Some of the druid pieces truely suck compared to some other gear. Bracers, gloves and helmet are worse than stormrage. As a hunter I'd be very dissapointed to see druids bid on those pieces. This is when considering Stormrage setbonus.
You have no idea what you're talking about.
Originally Posted by Lyta
I've been trying to concentrate on studying for my Proof Methods test tomorrow, and all I can think of is your hotness, radiating out from the pixels on my monitor, seared straight into my neurons.
As a hunter with a shitload of DKP (we use the nurfed system, so technically I can get all my items before any of the Shamans/Druids/etc) I will be passing to the druids/shaman for the reasons mentioned above. Also I can do sufficiently well with 5/5 strikers and 3/8 DS (for the set bonus). Having the initial bonus' from the CS set aren't going to make or break my guild, but the set bonus' for the healers is very interesting...
Aren't you selling yourself a bit short here? With all the timered/add intensive fights in Naxx, I'd have to say DPS is still king, and by a wide margin.
Maybe it's the fact that at any given time I can pick up whatever pieces that drop, and I've never really been much of a loot whore (you can see via our guild DKP) so the "finally I'm getting x item" has never really happened to me.
Guaranteed drops I suppose take away from the nerd yelling on vent when items drop :)
I never really was uber excited to get the backpiece from C'Thun (guaranteed drop), but it was a very nice upgrade.
There are some hunters in the guild though that just can't wait to get the pieces...I suppose it's situational from guild to guild, but I think our healers need better gear as our hunters have been quite lucky IMO w/ their items.
Some of the druid pieces truely suck compared to some other gear. Bracers, gloves and helmet are worse than stormrage. As a hunter I'd be very dissapointed to see druids bid on those pieces. This is when considering Stormrage setbonus.
Huh? The gloves are an upgrade in every stat except shadow resistance. The only questionable one is the helm, but I really doubt Stormrage is better there.
Some of the druid pieces truely suck compared to some other gear. Bracers, gloves and helmet are worse than stormrage. As a hunter I'd be very dissapointed to see druids bid on those pieces. This is when considering Stormrage setbonus.
The 3/8 SR bonus is the only one I'd have to think really hard before giving up.
With 8/8, you can rely on the proc. That's the point.
No, the point was that too many shaman buy into this "omg I can't live without the EF bonuses because of the inherent weaknesses built into my class" drama that is perpetuated by the idiots over on the official boards. Instead of learning to heal effectively and manage their mana pools they rely on the proc to keep them up through fights.
I'm not really talking about set bonuses, although I'll agree that 5/8 Earthfury is awesome whether you're a shitty LHW spammer or someone who understands efficiency (3/8 is meaningless, I respecced to Totemic Mastery recently anyway). For my part, I use Rank 5 Healing Wave (with Healing Way stacked on tanks of course) probably 75% of the time now, pulling out LHW for oh shit moments or fights that are highly mobile, and Chain Heal for splash damage. My point is, I'm giving up int, spirit, mana/5, and a little +healing for... what, spell crit and some stam?
There's 14 mana/5 on the Earthfury pieces that I use now that I'd be dropping going to 7/8 Ten Storms. Even using Wavefront Necklace, the Primalist's Set, and Rejuv/Shard of the Scale, that's still a chunk of mana/5 to give up.
Granted there are fights where critting (and proccing Ancestral Fortitude) are quite useful (Sartura comes to mind, as well as healing a Fankriss hatchling offtank), but I don't really see the benefit of going wholesale to Ten Storms over 5-piece Earthfury.
You gain 8 spirit, 5 stam, 37 healing, but lose the 6mana/5. With the amount of +healing you already have as a druid, I'd take the mana/5 any day of the week.
Combined with the 3-set-bonus on Stormrage (15% mana regeneration while casting), while considering that the three pieces I mentioned are the smallest upgrades from stormrage - as a druid - I'd prefer the three SR pieces.
You gain 8 spirit, 5 stam, 37 healing, but lose the 6mana/5. With the amount of +healing you already have as a druid, I'd take the mana/5 any day of the week.
Combined with the 3-set-bonus on Stormrage (15% mana regeneration while casting), while considering that the three pieces I mentioned are the smallest upgrades from stormrage - as a druid - I'd prefer the three SR pieces.
The 3-piece SR bonus is nice and I currently never break it up, but why would you use mana/5 as a bullet point in your argument? Because during 90% of the time spent raiding an instance, aka trash clearing, mana pools are more important than +healing?
Like I said, you have no idea what you're talking about, and your campaign to get druids to pass you loot is nothing short of absurd.
Originally Posted by Lyta
I've been trying to concentrate on studying for my Proof Methods test tomorrow, and all I can think of is your hotness, radiating out from the pixels on my monitor, seared straight into my neurons.
It's not a campaign, I just feel the upgrade is bigger for hunters. And as it has been said on so many occasions regarding naxx, and generally getting various bosses downed - damage is king.
Besides - mana/5 wasn't the "bullet point" of my argumentation, I was merely stressing that I don't see the dreamwalker headpiece as an upgrade, it seems like more of a sidegrade, whereas the hunterset is a huge upgrade - and as such, breaking up the 3-set-bonus of SR isn't that appealing, when your raid would benefit more from another class getting the item.
However - yes, you are right. I probably have no clue what I'm talking about. My main character is a hunter, and I have very little experience with druids in raid, I've played one once or twice, in a non-stress environment - but in my eyes those three pieces aren't as great an upgrade for druids as they are for hunters.
I'm a big fan of druids stacking +healing gear. Getting ridiculous rejuv's tossed on you is quite nice, and depending on use can be situationally great. Haven't experienced everything to Naxx yet, but a common fight people will notice this with is Maexxna. When your MT is webbed having a Rejuv tick for 500+ would be great, and the mana/5 isn't going to help you out there ;)
A hunter is my main. I have looked at the other sets as well as talked to civilized people in the classes about upgrades, and it seems as if they're going to benefit the raid a lot more then my DPS upgrade. 2/9 bonus for druid is interesting. No druid in my guild has the 2/9 yet, but I'd like to see how it works out for us. Maybe druids will cast random rank 1 rejuv's on the raid for procs? I have no idea of the %'s, which is also why I can't discount the usefulness in a raid.
In regards to the argument about mana/5 look at the set bonus' for the druid set. 4/9 lowers the mana cost of all healing spells by 3%, and using rank 4 healing touch (is this a good example? Help me out druids) your 2.5 second heal (180 mana) is now costing 175 mana (174.6, but rounding up) which is 10 mana/5.
This is of course assuming you're chain healing. Higher ranks such as Rank 11 (800 mana according to thottbot) is going to actually save you 40 mana/5. Lowered costs on rejuv/regrowth are also much appreciate too I'd say.
My numbers can be off, and this may not be the best analogy, but I think it'd be safe to assume that with tier 3 they'll save more mana.
The entire Tier 3 set however is a higher mana/5 then the previous (disregarding the ring), so I think it'd be safe to replace the 3 piece 15% mana regen while casting as you'll probably be making this back in lowered spell cost as well as high mana/5.
Not sure how practical my Theorycraft is...especially on a number heavy board such as EJ's ;)
*edit*
Quick number crunch:
Stormrage:
+healing: 275
mana/5: 20
spirit: 103
Dreamwalker:
+healing: 436
mana/5: 35
spirit: 114
Let's assume that a Druid has 225 spirit (my number may be off with what an 8/8 SR druid would have, but follow along) if they're benefitting from 15% of the regen from the Stormrage we'll use the following:
Spirit/5 + 15 = regen = 60
15% of this is 9/tick, which happens to be 2 seconds....soooo having the bonus you're gaining an additional 22.5 mana/5.
So yeah...using the math above (and comparing the 8/9 vs. 8/8 SR) I think it's safe to say that while casting you'll gain more of a benefit from the 8/9!
PS my number could be completely bogus...I used wowwiki for the Druid spirit regeneration and thottbot for some other numbers. Like I said I'm a hunter, not a Druid, but I try to understand you guys the best I can ;)
Druids have spirit/5 makes the 15% while casting not as good as a Priest's spirit/4.
I haven't read any raiding druid saying that they don't want 8 Dreamwalker, unlike Priests, where the 8 Faith may not be that great compared to 3 Trans 6 Faith.
Millions of words are written annually purporting to tell how to beat the races, whereas the best possible advice on the subject is found in the three monosyllables: 'Do not try.'
I was merely stressing that I don't see the dreamwalker headpiece as an upgrade, it seems like more of a sidegrade, whereas the hunterset is a huge upgrade - and as such, breaking up the 3-set-bonus of SR isn't that appealing, when your raid would benefit more from another class getting the item.
When 2-piece druids start sticking rejuv on you, you'll think twice about the usefulness of dreamwalker. ;)
Originally Posted by Lyta
I've been trying to concentrate on studying for my Proof Methods test tomorrow, and all I can think of is your hotness, radiating out from the pixels on my monitor, seared straight into my neurons.
The hunter set is a pretty good upgrade depending on what you are using currently. The belt isnt that much better than Ossiran's binding, and the gloves don't come close to black grasp of the destroyer (at least for horde). Other peices are rediculously good upgrades. The helm, shoulders, legs, and chest specifically.
Originally Posted by masanbol
It probably shouldn't surprise me that the first applications of one of the coolest creature designers ever made is going to be cockmonsters and titwalkers.
Originally Posted by Zyla
I mean christ, cunnilingus is much like being a resto shaman, you spam the button and let it do the work. So long as you change targets as appropriate you don't need to put any thought into it.
The hunter set is a pretty good upgrade depending on what you are using currently. The belt isnt that much better than Ossiran's binding, and the gloves don't come close to black grasp of the destroyer (at least for horde). Other peices are rediculously good upgrades. The helm, shoulders, legs, and chest specifically.
the gloves are much better than black grasp if you're using consumables to maintain your mana pool. i can't speak to how difficult managing your mana is as a horde hunter, but chain-superior mana potting and demonic/dark runes keep me from ever going OOM, and CS give substantially more ap/crit
The hunter set is a pretty good upgrade depending on what you are using currently. The belt isnt that much better than Ossiran's binding, and the gloves don't come close to black grasp of the destroyer (at least for horde). Other peices are rediculously good upgrades. The helm, shoulders, legs, and chest specifically.
the gloves are much better than black grasp if you're using consumables to maintain your mana pool. i can't speak to how difficult managing your mana is as a horde hunter, but chain-superior mana potting and demonic/dark runes keep me from ever going OOM, and CS give substantially more ap/crit
I stick with greater mana potions / lesser mana oils for cost purposes, and save my dark runes for new content. I do go oom quite a bit, esp. when I don't get a shaman (Of course, I don't have my gloves yet, so I can't give a fair anecdotal comment, but the math suggests ~23mp/5 from them).
Originally Posted by masanbol
It probably shouldn't surprise me that the first applications of one of the coolest creature designers ever made is going to be cockmonsters and titwalkers.
Originally Posted by Zyla
I mean christ, cunnilingus is much like being a resto shaman, you spam the button and let it do the work. So long as you change targets as appropriate you don't need to put any thought into it.
No one in our guild has 6 of any piece, so until that happens I'm passing for the caster 2 piece which they seem to like. I'm not impressed with the fact you need your pet out for the hunter 2 piece bonus...
No one in our guild has 6 of any piece, so until that happens I'm passing for the caster 2 piece which they seem to like. I'm not impressed with the fact you need your pet out for the hunter 2 piece bonus...
Steelfleece usually hides his pet somewhere. You'll be zoning in and see this random wolf hanging out near a barrel.
The point was that too many shaman buy into this "omg I can't live without the EF bonuses because of the inherent weaknesses built into my class" drama that is perpetuated by the idiots over on the official boards. Instead of learning to heal effectively and manage their mana pools they rely on the proc to keep them up through fights.
8/8 is a 20% mana refund and a 25% splash heal. What pieces of armor are going to compete with that on fights where the rogues are taking damage?
5/5 doomcaller for warlock is simply the most important set for a raiding warlock, the reduction on thier shadowbolt mana cost improves thier damage effieceny (especially on fights like patchy). So T2.5 is really important for warlocks.
No one in our guild has 6 of any piece, so until that happens I'm passing for the caster 2 piece which they seem to like. I'm not impressed with the fact you need your pet out for the hunter 2 piece bonus...
Steelfleece usually hides his pet somewhere. You'll be zoning in and see this random wolf hanging out near a barrel.
I'm not impressed with the fact you need your pet out for the hunter 2 piece bonus...
Isn't 2 piece the increase in Rapid Fire? The 4 piece is the 50 AP to you and your pet (seems you need your pet out to get the bonus).
Does Steelfleece hide his pet somewhere so he doesn't have to worry about pet deaths?
Millions of words are written annually purporting to tell how to beat the races, whereas the best possible advice on the subject is found in the three monosyllables: 'Do not try.'
07/22/06, 8:53 AM
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