Hello guys.

In a few nights of practice on C'thun I've noticed that some of the combos
(like 2 non linked eye beams that hit me in few seconds, added to a tick of mind flay)
kill me no matter what I do or anyone else in the raid does (The healers can't react fast enough).

These combos hit me pretty often.. perhaps once every 2-3 tries, and it's starting to feel really frustrating.

Potions help sometimes, but not nearly often enough to make it feel "safe".

Should I start gathering a lot more stamina gear or bring my nature resistance set, or is there some other way around that? Or is it just me having terribly bad luck?
I'm a rogue btw.

Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.

With perfect execution you'll still often have one person die through something unavoidable (without being psychic) every phase 1. That's what your battle rezzes are for.

You mean that Eye hit you with 2 beams in a row ?

You really can't avoid him eye blasting you two times in a row, it's just shitty when it happens. If your healers can't react fast enough, then just bring some consumables and pop one right after he hits you the first time, then if he targets you again use it.

No. Contrary to speculation, there are no unavoidable deaths on C'Thun. Sometimes a death may be personally unavoidable to you because some other idiot gets you killed or other people in your raid let you down, but that's different.

Take the back-to-back beam scenario. C'Thun targets you before he beams you. It takes 2 seconds to cast. Then he targets you again, and takes 2 more seconds to cast. A good healer will have a heal going before the first beam even hits you, let alone the second. A good healer will have you shielded before the second beam hits, or will NS heal you if he sees that C'Thun is about to beam someone who is low enough on health that the beam is likely to be fatal. "Our healers can't react fast enough" isn't an unavoidable death. [Edit: As Holland said, if you can't trust your healers, bring emergency consumables for those situations. Either NR pots, or get a healthstone beforehand so you can pop that and a tuber or something if you know you're about to die. BTW, if you vanished while C'Thun was casting an eye beam at you, would it still hit you?]

Your raid organization should make sure that the small tentacles are dying such that they aren't causing sufficient mindflay damage to allow the beam to one-shot other people. And so forth.

Every single death is preventable in some way. Even the "omg a claw ruptured me into the glare" deaths.

Bullshit -- we usually have like 1-2 deaths during phase 1 these days and it's invariably to someone being stupid and staring at an incoming dark glare like a deer in headlights. Sure, with battle rezzes, 1-2 deaths on phase 1 is acceptable, but with perfect execution zero deaths is very possible, every time. We just aren't quite perfect.

Um, last week we had a pretty much perfect phase one and still had someone die to, from what I recall, a Claw Tentacle popping up and throwing them into dark glare. That's avoidable to an extent, but it's hardly a stupid mistake, and it happened to one of the people who doesn't dumbly stare into an oncoming dark glare. As I recall, you said it was pretty much unavoidable at the time.

Sure, USUALLY we have two or so deaths due to people standing still like idiots to get that last heal off before running, but I still think with perfect execution you're going to end up with someone randomly getting owned by the various factors.

Nitpicking: Eye starts charging Glare in your direction, you start running, just as you get ~10-20y away you get claw ruptured back to beam start location. How is this avoidable? Sure, it's a really rare situation, but it is possible.


(Actually, it may be theoretically avoidable by making sure you don't run across a player's former position. Screw you Gurg, be wrong for once)

That's all I was saying. I've never died to that because I'm always well over 30 yards away from Dark Glare when it goes off, even if it was initially targetted at my original position in the room. People who hesitate, react more slowly, or try to squeeze in one last nuke or heal before they start to move, are the ones who die.

I generally start moving well before he starts actually charging Glare because it's possible to predict it a bit before then. If I'm in the NE, and he's going to Glare on the NE, I can usually be in the NW corner by the time the Glare actually starts. A Claw knockback wouldn't put me in danger.

Two Claw knockbacks would, but if that happens it's because my raid isn't doing what it should be in other ways, and thus goes back into the "avoidable" column.

I love this encounter for the aforementioned reasons. It truly spotlights the retards in your guild. C'thun is the Hemingway of WoW -- he burns the fat from your souls and the retards from your raids.

Exactly. Some of things I've witnessed players do during dark glare is down right astounding, not to mention aggravating. Things from people trying to out run Dark Glare by running around the very outside of the circular room, staying just ahead of the beam and PRAYING no claw tenticle spawns below them, to people strafing left/right/left/right as they stare into C'Thun's pupil as he stares right back at them, trying to guess exactly when and where the glare is going to hit. People need to pick a direction and hit num locks and go! Its all a question of risk management.

Note: Nice topic title. :o

Your healers need to get better. I love the C'Thun fight because my total responsibility is to the people in my party. It's my job to keep those four other people alive during phase one, that's it. I can help out with the other groups left and right of me, but the rest of the raid is out of range and have their own healers.

I constantly keep C'Thun targetted during the fight and watch who he's targetting. If its someone in my party I start a heal immediately on them. If its a low HP class (mage for example) I usually shield, then heal in case of a double beam.

I've been triple beamed myself (we've done phase one, many many times) and kept myself up through it. I've only lost a mage to a double beam once and that's because I screwed up, not him.

Tell your healers that all they have to do is keep the four other people in their party up. If of them die to a non-linked beam, its the healer's fault for that death.

It's your job to make sure your ass isn't near anyone else's. :) No healer can keep you up through a beam that's bounced twice.

Long time no see Jagermaestro :)

As for phase 1, i'm going to agree with gurg. The only deaths that occur are because either a: Your raid is inexperienced or unaware of what they should be doing, or b: Your healers aren't awake.

If everyone was doing what they were supposed to be doing, the chances of someone dying in phase 1 is slim to none. There is a random factor there, but all it does is throw up the difficulty of the fight, doesn't mean the person is 1-hit no matter what. Consumables / pro-active healing can keep someone up through anything phase 1 has to offer, barring if your raid looks like a bunch of 6 year olds playing soccer. In which case you should probably re-visit the importance of spreading out :)

95% of deaths that people sustain in Phase 1 are easily preventable, 4% of the deaths are difficult to prevent, but still preventable, and I'd say maybe 1% of death's are pretty much not preventable (such as the scenario Jager pointed out).

So no, victory is not a coin toss. If everyone does what they're supposed to, you should be able to get through with 38-39+ every single time.

Yeah, the Claw rupture such that you cause a bounce while in midair is probably the closest that you get to unavoidable. Most people should have the buffed hp to survive this. Mages may not, but Ice Block could've saved them. Priests may not, but Spell Warding (one of the best raiding talents in the game) and a quick shield probably would've. Of course all of this assumes horrible luck and failing to resist any of the beam damage. Combine that precise sequence of events with that precise timing and complete resist failure, and you get something that should happen once every few dozen attempts, if that.

But yes, I concede that if the RNG absolutely wants to screw you, you may be unavoidably dead.

But 99% of C'Thun Phase 1 deaths are preventable, and people working on the fight should reject the excuse of "ugh that was a bullshit death" and try to analyze why it happened. Dying to Dark Glare always involves a fuck-up, for starters.

That sounds fun.

every single death in stage 1 of c'thun is entirely avoidable. we always have 1-2 deaths, and it's always the same 3-4 people dying. it's not like they're exceptionally unlucky. it's clearly something they're doing wrong.

Up and over sounds fun, but once we had a warrior get ruptured into the little tail-beam sticking out on the other side of the eye. Apparently, that kills you as well!

wtf it's a wibble.

snoof.

The eye beam's cast time is just like any spell, hence hunters can Feign Death before it goes off, and rogues can Vanish. The eye will lose target.

QFT. i only ever get hit by the eyebeam if feign is on cooldown or i'm greedy with an aimed shot.