Priest TBC Talents/Spells - Page 9

Ryth · 09/11/06, 7:07 PM

Originally Posted by Igni

Originally Posted by Khalikryst

BTW, anyone else wondering where the Champion stuff is in this info dump?

Yea, I want to know about the Champion stuff as well as how to get a Shadowform that buffs shadow damage by 40%

Maybe they added ranks

Cherrypie · 09/11/06, 7:15 PM

The new spells all look excellent, especially prayer of mending. The talents are all very "meh" though, especially holy. While I'm sure shadow priests are happy and that all trees are raid viable, as someone who rolled a healer I'm not very excited. In pve I'm just going to spend 10 more points in discipline and in pvp I'm just spending 20 more points in discipline.

Here's something I'd absolutely kill for, however:

Lasting faith
Rank 0/2
Requires 25 points in Discipline Talents

Reduces the chance your beneficial spells will be dispelled/purged by 25/50%

Fizil · 09/11/06, 7:48 PM

Originally Posted by Praetorian

Also note that you can get the same +5% raid spell damage effect from Improved Shadow Weaving. But you can't get both that and the Disc talent on the same priest.

As with many other classes, if you want to min/max, you'd seemingly want one shadowmage, one heavy disc priest, and one holy priest filling your 3 priest slots in a 25-man raid.

Ummm, you can get Improved Shadow Weaving and Misery in the same spec, it is a 40/21 Disc/Shadow spec. Not necessarily ideal (I think Vampiric Embrace is to good to give up), but possible.

Rane · 09/11/06, 7:57 PM

Originally Posted by Fizil

Originally Posted by Praetorian

Also note that you can get the same +5% raid spell damage effect from Improved Shadow Weaving. But you can't get both that and the Disc talent on the same priest.

As with many other classes, if you want to min/max, you'd seemingly want one shadowmage, one heavy disc priest, and one holy priest filling your 3 priest slots in a 25-man raid.

Ummm, you can get Improved Shadow Weaving and Misery in the same spec, it is a 40/21 Disc/Shadow spec. Not necessarily ideal (I think Vampiric Embrace is to good to give up), but possible.

I think I have seen that answer three times in this entire thread now. Maybe Gurg should edit his post, because obviously people are unwilling to read the whole thread first :p

Fizil · 09/11/06, 8:00 PM

Originally Posted by Rane

Originally Posted by Fizil

Originally Posted by Praetorian

Also note that you can get the same +5% raid spell damage effect from Improved Shadow Weaving. But you can't get both that and the Disc talent on the same priest.

As with many other classes, if you want to min/max, you'd seemingly want one shadowmage, one heavy disc priest, and one holy priest filling your 3 priest slots in a 25-man raid.

Ummm, you can get Improved Shadow Weaving and Misery in the same spec, it is a 40/21 Disc/Shadow spec. Not necessarily ideal (I think Vampiric Embrace is to good to give up), but possible.

I think I have seen that answer three times in this entire thread now. Maybe Gurg should edit his post, because obviously people are unwilling to read the whole thread first :p

Bah, I read through the first couple pages and assumed "If no one has responded to this yet, I'm pretty safe making the post before reading through 9 pages".

*hangs head in shame*

Norther · 09/11/06, 8:18 PM

Originally Posted by LadyVex

For crying out loud, what's with all the hostilities?

I find it necessary to point out that about 70% of the people saying, stoofoo and wait to see implementation aren't priests themselves.

I passed the talent info out to priests in my guild and it was another "meh" such as I've been seeing on this board.

Playing a priest in pve end-game requires you to spec appropriately for it. We are brought to be the best healers and yet are seeing virtually no upgrades to this area of expertise. I like the fact that survivability is being addressed since that was a major bad point but other than empowered healing and maybe cor the priest talents fall very short of a "must take this talent in a raid situation."

I've known guilds with 1 priest (ONE, uno) who make it fine because they have 9 druids who are all resto spec'd. Things like swiftmend and nature's swiftness are irreplacable in a raid situation, well where's the priest talents that do the same thing?

Considering we're (generally) forced to spec a certain way to raid it's appalling that we're also given some of the more lackluster talents to use with it.

That's all anyone is saying, and frankly, I'm slightly saddened by the amount of people saying QQ more nub when they're another class responding to a priest who has been playing for quite awhile and can obviously attest to just how they see the new talents/spells being useful.

The one point I'll give you is that we aren't sure of the 5 mans or raid content that will be released with TBC, so much like people planning talent builds around 51 points, we are slightly jumping the gun by saying that the spells aren't upgrades because some of these spells could be designed entirely around the new content.

BUT...with that one REDEEMING point aside...

Nothing has popped out at me quite the way things like swiftmend or nature's swiftness type spells have previously. Yes, yes, another class, but some top notch healing abilities, while priests are given...el oh el, lightwell? I can count the number of priests on one hand that I personally know spec lightwell.

As for me, it's going to be empowered healing and cor for this gal, unless I decide mental strength and DS are more my thing.

I completely Agree.

Either
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent-bc=rxT0zhxZZtrrzctooteo (shadow)
or
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent-bc=dxT0zhxzbZfLtcfMVV0h (healbot spec) will be my spec. Undecided if I'm going shadowmage or not.

All I have to Say, Is I spec PVE raid spec to be the best healer I can be...WHAT THE HELL is up with all these DPS talents in the BOTTOM OF A HEALING tree?? Free smite cast? What the..? Give me a duplicate of the shaman identical cast spell in their ele tree, but make it work for my heals. SOMETHING to make people say "wow, nice talent." like they they do for swiftmend / NS. Something so good its almost required to spec into to be a good healer, ala old innervate.

The penultimate holy talent looks like crap IMO. A crappy renew based Prayer of Healing? I'll take Divine spirit kk thx. At least it doesnt break on damage like LAWLWell.

Bibdy · 09/11/06, 8:22 PM

Do you really WANT to have your class forced into 41 points of holy just to be allowed on raids?

That was the blessing and the curse that Druids had with Innervate..

Blizzard seem to be intentionally straying away from 31-41 point talents that (note the very large and important word used here) SIGNIFICANTLY increase your ability to heal, DPS or tank.

Am I the only one whose realises this? Every new ability/talent for every class is just a new toy. More versatility, more buttons, more choices and hence more variety of boss encounters they can create around them.

Ngita · 09/11/06, 8:38 PM

Apologies for linking to a blue

Question on Dispell Magic "This dispel is potent enough to remove Magic effects that are normally undispellable"

Answer It means you can use it to dispel effects like Divine Shield.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...21022576&sid=1

LadyVex · 09/11/06, 8:43 PM

Originally Posted by Bibdy

Do you really WANT to have your class forced into 41 points of holy just to be allowed on raids?

That was the blessing and the curse that Druids had with Innervate..

Blizzard seem to be intentionally straying away from 31-41 point talents that (note the very large and important word used here) SIGNIFICANTLY increase your ability to heal, DPS or tank.

Am I the only one whose realises this? Every new ability/talent for every class is just a new toy. More versatility, more buttons, more choices and hence more variety of boss encounters they can create around them.

The reason druids were so disgruntled is that they weren't allowed to spec anything else because of this.

Priests will STILL be required to spec disc/holy no matter what. As it stands now it doesn't matter if you're a hybrid, 31 pt disc or 31 pt holy. It's all lackluster and continues to be. So do I want a talent that I feel warrants me taking?

You bet you bottom dollar.

• Viator · 09/11/06, 8:45 PM

I'm trying to look at the big picture with all of these stuff. There's alot more synergy between the classes now and I think that's a good thing. Not Guild Wars level synergy but a good first step. I LIKE all the debuffs/damage boosters/IWIN on dazed that's cropping up. It feels sexier to me than yet another +5% to (insert raid mechanism here) talent.

Rane · 09/11/06, 8:47 PM

Originally Posted by Ngita

Apologies for linking to a blue

Question on Dispell Magic "This dispel is potent enough to remove Magic effects that are normally undispellable"

Answer It means you can use it to dispel effects like Divine Shield.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...21022576&sid=1

Sweet jesus now THERE'S something good. It may cost 1k mana, but I'm sure the face on that paladin will be worth it every single fucking time.

edit: the paladin responses in that thread alone made me giggle like a schoolgirl.

henaki · 09/11/06, 8:53 PM

Originally Posted by LadyVex

Originally Posted by Bibdy

Do you really WANT to have your class forced into 41 points of holy just to be allowed on raids?

That was the blessing and the curse that Druids had with Innervate..

Blizzard seem to be intentionally straying away from 31-41 point talents that (note the very large and important word used here) SIGNIFICANTLY increase your ability to heal, DPS or tank.

Am I the only one whose realises this? Every new ability/talent for every class is just a new toy. More versatility, more buttons, more choices and hence more variety of boss encounters they can create around them.

The reason druids were so disgruntled is that they weren't allowed to spec anything else because of this.

Priests will STILL be required to spec disc/holy no matter what. As it stands now it doesn't matter if you're a hybrid, 31 pt disc or 31 pt holy. It's all lackluster and continues to be. So do I want a talent that I feel warrants me taking?

You bet you bottom dollar.

Why are you required to spec this way? Because of an incompetent raid leader?

Bibdy · 09/11/06, 8:54 PM

Originally Posted by Ngita

Apologies for linking to a blue

Question on Dispell Magic "This dispel is potent enough to remove Magic effects that are normally undispellable"

Answer It means you can use it to dispel effects like Divine Shield.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...21022576&sid=1

That'll teach those stupid Paladins BWAHAHHAHA

Renaldo · 09/11/06, 8:57 PM

Originally Posted by Ngita

Apologies for linking to a blue

Question on Dispell Magic "This dispel is potent enough to remove Magic effects that are normally undispellable"

Answer It means you can use it to dispel effects like Divine Shield.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...21022576&sid=1

Worse decision than nerfing windfury.

Copernicus · 09/11/06, 8:58 PM

The basic problems with the Priest talents...

1- Discipline is really top-heavy. The bottom of the tree (the first 20 points) feels like almost 7 points that are close to filler, depending on how much people like stuff like Imp: PW Shield or Mental Agility. The bottom of the tree is pretty much all good talents, especially if the Priest is using Discipline to increase their Smite damage in a raid setting. Assuming daze works on bosses (it seems like there's 200 talents relating to daze) or the priest is working with a class that can daze...

2- Prayer of Renew is ok, but too limited. The requirements to make it good are a lot of AE or self-damaging groups. A 41-point talent should give the priest something exciting and unique. Shaman are getting BEST HOT EVER. Priests are getting another limited group heal.

3- Holy needs some form of mana regen. As it is, every Priest who specs Holy will go into Discipline for Meditation. There needs to be some option that would at least make Holy/Shadow interesting.

Zurai · 09/11/06, 8:59 PM

Originally Posted by Norther

The penultimate holy talent looks like crap IMO. A crappy renew based Prayer of Healing?

I do not think that word means what you think it means.

LadyVex · 09/11/06, 9:00 PM

Originally Posted by henaki

Originally Posted by LadyVex

Originally Posted by Bibdy

Do you really WANT to have your class forced into 41 points of holy just to be allowed on raids?

That was the blessing and the curse that Druids had with Innervate..

Blizzard seem to be intentionally straying away from 31-41 point talents that (note the very large and important word used here) SIGNIFICANTLY increase your ability to heal, DPS or tank.

Am I the only one whose realises this? Every new ability/talent for every class is just a new toy. More versatility, more buttons, more choices and hence more variety of boss encounters they can create around them.

The reason druids were so disgruntled is that they weren't allowed to spec anything else because of this.

Priests will STILL be required to spec disc/holy no matter what. As it stands now it doesn't matter if you're a hybrid, 31 pt disc or 31 pt holy. It's all lackluster and continues to be. So do I want a talent that I feel warrants me taking?

You bet you bottom dollar.

Why are you required to spec this way? Because of an incompetent raid leader?

Because shadow is worthless?

The lower teired abilities all priests get; as a raider there is no priest without things like heal interruption, inner focus, meditation etc...

The higher teired abilities are hit and miss. Take one, take a different one, it doesn't matter. None of them truly add a ton of efficiency so roll the dice and see what you want to play this time around. Wanna be a mage buff bitch? PI. Warlock mana tap? Lightwell. Ditch both of those? Spiritual Guidance or something of the like.

None of them are immensely worthwhile, to the point of anything past talents that reduce mana on instants or gheal it's pretty much blah. They're helpful, but not incredible like some of their pre-reqs are.

So, imo, being required to spec into two trees whose upper teired talents are already lackluster, add a talent (or two) to the trees to make us want to actually spec deep into them, make it so it matters. Anything, at, all.

Any class that gets to the 21 pt talents and then goes uhhhhh should be seriously looked at. And none of the new talents really address any such things. The pvp talents are all fine and dandy, but most priests (and even though I think disc has more survivability already) spec shadow for pvp. But I've yet to see a really awesome truly great pve raid talent, which is something priests have been complaining about for quite some time.

Bibdy · 09/11/06, 9:03 PM

Originally Posted by LadyVex

But I've yet to see a really awesome truly great pve raid talent, which is something priests have been complaining about for quite some time.

Misery and Improved Shadow Weaving look pretty good from the POV of caster DPS...

LadyVex · 09/11/06, 9:06 PM

Originally Posted by Bibdy

Originally Posted by LadyVex

But I've yet to see a really awesome truly great pve raid talent, which is something priests have been complaining about for quite some time.

Misery and Improved Shadow Weaving look pretty good from the POV of caster DPS...

Did you see the point where I mentioned raid spec'd healers?

I don't give a danged about dps. Obviously, there are some encounters like Loatheb that require I actually dps a bit, but I'd rather get some unique abilities for my pve heal perspective than the dps perspective.

RK · 09/11/06, 9:10 PM

Originally Posted by Bibdy

Keep your warlock grouped up at all times ;)

Fixed.

But seriously, the utility of the group renew is going to depend substantially on two aspects of encounter design:

a) Mobility. If groups can't stay close, it's the totem problem all over again.

b) Stamina, spike damage and +heal. This is the bit upon which all the healing theorycrafting is going to depend... between the reduced number of healers per raid, mooted increases to player HP and mooted lowering of downranking efficiency, the way healing works could drastically change. It'll make the difference between Circle of Overhealing because everyone just heals people to full immediately rather than waiting for renew (or even noticing the HoT on the targets) because they can and it's safer and Circle of Whoo because there's less danger of people being spiked out and it's one efficient global cooldown to heal 5 people in a healing scenario where efficiency begins to matter much more than it does now.

35 point Discipline talent (and all Discipline below improved DS) will strongly depend on whether it's intended to boost damage from the raid or just damage from the priest, or just damage from the priest's DoTs. That warlock talent Shadow Embrace seemed very exciting until we were told it only applied to physical damage to the warlock.

LadyVex · 09/11/06, 9:16 PM

Is it true Circle of Renewal is targetable on anyone in the raid group and heals their group?

That would make it pretty hot. Now just to have Holy Reach affect it -.-

Rogar · 09/11/06, 9:24 PM

Originally Posted by heel

Cost of Prayer of Mending just jumped 50%, 637 -> 976 mana.

The mana cost on the EU site and the US site are different for Mass Dispel and Prayer of Mending. Furthermore, Mass Dispel has additional information on the US site compared to the EU site, and Cirle of Renewal is 1.5sec cast time on the EU site (with 700 mana cost and no rank information) but instant cast on the US site with several ranks of mana:effect listed. So it's a bit premature to really dissect these things, at least until the sites are synced up.

RK · 09/11/06, 9:24 PM

Originally Posted by cherrie

Originally Posted by frmorrison

The only thing that is poor is the late Holy tree compared to the other trees.

I suppose this is where a majority of my disappointment lies. I play my priest for PvE only (yeah yeah, I know I'm a carebear) and have been 30+ Holy for a long time, so that's why I'm not too enthused about the new stuff in other trees as other people might be. To each their own, I guess.

That was more or less my feeling about the 30+ stuff in the shaman resto tree. At least we get Earth Shield, but as a once-every-30 seconds spell (possibly longer, depending on how long it takes to use up all the charges) it will make me a better healer without making healing much more interesting. The new priest SPELLS look interesting for adding some more depth to priest healing, and I'm devoutly hoping shaman get one or more new base healing spells as well to add some depth to our healing, but I agree the late Holy tree is rather uninteresting. The message seems to be "come on... you know you want to Smite sometimes...".

Lord BEEF · 09/11/06, 9:31 PM

I'd bet that the 35 point disc talent boosts all spell damage against the target. Blizzard isn't that retarded

• frmorrison · 09/11/06, 9:40 PM

Originally Posted by RK

The message seems to be "come on... you know you want to Smite sometimes...".

Haha, that is a good point. It costs no mana, it just 2 seconds to cast the smite.

When Shaman gets a heal crit, you are get more armor, a Pally get a heal crits gets mana back, and a Priest with the 35 pt Holy talent get any crit, he can get a free smite.

Not the best of those three, but it is fun in its own right.

35 point Discipline talent will strongly depend on whether it's intended to boost damage from the raid oThat warlock talent Shadow Embrace seemed very exciting until we were told it only applied to physical damage to the warlock.

It will boost the whole raid, the difference between the talents is the Disc one is it is 35 points in the tree (which is the utlity tree), and the Lock talent is low (like 20 or 25 in the tree, in a dps tree).