• frmorrison

I know they have been hinted at before, but list from the EU forums, but I translated the post to American English ;):

Here are the Honor changes that will be introduced with The Burning Crusade:

Honor:
Players participating in Battlegrounds and outdoor world pvp gain honor points (by killing players and getting bonus honor from battleground or world objectives).

Players will be able to spend honor points on special honor rewards.

There are lots of honor rewards (armor, jewelry, trinkets, gems, weapons, mounts, etc), that include totally new stuff for level 70, including all the old stuff from battleground reputations and the old honor rewards.

The level 70 honor rewards are not currently planned to have item levels as high as the best raid or arena items.

Arenas:

If you're on an arena team, you gain arena points at the end of each week based on your arena team's rating (higher rating equals more points, lower rating gives you fewer points).

You spend arena points on arena rewards, found at http://forums.elitistjerks.com/viewtopic.php?id=8575

Arena rewards will all require level 70. And it will be seriously phat lewt, which will also most likely be more PvP oriented.

The arena rewards will include 5-piece armor sets and weapons (but not other stuff like gems, mounts, trinkets, jewelry, etc).

After the Expansion, the old Honor system will be completely removed and players who achieved ranks in the old Honor system will be able to choose to display their highest gained Rank as a title. We are interested in reintroducing these titles in the future but we have no specific plans in place yet.

There will be new titles that players can earn through the Arena system and these titles will only last for the duration of each Arena Season.

Arenas are currently planned to be cross-realm just like the Battlegrounds. The Battlegroups should be the same as they are now.

 

Crossbones

I find this dissapointing. Less than half your gear will be raid-quality loot. I thought the point of arenas was to create a skill-based forum where the best PvP'ers do not default to being the best PvE'ers.

On the other hand, they say the honor system will include all the "old stuff" and in plenty of cases the old stuff did come close to, equal, or surpass raid gear. So if they include upgraded version of things like the AV rings or rank 13-14 stuff, you could make a nice PvP suit. That doesn't fit with their statement on honor gear being inferior to arena/raid gear, though.

I'm thinking of making PvP-only alt with a few RL friends and that char probably won't get to raid much and not being able to compete in high brackets due to that would be annoying.

 

henaki

It's seriously disapointing that you can't fully outfit your character with high-end raid quality gear through PvP, just some of it, and the rest is done through grinding.

Gur - Level 64 Undead Warlock on Hellfire

 

• Zyla

Well, arent you also earning honor points with every arena win?

or are the points you get mutually exclusive?

 

• frmorrison

The Arena is a BG, just a special case. You pull double points killing people there, so you can get the a full set of gear from only PvP activities, but it will not be the best for every slot.

 

Fenrus

So far the arena system seems to be going a long way to addressing most of the problems with PvP in it's current implimentation. There's still a ton of unanswered questions of course. One of the big ones I have is will they be able to balance the classes in such a way so that there's no hugely overpowered ideal class combo for all the divisions (2,3, and 5 man). My guess is that it may be virtually impossible to do so and maintain class identity. Giving everybody lots of stamina definately changes certain dynamics though.

I'd really like them to eventually translate the Arena system for the current Battlegrounds, so that you could have set Battleground teams under the same ELO system.

 

psychaotic

I'm not entirely sure about the potential quality in pvp gear from non-arena locations - they said that it won't have the same item level as raid/arena gear, that doesn't mean it couldn't potentially utilize it's itemization points more effectivly (at least as far as pvp is concerned), Don Julio's isn't spectacular because of it's item level (only 65, compare to quick strike at 67), it's spectacular because it spends those points VERY well. Same is even more true for items with unique effects (I'm looking at you item level 58 HoJ, or if you want to go even furthur, iLvl 41 green tidal charm), even some of the new stuff, I think we can safely say that rogues would use the new arena gloves if they were cloth and had NOTHING but the buff to throw.

I think it'd be fair to have general pvp gear generally lower item level than the top raid gear - with a non-retarded pvp system it's going to be overall easier to obtain (you don't need 24 other people/you have greater freedom in chosing time, there isn't a limit imposed by instance flip time, you have control over getting EXACTLY what you want, etc.), it isn't unfair for raid gear to be "better" in a generalist sense (i.e. higher item level) but that doesn't mean pvp gear can't be close/better in a strictly pvp sense, or give other, unique benefits. There's also the possible option of gear with +AP/spellpower vs. players, or more persistant items (like standards) that only provide effect/are usable in BG's.

http://ctprofiles.net/229060

 

Gankin

You better be able to turn arena titles off as well. I've been sick of them from the day I logged on as Scout Gankin.

 

• Enthralled

I too am rather disappointed in the currently known about arena awards. I guess in my mind I was picturing an entire set of items equivalent to the best pve rewards for all slots and all chars with a focus on pvp. Perhaps this feeling is amplified for warriors as our set seems to be a total copy and paste of our current set, only with bigger stats. Wow, how exciting.

The main question I would like to see answered is if these arena points decay over time. If they do not then wouldn’t it be possible to just be a mediocre or even crappy pvper and slowly over time earn enough points to buy the best gear? If the scale of arena points earned for each rank was highly exponential this might in practice be infeasible but if this is not handled correctly then the only incentive for gaining a top rank is some useless text appended to your name.

The addition of special awards that could only be bought if you had achieved a certain ranking would make the entire system feel a lot more like a contest rather than just another grind. In fact I had initially thought that this would be the main thing that separated the “honor point†system from the arena system. I guess I was wrong, both appear to be grinds.

Is there any word on the points being different between the 3 different brackets?

I also think I remember reading something about having some kind of year end contest that took the highest ranked people from each quarter ladder. Does anyone else remember this? Would this just be another way to earn points or would you get access to special rewards?

 

◊ Malan

I don't think you can look at this system as "just another grind". Didn't they release that Arena points get reset every season? The implication there is that if you aren't on a skilled team, and playing and winning against other skilled teams (thereby earning more points since lower ranked teams give small point bonuses) then there is no way that you'll be able to afford the season rewards before the reset. A crappy half assed thrown together team shouldn't be able to just queue over and over and lose to every team and still be able to afford "uber high warlord" gear at the end of a season by this system.

Vyktianity already has over 75 billion followers. The first verse in his book "Gift of the Wild" is "In the beginning Vyk cast lifebloom and then maul."

 

Copernicus

There might be special rewards based on end of season standings. It sounded like they'd be at most a tabard or a special title.

Arena gear is supposed to be constantly upgrading at the same rate as raid gear. I don't know if there will be some form of upgrading gear or changing point values as time goes on. But the basic point is that the good PvPers will get gear equal to the good PvEers... in 6 of the 14 slots. It will be an interesting balancing act between the two.

 

• Enthralled

This might in fact be true, and if someone can dig up a blue post saying this it would be good to know.

If this is true though then why bother with points at all? Just make the rewards only buyable at a given rank after a season is over. Unless you gain points mid season, and the point gains are highly exponent ional, allowing you to buy lower level rewards mid season but still have enough left over at the end to buy the best. Again though the same thing works a lot easier by just letting you buy stuff at your current rank.

Anytime I see "points" I worry that it will result in a grind. I am looking for some kind of proof that my fears are wrong. =)

 

◊ Malan

The points earned can be spent instantly, not just at the end. You'd be saving them for the bigger items most likely though.

Vyktianity already has over 75 billion followers. The first verse in his book "Gift of the Wild" is "In the beginning Vyk cast lifebloom and then maul."

 

Siddown

The interview I read on the Arena's said one of the reasons they used seasons is so they'd be able to introduce new weapons/armor/gear at regular intervauls. Don't be surprised if more get added

Also from the same interview, points won't decay. But the situation you describe is no different than a guild that is not as skilled slowly working through MC/BWL/AQ40 as exists now. Everyone if they will work long enough for it will get their gear, really no different than the Rep rewards today. You can lose at AB every time, eventually you'll get your Mindfang.

 

Brando

Drysc's post did indicate that the Arena Points you earn in a season would only be good for that season. The new Honor Points seem to indicate those will not decay.

I think one thing to keep in mind is that the Arena Rewards so far known are more than likely just for the first season. Is it really any stretch of the imagination to assume that the first season will last longer than what it will take for guilds to start making serious inroads in the new raid content?? Therefore I would almost think that these Arena Rewards are just a bit better than what a newly lvl 70 player will have by doing all the 5-10man instances and further seasons rewards will increase as more raid content gets consumed and more raid gear gets acquired.

 

• probiscus

Didn't EQ have a "best of the best" competition, the winner of which took away a special/unique item?

 

• frmorrison

Drysc said which doesn't mean that you would lose points at the end of each season, but you do get a title that changes at the end of each season. However, I would think points would be handed out such that only the top teams will earn enough points to get the weapon/5 piece set.

The normal honor system's points certainly don't decay, so anyone with enough time can get anything they want.