Thunderfury: Main hand or Off Hand? - Page 2

Chamelean · 08/24/06, 7:27 PM

Originally Posted by Emth

And warriors tend to use more instants (virtually every global cooldown)

More instants than who? All rogue specials are instant, and a sword rogue generall does nothing but spam SS. Slow main hand weapons are far better for Rogues than fast. Thunderfury can be an exception though because the proc is so good.

iPodschun · 08/24/06, 7:52 PM

Most Warriors are hitting Hamstring between their other attacks. Rogues are hitting their instants every 4 or 6 seconds.

The Mercenary · 08/25/06, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by Quebeen

DPSing with TF = mass aggro, off-handing it reduces that aggro considerably, but yea dmg decrease it quite a hit. Just offhand it if yer MTs are slacking or w/e ;]

If you aren't Alliance, or if your MT's "just suck" you do more damage with the TF in the OH than you do with it in the MH. In the MH when you actually use it to it's full potential, you will get aggro on the majority of fights, which either a) kills you or b) forces you to stand around doing absolutely nothing for a while. I don't think anyone is debating what weapon does the most damage, the debate should be, what weapon combination allows you the most damage. There are a few fights where MH the TF and going all out is fine (and recommended) but on most...no.

MatsT · 08/28/06, 4:14 PM

I'd just like to add that another reason why it will proc so much for warriors is that it can proc twice for heroic strikes, once for the autoattack and once for the heroic strike part.

Tokotangic · 08/28/06, 4:18 PM

Originally Posted by MatsT

I'd just like to add that another reason why it will proc so much for warriors is that it can proc twice for heroic strikes, once for the autoattack and once for the heroic strike part.

I've never heard of this before. Does that mean crusader has a double chance to proc as well?

Kaubel · 08/28/06, 4:34 PM

He'll be able to answer you in three days.

Darke · 08/28/06, 4:46 PM

Originally Posted by MatsT

I'd just like to add that another reason why it will proc so much for warriors is that it can proc twice for heroic strikes, once for the autoattack and once for the heroic strike part.

I thought they fixed that. In fact, I'm 99% sure they did.

MatsT · 08/31/06, 9:45 AM

My bad. I am pretty sure i've seen it happen since after they fixed the "double sword proc on heroic" thingie, but i did ~200 heroics in a duel to test it and not a single double proc. Either they fixed in in some later patch, or it was just lag that made it seem i double procced before.

Sylencer · 09/12/06, 12:07 PM

Want to re-open this Subject if possible as could do with some more discussion because im still not sure on the matter of what to do with my TF

Lets say warrior has very good generic dps gear, fury dual wield.

Hatchet of Sundered Bone < Main hand
Thunderfury < Offhand

Is this going to be a very good combination or should i be aiming for a decent offhand sword to go with TF?

hubar · 09/12/06, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by Sylencer

Want to re-open this Subject if possible as could do with some more discussion because im still not sure on the matter of what to do with my TF

Lets say warrior has very good generic dps gear, fury dual wield.

Hatchet of Sundered Bone < Main hand
Thunderfury < Offhand

Is this going to be a very good combination or should i be aiming for a decent offhand sword to go with TF?

What race is the warrior?

• frmorrison · 09/12/06, 12:45 PM

Well, Deathwish made a nice spreadsheet to answer such questions.
Here is the link, so save you searching for it: http://www.rcsolid.com/deathwing/DPSWarriorv0.483.xls

If you are a human, you want to use swords/mace, otherwise, play with the spreadsheet to see what happens. Of course the spreadsheet will not perfectly model you dps, but it is a better than guessing.

I would guess that TF should still be MH, since you get more procs that way.

Rz · 09/12/06, 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by The Mercenary

I don't think anyone is debating what weapon does the most damage, the debate should be, what weapon combination allows you the most damage.

Uh... correct me if I'm wrong here, but the weapon combo that does the most damage is the weapon combo that allows you the most damage. You just have to limit yourself in combat, instead of limiting your damage ex ante.

Sylencer · 09/12/06, 1:00 PM

Celandro · 09/12/06, 1:26 PM

Originally Posted by Rz

Originally Posted by The Mercenary

I don't think anyone is debating what weapon does the most damage, the debate should be, what weapon combination allows you the most damage.

Uh... correct me if I'm wrong here, but the weapon combo that does the most damage is the weapon combo that allows you the most damage. You just have to limit yourself in combat, instead of limiting your damage ex ante.

The problem is that TF proc has agro on it in excess of the damage dealt. TF proc has bonus agro on it approximately equal to sunder. That means the agro generated from the proc is almost double the agro generated from equal white dps. Its similar to heroic strike in this regard. If you are hitting an agro ceiling with TF, you would be better off switching to a different weapon if the new weapon can still reach your effective dps over time (including down time not dpsing due to agro).

Phantom · 09/12/06, 2:32 PM

Originally Posted by Celandro

The problem is that TF proc has agro on it in excess of the damage dealt. TF proc has bonus agro on it approximately equal to sunder. That means the agro generated from the proc is almost double the agro generated from equal white dps. Its similar to heroic strike in this regard. If you are hitting an agro ceiling with TF, you would be better off switching to a different weapon if the new weapon can still reach your effective dps over time (including down time not dpsing due to agro).

A bit off topic, but a question.

I'm a Paladin, and the Guild Leader of a Raiding guild with AQ20, ZG, and MC on farm, beginning to learn BWL. We haven't had any legendary drops yet. Given the tanking enhancements Paladins are getting in TBC, and my desire to tank as a paladin (go ahead, laugh!), I've kinda wanted this sword. Currently I only off tank in ZG, because of obvious warrior superiority in that department.

Question: Would I be a douchebag in wanting this sword for tanking purposes over the other warriors and Rogues?

My line of reasoning: It's a ton of aggro, mana-free. With the advent of TBC, warriors and rogues will have access to better weapons soon. Also, it is a high cost weapon, which I'm not sure there are other people in the guild who will have the funds for it (I hear whining about repair costs from a couple of our warriors already). I'm on every raid, leading it, as I haven't been able to find anyone with the stomach for leading raids, so I feel I'd be in the best position to able to actually obtain both bindings. The changes to Reckoning would seem to make it pretty nice, too.

Yet, I know the jokes will fly about a paladin guild leader getting TF over warriors and rogues. Are there paladins here with the weapon who can give me some insights? Perhaps convince me not to take it, or give reasons why I have just as much right? How much would I be gimping the raid by taking it over warriors and rogues?

Last note, my guild does love me, as they insisted I take the first Ossirian head off our first ossirian kill, as I haven't been a loot whore, heh.

Tanking gear is mix of soulforge and death bone, ony trinket and force of will, necklace off spider boss in ZG (I can get over 405 defense).