Copernicus

The expansion is a whole new way to balance raids. The Alliance Shaman/Horde Paladin rumor has been around since the game came out. From Blizzard's perspective, it solves any problem of trying to balance the two factions.

For raid balancing, if Blizzard does go through with this, I'd expect them to work on encounters balanced for 36 and 18 people, at least initially or on the earlier raid dungeons. It's another way to make raiding more casual-friendly.

 

james

4 paladins (for BoL) really improves their healing efficiency.

 

• Kalroth

While giving Horde Paladins and Alliance Shamans would be a very quick and simple way to balance the factions, I highly doubt that Blizzard wants to go down that road since it would pretty much invalidate all the (hard) work they've been spending on creating two different factions.

Personally I see Shaman totem fixes in TBC as a much more realistic alternative. But then again, Blizzard has been known to make some rather dubious decisions so I wouldn't put Undead Paladins in the "Not going to happen ever" category. :)

I can't remember the last time, if ever, that we followed that raid model. We're always overrepresented in 1-3 classes and thus low in 1-3 other classes, so I really doubt that the introduction of a new class is going to change much.

 

Ravock

The idea that giving Shaman's raid wide totems would cause a desire to bring less Shaman's is just stupid. Perhaps some new mechanics would have to be developed as far as what a shaman can and cannot drop at a given time, but if I was horde (I'm not horde, I'm alliance) I could still see plenty of reasons to want 3-4 shamans on a raid without question. You might need two shamans setting TA totems spaced out enough to cover all of the healers / ranged DPS'ers, and have a 3rd shaman carefully placing a TA totem to benefit the melee DPS'ers without it being in range of the MT. You'd still need atleast 2 or 3 shamans to cover all of the melee DPS'ers with WF, GoA, and SoE totems.

I don't know... I just don't understand it. From my perspective it would solve a lot of issues, make the shaman class a bit more dynamic, and almost completely settle the long lasting debate of shamans vs paladins, horde vs alliance.

 

Malan

/agree. We're usually lower on hunters and warlocks (2-3 of each) and take 6-7 warriors and maybe some extra mages or priests/druids.

Yes, and thats what we told Eyonix and that other CM. No response from them. The mechanic that we want is NOT to just suddenly have every totem effect every person in the raid, because as you said, the problems with Tranquil Air would be huge just as one example. Best mechanic I saw suggested was that shamans would be able to "conjure" a "raid totem item" that they would distribute to players through the trade window - with each player only being able to hold one raid totem at any time (making them only able to get totems from one shaman at a time). That Raid Totem item would allow them to get the buffs from that particular shaman, no matter what group they were in, as long as they were in range of the totems. (Or just make the range restriction go away completely. Not like range affects a pally's blessings)

Shitting up every single thread on EJ since '06

 

Maledict

The solutions to raid totems have been offered so many times it's ludicrous, and Blizzards response about it making you "want less shaman to raid" is nonsense. Heck, just make each Shaman only be able to drop one raid wide totem them. You'd still want 4+ on raids.

 

• Bad Luck

It really can't be implied from that screenshot though. There is a Human NPC in LHC with Hunter Dungeon 2 armor, does that mean Humans can be Hunters?

If it does happen, so rolling a male BE Paladin. HOT!

 

Falcon24

If that happens I would be a Paladin as my new main, except I'm pretty sure it won't happen. Besides I'm fairly sure I've seen Draenei in Paladin armor in some shots

 

Digo

High-concept is cool and fun to talk about, but at the end of the day, game balance is more important. When the distinction between your factions becomes so glaringly obvious and the discrepancy in class value gets worse and worse (Kings and Salvation are % buffs, which means they scale), then as a designer, I think you have to reconsider. Short or redesigning an entire class (shaman) or nerfing another one into oblivion (paladin), this is the best option.

Would this change surprise me? No. Would it piss off legions of drooling forum trolls? Who cares. I think it is better for the game.

 

Maledict

Yeah _ Dranai have been confirmed as being Paladins. But again, that wouldn't affect balance - currently, 3 Horde races can be Shaman, (troll, orc & tauren), whilst only 2 alliance races can be paladins (humans & dwarves). Letting the Dranae be both Paladins and Shaman wouldn't affect the class balance - of course, it makes absolutely no sense in any way lore wise, in a way that makes the current re-writing look like a shakespeare masterpiece.

The Dranai pretty much embody the light. Re-writing that so they are, at the same time, also in touch enough with the natural world and the elements is going to be difficult, especially given their spaceships & lifepods history.

 

• frmorrison

Certainly, Draeni are going to be able to be Paladins, since the Allaince only has 2 races that can be a Pally, while the horde has three that can be Shaman.

This change may break lore, but since the Alliance/Horde have worked together before to defeat the Burning Legion, it would make sense to do it again.

DK - Ashbane Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor.

 

◊ Praetorian

No no no it's not a spaceship. Don't say spaceship! It's an interdimensional ship. Totally different, you see.

 

Malan

Kaplan really showed his ass when it came to knowing anything about shaman and horde during a couple of video interviews from E3. You can find them somewhere over at ui.worldofwar.net. He made references to "really cool totems like stoneclaw" and some other shit that nobody uses outside of level grinding. He didn't seem to have any idea what he was talking about if the question included the words "Shaman" or "Horde".

Shitting up every single thread on EJ since '06

 

Digo

Don't you Philistines read any comics or know anything about mythology? There are all kinds of ships that sail between the worlds in mythology! The Ngalfar was a ship in Norse mythology crafted from the fingernails of dead men that would carry the heroes of Valhalla to final battle of Ragnarok at the end of worlds. Hell, even Charon's skiff carried people over from the realm of the living to the afterlife. There are all kinds of mythological references.

This debate has me all huffy. I'm going to go update wikipedia entries now or something to burn off my nerdy angst.

 

Falcon24

I want a fingernail boat

 

Whion

I'm Alliance so I only think this is a good idea, but I've wondered why they don't give Shamans a "Greater Totem". When this totem is dropped it cancels all their other totems and dropping another totem will cancel the Greater one. Make the Greater Totem affect the whole raid and give people a way to click off the buff. There, you've basically implemented Greater Blessings for the Horde. Its not quite as good as blessings since one Paladin can do Wisdom + Might but it still seems like a vast improvement to me.
I'm sure someone has suggested this before but I've never seen it.

 

Malan

Believe me Whion you're not the first to suggest that particular solution. There was a compilation thread on the WoW shaman forum that had something like 50-60 different ideas for raid totem improvements at one point. After which we got told there would be no major changes to mechanics of totems till after the expansion.

Shitting up every single thread on EJ since '06

 

Razzberry

Because it's the flag, man! You know... it's the... it's The Flag! It's blue, we're blue...

It's just important, okay? Trust me.

 

Kerulak

Heh. Good stuff so far. I strongly believe it will alleviate a lot of issues and solve more problems than it creates. When I first heard of this I thought back to the days of playing Street Fighter II and then hearing that there was a "possibility" of being able to play Guile vs. Guile in the upcoming SF2: Champion Edition. The naysayers didn't think it would be "right" or "fair"...but sure enough, out came SF2:CE and people were dual Guile-ing until they were blue in the face.

I expect most will just embrace the change and play on. Us lore lovers might be upset a bit, but that's the exception rather than the norm; 75% of my guild members don't even know "who" or "what" Draenor is. O.o

 

• Bad Luck

 

Falcon24

:blink:

 

• Wodin

That would be fun, but I'd feel vaguely guilty abandoning all of my dwarven paladins. :( In some ways I can see the appeal, but I would feel really badly for the various healers who ended up getting shoved out by the needs of class balance. Saying to someone who's been working on polishing their character for a year and a half "sorry we only need 4 now you're going to have to sit on the bench" is pretty harsh.

 

diospadre

Especially when you have mages and warlocks calling dibs on paladin spots.

 

• Lurchington

that's essentially the only reason I don't want this to go through. If I was a) selfish, and b) a dps class I'd be all over it.

 

Graham

We already do exactly that all the time, so I don't really see the difference. I assume most guilds are the same.