I realise this thread is dedicated to DPS, however if there are no objections I was wondering if some people could post Healing Meters from the Patchwerk fight. More specifically I'm interested in the Overhealing Meters.
My guild is currently working on Patchwerk (I expect him to be down in 1-2 days) however on our first day of attempts (mostly unbuffed, except flasks) most of our healers had an incredibly high amount of overhealing (60-70%). Our best attempts (~70% unbuffed raid) showed a slight improvement in overhealing but still a few healers that had 60%+ overhealing. Ofcourse overhealing isnt a problem on itself, however the fact that most healers were out of mana at about 85% is.




p.s.
I'm not asking for freebies or hints, I am just curious how other guilds are performing (Over)Heal-wise. My guild and I enjoy beating encounters without the help of video's/spoilers/hints etc, and will remain to do so. I wrote this reply out of personal curiosity.

Ergh, I had it running but didn't reset it. :(

thats what flametongue totem is for ;)

Personally I don't think overhealing meters are going to help you, because no matter what you'll be overhealing on Patchwerk. Obviously if people are going OOM at 85% they are doing something wrong, but healers just need to get a feel for the rotation of the fight and how they need to heal their tank.

Last night was an interesting Patchwerk test for us, after massive server instability Wednesday we called him off, but again we were getting nasty lag but still managed to get him. Our healers literally could not cancel heals or the tanks would die due to the skill lag we were getting, and somehow they didn't go OOM, just because they knew how the rotation of HS's would go. Obviously I don't play a healing class but it certainly seemed like once our priests got the hang of it he wasn't too tough. Our druids were already awesome at spam healing efficiently so we didn't worry about them much.


The really cool thing about this thread is how different damage meters can look, and the alliance and horde differences. Horde Fury warriors put out *insane* damage with Windfury, and it's huge for rogues as well. Alliance melee seems to be a bit behind the Mages though, and we even have some Warlocks thrown in there for good measure.

Poor hunters can't really match up on this fight though, especially Horde.

we can put up respectable numbers, as my damage meter hopefully showed, but yeah, we aren't really as well built for "i want you to hit me as hard as you can" as some other classes :-P

Alliance buffs are better than horde buffs according to Chalon's spreadsheet. Horde raids also usually want their hunters with an agi totem, which would widen the gap

Rogues with AP instead of extra attacks makes hemo a bit better. Might be important next patch.

I was under the impression that wf+soe was far and away better than bom and kings, for rogues. 155 ap and 10% str and agil vs 77(?) ap and wf, Im fairly sure blessings dont come even close. Obviously not everyone in the raid will have the totems they want all the time, but assuming you do they are better right? (melee)

Yeah I did, that DM just seemed a bit out of the ordinary for Patchwerk, I thought Alliance mages were pushing 700+ DPS on this fight which is pretty crazy.

And yes, I realize at the current gear level Alliance Buffs > Horde buffs for daggers, but eventually we'll hit the point where Windfury outscales them. Also the spreadsheet doesn't include imp Windfury I believe, unless I'm behind the times? So I'm not really sure where the two stand in respect to that.

Either way Fury Warriors do scary DPS on that fight, one in pretty gimp fury gear still destroyed basically everyone last night for us, except a mage, Windfury is just that awesome.

Well, it depends on the gear level to an extent, but typically no, in most scenarios BoM + Kings is a little better than WF + Strength of Earth. For example, with the gear I wear for Patchwerk plus Mark, Battle Shout, TSA, Elixir of Giants, Elixir of Mongoose, Grilled Squid, Winterfall Firewater, BoK, and BoM, my predicted DPS is ~669 (which btw is extremely close to the DPS I actually do put out on Patchwerk).

Now if I drop BoK and BoM, and instead get Strength of Earth and Windfury, my DPS numbers drop to ~651 DPS. Now, a big reason for this is poisons. You lose anywhere from ~16-20 DPS from having Windfury on your main hand instead of Instant Poisons (it depends on the speed of your main hand). In my particular case, my main hand does about 18.77 DPS. So interestingly, if WF didn't overwrite the MH poisons, I would do pretty the same damage as Horde or Alliance. But as it is, I would lose 18 DPS.

Now, the catch is Windfury scales better than BoK and BoM do (well, BoM doesn't scale at all of course). So, for a top-geared rogue with the best gear currently in the game, the difference is about 8-9 DPS instead of 18. But BoK + BoM still prevails.

This is true, I haven't updated it to take into account the increased attack power. Is the talent something commonly being picked up by raiding Shamans, to the point where it's reasonable to have it be the default?

In response to thaen:

Can't speak for the other mages who obviously did better than I did, but with my current gear (seen at the link in my signature) I have about 6500 mana raid buffed for that fight. I had Nightfin and Mageblood both active, and I also have 3/3 Arcane Meditation (and, obviously, Mage Armor active). I used Rank 11 the whole fight, except at the end when I wanded a bit. At about 4k mana I popped a Mana Ruby, kept going till around 3k, popped a Major Mana, ran until dry, used Evoc + Mana Citrine to max out again, ran to 4k, popped a Major Mana, then ran until dry. Obviously my consumeable order was poor (as evidenced by Xane's order, I don't think he had mana issues at the end), at the 5% mark I was completely out of mana and wanding while waiting for the last 15 seconds on a mana potion cooldown, at which point I popped it again and ran through that. It's entirely feasible to maintain your dps with the smart use of consumeables (if I had been smart enough to make more than two mana gems, I don't think I would've had mana issues at all), and it'll only get easier as gear goes up and the fight gets shorter.

i keep seeing posts talking about mages doing insane damage on patchwerk, and ours just aren't. they're competitive, but they certainly aren't blowing people away. are these insane numbers coming from fully buffed mages with flasks and such, or are they all fire spec, or what? our mages are all very solid, but hearing all of this i can't help but feel like maybe we're missing something.

Ok, I locally updated the AP bonus to assume the Shaman has the 30% talent, it becomes 669.7 for Alliance with the buffs listed, and 652.86 for the gear I use on the fight. So Alliance still comes out ahead.

Wow, less than a 2 DPS increase? Perhaps it isn't worth it to spec that way then... I assume it's a bit more for warriors, but that it is still surprisingly low.

I'd like to see a screenshot of your DMs so I can get an idea of your definition of "insane numbers". As for the picture Wodin posted on the last page, all of our mages are Frost specced (with the exception of maybe one mage left in our guild, we are all Frost mages now) with a variation of 0/20/31 or 0/30/21 I believe, and all of them had Mageblood/Greater Arcane Elixir/Flask of Supreme Power/Blessed Wizard Oil/Rune of the Dawn. With that in mind, all of the mages placed in the top 12 and were intermingled nicely with Rogues. I know it might be bragging, but it's pretty nice to see those Damage Meters and see that there isn't a massive spread between #1 and #10. Shows that everyone is pretty much pulling their own weight.

i posted a DM and breakdown in post #175 in this thread :-P

none of our mages were flasked, though i can't speak for their other buffs. i know i did a tons of AOE necrotic rune farming with a bunch of them to stock up on sharpening stones myself, so i'm sure they at leave have blessed wizard oils, and we always havea bunch of acane elixers and magebloods around :-P

Oddly enough, I found Grace of Air+ SoE to give me 6 more dps over WF+SoE after buffs. Using Pugio and CHT, full BF. Unbuffed its like 12dps over WF. Guess it might be time to rethink our raid setup and priority, at least at my current AP level.

Thank you for your very useful spreadsheet.

Well, obviously I'm Alliance here, but one thing to consider there is Grace of Air typically means you will lose 190 AP (you gain 100 from True Shot Aura, but lose 190 from no Battle Shout). So you should keep that in mind when comparing Grace of Air to Windfury.

:kaubel: Yeah I'm dumb, didn't look back that far. But yeah, Flasks would make a huge difference. Flask all of your mages next time.

well, we did just fine without them - 100-0 down with no deaths, no time-based enrage. i just keep seeing people talking about mages putting up huge numbers and i was wondering if we're missing something. i'm fine with that 'something' being flasks, since it's just something we're choosing not to use rather than actually missing :)

I don't know about "default" but if a Shaman in my guild doesn't get MTT, they generally have Imp. Weapon totems. We're a raiding guild so people spend points accordingly. ^.^

Major mana and gems as soon as you've used the mana it fills. Go as long as you can before evoc'ing. Ideally, you'll get 2 major mana, and 2 gems down, then blow mana, switch to spirit weapons, evoc will fill you to 100%, and go back to nuking until pot/gem timers are up. I went 7:10 seconds switching between fireball and scorch. A big part of it too, is JOW. Scorching with JOW/BOW and high spirit you actually gain mana pretty often. I remember specific times when I'd switch to scorch, proc some judgements, and crit a few times, go up like 5% of my mana.

A link to my profile if anyone's interested in fire mage stuff.
http://ctprofiles.net/1063680

I'll get gauss to post the DM of our kill where I did 740 dps and like 320k dmg.

edit: here it is actually. http://www.imagedump.com/index.cgi?p..._id=0&warned=y