WoW in the NY Times - Page 3

♦ Praetorian · 09/06/06, 1:04 PM

Driving While Intoxicated

Nurru · 09/06/06, 1:08 PM

I've never really understand why people who play the same thing judge other people for playing too much. I'm presently an intern in Silverdale, Washington. The closest city with anything going on (Seattle) is a 15 minute drive and 1 hour ferry ride across the sound. If I didn't raid I would probably go insane for lack of something better to do. If someone is playing 4 hours a night it doesn't imply that if they quit they would suddenly have something better to do. I know if I quit WoW right now I'd probably mill around and play Disgaea 2 more or something.

Oh, and anyone surprised that some people may watch 3+ hours of TV a night is living in a fantasy world. A good number of people have that stupid thing on all the time even if they're not watching it. I suppose they like the background noise.

Kyn · 09/06/06, 1:08 PM

I believe he's referring to Driving While Intoxicated.

(woops, a bit late)

Andorien · 09/06/06, 1:10 PM

The American Time Use Survey from the Bureau of Labor Statistics says that Americans spend, on average, 2.6 hours per day watching TV (or 18.2 hours per week).

:eng101:

Farstrider · 09/06/06, 1:11 PM

Originally Posted by Praetorian

Driving While Intoxicated

Ha. What's that got to do with the price of fish? I guess some highly tenuous argument would suggest I'm less likely to offend if I'm sat in front of my PC drinking rather than down a local bar, but the UK police are so (rightly) tough on "DWI" that there's not much chance of it happening any which way.

Gah - you know what, the sad thing is that one of those WoW log-in tips is absolutely correct:-

Originally Posted by Blizzard

Take all things in moderation, even World of Warcraft

All things in moderation. If you do enough other stuff in the week, 20 hours of WoW probably isn't a big deal. If you work 7-7, 5 days a week the way I do, that wouldn't leave much time for sleep/going out/reading etc.

I'm not some anti-online-community zealot by the way, I've met a load of my guild mates in real life, and I'd say the worst criticism I could possibly make was that they were mostly (all) shorter than I had imagined!!

OzX · 09/06/06, 1:21 PM

Originally Posted by Praetorian

Yeah, there are better things to do with one's time than play WoW every night, but there are certainly worse things too. It's kind of a silly discussion. Everyone engages in unhealthful behaviors of some sort or another, and it's all too easy to criticize when you look at others.

Regarding the TV question, courtesy of a 1998 Neilsen survey:

1) Percentage of US households with at least one television: 98
2) Percentage of US households with at least one VCR: 84
3) Percentage of US households with two TV sets: 34; three or more TV sets: 40
4) Hours per day that TV is on in an average US home: 7 hours, 12 minutes
5) Percentage of Americans that regularly watch television while eating dinner: 66
6) Number of videos rented daily in the US: 6 million
7) Number of public library items checked out daily: 3 million
8) Chance that an American falls asleep with the TV on at least three nights a week: 1 in 4
9) Percentage of Americans who say they watch too much TV: 49

About those TV figures...

1998 is a horrible year for comparison. Aside from being a long-ass time ago...

1.) It's just prior to DVD being adopted like wildfire.
2.) It's about the time "The Internet" really started going mainstream. People were still rocking 28.8 Bocamodems and X2/K56flex were the hot shit.

A whole hell of a lot has changed in the last 8 years...

1.) Digital Cable + Video On-Demand / DVRs
2.) Netflix and it's kin.
3.) P2P
4.) Widespread 1 megabit + speeds to the home

That probably hasn't changed the number of TVs out there by much but I imagine it has changed what content people are watching, when and how they get it. The what and how and when are very relevant.

However, I agree overall.

I'm talking more about the way people speak about treat what they do, not what they actually do. I personally find gamers to have a lot more guilt and insecurity than most. If understanding or acceptance is desired, comparisons that don't make sense and assumptions that aren't true are counterproductive.

Kalman · 09/06/06, 1:25 PM

I would count time spent watching movies via cable/DVR/Netflix as being identical to watching TV.

For the purposes of this, what, when, and how are irrelevant. The relevant questions are: is it passively watching externally produced content on a screen? If yes, how much time is spent doing this?

3 hours watching the Sopranos via Netflix is no different from 3 hours watching the Sopranos on your TiVo is no different from 3 hours watching the Sopranos on your digital cable HBO channel.

edit: And I have no issue with the time I spend playing WoW. If I didn't play WoW, I'd be playing other games. I'd probably ride my bike a little bit more, but then, I probably spend more time interacting with other humans b/c I play WoW. It's all tradeoffs.

♦ Praetorian · 09/06/06, 1:27 PM

Well yes, that's just part of a general social stigma associated with the practice, particularly once you move past high school and college age.

Consider the following quick exchange in an elevator at work:
Q: Hey ___, what's up? Do anything exciting last night?
A1: Nah, not really, just vegged out watching my "Lost" Season 2 DVDs that just came in from Netflix, then went to bed.
A2: Nah, not really, just played World of Warcraft for a few hours with my guild, then went to bed.

Which response is more "normal?" Which, unless you specifically have gamer friends or coworkers, is more likely to come out of your mouth? But is one activity really any more worthwhile or meritorious than the other? It's not a rationalization, as I think both are ultimately fairly empty ways to spend an evening, but when I come home from work that's typically all I have the energy to do anyway. But a lot of it really just boils down to social perceptions moreso than reality.

OzX · 09/06/06, 1:30 PM

Originally Posted by Kalman

Originally Posted by OzX

Originally Posted by Kalman

You don't know anyone who watches 24 hours of TV a week? You're sheltered.

Sheltered from TV watchers? Never heard that one before. If the topic was race, drug use or religion I could see that term being used but, TV? I dunno.

From the economic class (and in some ways, social class) of people who are drawn to that, yes. Sheltered.

That makes sense.

I've often seen outraged people ask how/why a poor woman on public assistance has cable TV or a playstation for her kids. The answer is pretty simple, the TV/games keep the kids inside the house from 4:30 when their homework is done until 7:30 when she gets home from work. While TV shouldn't be raising your children it's often a better alternative than what's outside on the streets.

(I fear the shitfest that could erupt that comment...)

Kalman · 09/06/06, 1:30 PM

Even more interesting is that in some ways, people who don't participate in A1 are stigmatized, even if they don't give A2. Most of my coworkers were Alias fans; it made for interesting conversations for them over the lunch table (I guess, I wouldn't know), but every time they'd ask "So, did you see...", it took them a moment to remember "He doesn't have cable. He doesn't watch TV."

I also find it interesting that reading is considered a much more worthwhile activity than television - is it really more worthwhile to read a trashy romance novel than to watch Citizen Kane? Of course not. Again, social perception.

probiscus · 09/06/06, 1:33 PM

Though, I'd argue most people who admit that they "read regularly", most likely aren't reading trashy romance novels :)

Phorac · 09/06/06, 1:34 PM

I don't think enough people give credit to how WoW is great entertainment for a relatively small amount of money. I already bought a new car, and I'm about to buy a house because most of my entertainment is only costing me $50 a month (internet connection + WoW subscription.) I EASILY spent $250+ a month going out to bars/movies/sporting events etc. prior to this for a month.

Keeping up with exercise has been the only problem (lol)

• frmorrison · 09/06/06, 1:36 PM

The article I linked does show the large social difference on gaming between US and Korea. In the article, there are Koreans of all ages playing WoW together in the room, and it seems it happens often.

In the US, I have rarely heard of such a thing (due to a number of factors, like distance and the social perceptions about gaming).

Crazypie · 09/06/06, 1:41 PM

Being able to raid every night at a PC Cafe with people of all ages and races sounds amazing. Wish I could take part in that trend. :(

OzX · 09/06/06, 1:41 PM

Originally Posted by Kalman

I would count time spent watching movies via cable/DVR/Netflix as being identical to watching TV.

For the purposes of this, what, when, and how are irrelevant. The relevant questions are: is it passively watching externally produced content on a screen? If yes, how much time is spent doing this?

3 hours watching the Sopranos via Netflix is no different from 3 hours watching the Sopranos on your TiVo is no different from 3 hours watching the Sopranos on your digital cable HBO channel.

Way to make the sample fit the argument...

I'd argue that the image most people intend to conjure when they talk about people watching TV for hours a night is not the Sopranos and certainly not something potentially educational, even if only in a pseudo-scientific way. They probably aren't even thinking of first run TV since anyone who watches more than 13 weeks of broadcast TV a year is sure to be watching reruns.

3 hours watching "The Elegant Universe" is different from 3 hours of watching "Learning Maya 6" is different from watching 3 hours of "Friends" reruns for the 12th time.

When TV meant you were watching whatever the broadcast network wanted you to watch at that time or relatively expensive to produce (hence less variety) VHS tapes on relatively expensive VCRs the experince was quite a bit different than what we have available today.