Mesquite

Ok so our guild is to the point where a Nef kill will help us alot.

What consumables do you think would help us get the edge we need? We have gotten him to 2nd phase, but too many where dead.

 

subscience

 

Maledict

We have only just killed Nefarian ourselves.

My best advice would be - keep practising at Phase 1, until your not losing people.

We had one night of wiping constantly to the spawns, figuring out tactics (gogo Red / Black combo), and then on our second night, we refined them slightly and went from having 20 dead Draknoids to Nefarian landing and everyone alive.

(We had no plan to actually make him land, so it took everyone by complete surprise when it happened! Fat dragon sitting on your head isn't fun).

I have to be honest, phase 2 and beyond seems a lot easier than phase 1 - if you can get your raid force through phase 1 alive, he should die pretty soon afterwards. We went totally overboard on buffs for the actual kill, and ended up not using most of them at all...

 

◊ Praetorian

Well, so your problem is losing too many to Phase 1, really? What strat do you use for Phase 1?

Basically unless you use a pure AoE strat, any form of DPS enhancement will make Phase 1 much easier. The faster things die the less damage your raid takes and the fewer of your people risk dying.

 

Crimsonjade

AoE strats seem so touch and go to me sometimes too. We used to AoE, and then one day just decided to split DPS. admittedly, it was an easier decision to split DPS after we had geared up on nef a few times.

 

• Lurchington

just because I want a crack at naming those by icon:


row one:

[no idea] [soul stone (ss icon, but I assume melee character?)] [prayer of shadow protection] [lunar festival lucky rockets (+spirit bonus?)] [prayer of fortitude] [Gift of the Wild] [no idea] [rallying cry of the dragonslayer] [some weapon buff on perditions blade] [no idea]

row two:
[strength of earth totem] [no idea] [no idea]

I'm sure one of those is a blasted land buff.

 

NiXXeD

We just killed him our first time the other day, and our only extra (entire raid) buff was the Zandalar buff you get for turning in hakkar's head.

I think it gives you +movement speed (10%) and like +15% stats. I don't think that was what pushed us over honestly, because I think we only had like 2 dead for the entire fight in our actual kill, and we had come close many other times.

The real trick IMO is to just learn the color combos... some are harder than others, but all seem to have a solution that is mostly manageable. It's also entirely impossible for someone to tell you the 'solution' because raid/gear makeups will determine things like whether or not you focus fire, or aoe, or have 2 groups, or 3, or 1 even.

I guess what I'd most suggest is that for your first kill, you may stack the raid a bit to help improve the phase 1 survivals... if we were doing AOE on a side (like say it's red) we would maybe bring 6 mages 4 locks instead of 5 5... you can really play with it as much as you see fit, but that will often help out the phase1 transition significantly.

 

Kytrarewn

My guild is in the exact same position as the OP, atm.

We use the AoE-Side/Assist-Side strat after a test run to see what the colors are. This past week, for example, we had Green/Black, on which we assisted that Green but AoEed the Black. Funny thing is that even with the lack of Warlock AoE over on the black side... the Green Side is the one that somewhat got overrun, rather than the black side.

Anyway, on occasion during our attempts, I'd go stupid with my buffs, personally, with elixir of the giants, elixir of the mongoose, elemental sharpening stones, mongoose potion, winterwall firewater, and a few other random things if I had them.

It *did* make a difference. But not nearly enough, and I don't even think that that same difference added between myself and the other 5 rogues in the raid would really quite be enough.

Granted, we've been getting buttfucked by lag lately whenever the Nef script starts, such that instant spells take, at minimum, 3-4 seconds, but it's still aggravating not to have him down.

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


Jesus don't want me in a sunbeam
Sunbeams are always made on me
Don't expect me to cry, for all the reasons I'm gonna die
Don't ever ask your kick of me.

 

Brilliance

Dont forget the DM buffs.

I had so many Cthun buffs I couldnt see my ToEP buff. (Pally blessings = win)

 

◊ Drauk

Hmm, what is that leftmost buff in top row ?

Fun is for casuals

 

◊ Zoid

Oh man, I never thought of that. We could have had 8 five man groups clearing DM North and all getting buffed before C'Thun.

Overkill!

 

phixion

When we were learning phase1 we did not use any consumables until we had refined our strategy with reagards tank rotations and solidifying our assisting on the assist train side. We were able to make Nef land on our 2nd pull phase1 but our execution was terrible, as well as the fact that we had at least 10-15 drakanoids running around when he landed so our transition is was bad.

Once we had refined everything and we were ready for a solid attempt at transitioning, we had all of our Melee DPS with as much +Str and AP as possible, stacked group make ups to maximize our DPS plus any potions available (stam food, mongoose, trolls blood, ect). We also had casters using +dmg potions and mana regen potions/food. (greater arcane elixir, wizard oil, frost dmg pots, mageblood, nightflins and stam food)

Once we knew how close we were to getting a smooth transition I just basically told everyone to have fun with it and go wild. I set up a little competition between the AoE and the Assist train side to see who would be cleaner going into phase 2 (very corny, but worked for the 1st kill :D) and it was flawless. We went from 10-15 drakanoids to about 7-8 respectivly going into phase2 (no consumables) to having 1-2 alive and everyone in position for the landing.

After that repition and gear makes it easier.

 

• Wodin

From left to right

Salt of the Scorpok (50AGI) Blasted Lands buff
Soulstone
Prayer of Shadow Protection
Lucky Rockets(250HP)
Prayer of Fortitude
Gift of the Wild
ZG Buff(15% all stats 10% runspeed)
Rallying Cry of the Dragonslayer
IP6 on Perditions
IP6 on Pugio
Mongoose
Giants
Strength of Earth Totem

Not shown because they wore off: Juju Power(40AP), Winterfall Firewater(20AP and +size)

Edit: I munched neither my flask of the titans nor my zanza since things were going so well.

 

Taeme

Blasted Land buff, strike of the scorp whatever.

you're the one that decided to trust me

 

◊ Drauk

And the last one is zanza spirit it seems (+50 stam +50 spirit)

Fun is for casuals

 

Kytrarewn

Aha, is that the buff that you get for turning in the quest... but before you use your Ground Scorpok Assay?

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


Jesus don't want me in a sunbeam
Sunbeams are always made on me
Don't expect me to cry, for all the reasons I'm gonna die
Don't ever ask your kick of me.

 

• Wodin

No, just what you get for using the Assay. They changed the icon recently.

 

Mesquite

We just cant seem to get those guys down fast enough in phase 1, it goes good for awhile, then you will see one slide past the tanks, then two...then Im dead and so is the rest of the healers cause they got away from the tanks.

We have two tanks on each side grabbing them when they come out, one side is AOE, the other is our rogues. Sometimes the AOE is doing good, but the rogues are not, then vise versa.

How many attempts a night would you other guilds put in before calling it a night? I really believe that we dont try long enough.

 

Maledict

As a light raiding guild, we did about 3 hours worth - but not continously, we were often discussing tactics and changing things between attempts.

We use more than 2 tanks though - we have 5 warriors generally, and we use several druids in feral form as well.
We have one druid in bear form stand on each side ready to grab anything that gets loose and drag the mobs back to the killing area on each side respectively - the feral charge thing they use seems great for this.

To be fari though, we do have great DPS as a guild, probably above average, as we seem to get weapon drops constantly. We've only killed Nefarian once, for example, and got Ashkandi and Crul'shorukh. That might be why a single druid on each side is capable of grabbing the strays...

 

Somnambulist

Like some other people stated, anything to bump up DPS overall as a raid is huge. Once we consistently started getting to phase 2 our MT used a flask and our casters started using flasks of supreme power. I think we killed Nefarian the fourth time we got to phase 2.

Nefarian is all about surviving phase 1. When you can beat phase 1 losing no one or only a few people then you'll find the rest of the fight is just learning what to do on the class calls until phase 3.

When we started learning the fight we lost a lot of people in phase 1 until we split the raid casters by the door and melee DPS by the throne. I don't know if this is the same way everytime since we only have 12 or so Nef. kills under our belt, but for us the mobs that are easiest for casters to kill always spawn by the door and the mobs easiest for melee to kill always spawn by the throne.

Basicallly we stack rogues / hunters by the throne with a warrior or two, stick a warlock by the brazier to hellfire non-stop to catch the adds and just burn the mobs. On the door side we stick the rest of our warriors to keep the mobs grouped in the spawn point and have all of our mages AoE and pallies consecrate to keep the mobs pulled together at the spawn point with a warlock putting up CoE on the mobs. (If you can't tell the key to phase 1 is keeping the spawns grouped together and as a result under control...)

 

subscience

Pot more, noob! :wub:

 

Malorum

We basically use an assist-side/aoe-side strat after we see what colors we have and load dps according to that. When were first learning Nef we practiced the core of our strategy first before popping consumables. We now almost always use Mongoose, Sharpening Stones, Wizard Oil, Mana Oil, and Arcane Elixirs. We dont worry much about anything other than that for the most part when it comes to Nef now.

We always have at least 3 warriors/feral druids at each spawn point to tag the mobs and control them. Having 3 warriors with Ashkandi and 2 fury warriors with Cor helps a bit too :).

 

Nite_Moogle

As others have said the real key to beating Nef is surviving phase one with 35+ up and a successful transition to phase 2. Some combos are harder than others and depending on your raid makeup and color your strategy will have to differ from week to week. Once you get P1 down tt really shouldn't take any more than ten P2 attempts to get to P3 (if that), which is easily defeated by sufficient amounts of Holy Water (easily the most important consumable on the fight). A flask on the main tank never hurts to help with the shadowflame+melee spike damage, but Nef is much more about proper execution than anything else.

 

Kytrarewn

OK, so we've been farming Strat Holy Water for nef, though we still haven't gotten him to P3. But, in all honesty, do guilds that have been farming him for 6 months still use the Holy Water for Phase 3? Between BWL clears, AQ40 (though clearning through emps to C'thun in one night probably means that that's not a big concern), farming gold for repairs, farming consumables for other fights, et cetera... Do you really have the time to spend 6 hours a week in Live Strat hoping that you get one of the few Holy Waters that drops?

Basically I'm just wondering if this is something useful for the first several nef kills... or if we're forever going to be hooked on having to use that crutch (think LBRS buff for Rag/Vael. The few guilds I know that used that trick are still completely inable to defeat those encounters without it).

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


Jesus don't want me in a sunbeam
Sunbeams are always made on me
Don't expect me to cry, for all the reasons I'm gonna die
Don't ever ask your kick of me.

 

Maledict

Don't you just run through dead side strath and open all the crates to get holy water?

We had farmed some for our first kill, but I'm not sure how effective it was to be honest. I think having 5 ice mages all specced with maximum snaring Blizzard probably helped...

I'l have to ask our rogues how much they used actually.