beauty of my spec? (It's shitty I know I don't care shutup)

http://www.wowhead.com/talent/?TAMxdV0oxkZxbuoe

Bart · 04/03/06, 1:37 AM

Here's my spec: http://www.wowhead.com/talent/?LN0xdZVZxizoeM0qo

One of my guilds MT's and we just began BWL. I think it works well, I'm the offtank, so naturally I am never the first to be physically tanking whatever it is (Ragnaros, Razorgore, Vael now) which is why I put points into things like imp sunder/heroic, where I'll be using as little rage as I can

I've been with this spec for about 2 weeks now, and I can't say anything bad about it!

• Hamlet · 04/03/06, 1:45 AM

Originally Posted by Lord BEEF,April 2nd, 2006 @ 6:39PM

That chart is wacked. The 1050 number for sunder comes from the amount of points a priest needs to heal to take aggro from a defiance specced warrior.

I'm pretty sure the bonus threat from sunder is equivalent to about 250 damage.

If that chart was correct, one sunder from a defiance specced warrior would be enough to keep aggro over a mage that lands a 1500 damage spell, and that doesn't happen.

Plus Quigon mentions the DPS increase from sunder but doesn't mention the fact that the DPS increase of any sunder beyond 5 is precisely zero

Also has anyone worked out the hate values of the new heroic strike and revenge yet?

Are you saying the relative values are wrong, or just complaining about the overall scaling convention he chose?

EDIT: Never mind, I just noticed the "damage dealt: 1" line.

• moz · 04/03/06, 1:45 AM

Originally Posted by Bart,April 2nd, 2006 @ 10:37PM

Here's my spec: http://www.wowhead.com/talent/?LN0xdZVZxizoeM0qo

One of my guilds MT's and we just began BWL. I think it works well, I'm the offtank, so naturally I am never the first to be physically tanking whatever it is (Ragnaros, Razorgore, Vael now) which is why I put points into things like imp sunder/heroic, where I'll be using as little rage as I can

I've been with this spec for about 2 weeks now, and I can't say anything bad about it!

How much do you actually overpower with a spec/role like that?

(Just curious about how you spent those 2 points)

• Hamlet · 04/03/06, 1:52 AM

At the very least, can anyone confirm the relative values of the Warrior abilities he posted?

Specifically, is that value for Shield Slam before or after the buff that happened many patches ago? Because the value posted above shows SS to be less Rage-efficient than Imp. Sunder (in fact, less Rage-efficient than unimproved Sunder), which would makes its value rather limited.

Bart · 04/03/06, 1:54 AM

Originally Posted by moz,April 3rd, 2006 @ 12:45AM

How much do you actually overpower with a spec/role like that?

(Just curious about how you spent those 2 points)

I'm assuming that was to me. I don't overpower at all really in raids I am tanking, it was just 2 points I tossed in to allow me to have a bit more fun when I have to dps or am PvP'ing. Yah, it's not the best placement of points if you're an MT but I'm not a huge fan of anything else in the Prot tree

• Hamlet · 04/03/06, 2:01 AM

Ok, I found what I believe is the original source of that data:

http://www.thesteelwarrior.org/forum...ad.php?t=12697

Quigon just coupled in the lines about damage/healing aggro without realizing that the scaling was off.

The SS value is post-1.7. It is, however, against a mob with 50% mitigation. Apparently I've been lying to tanks for a little while. What magnitude of armor to raid bosses usually have?