Forgive me but I can't follow the math on additive attack speed buffs. Does it make sense to spend 25 energy activating Blade Flurry against single targets when Slice and Dice is already active? Does the answer change based on weapon type or gear level?

If you know you're going to be single pulling mobs for the next few minutes, it makes all the sense in the world to blow BF on single mobs. If you can, stack it with AR or Earthstrike or any other on-click trinket. The answer doesn't change based on gear level or weapon type, the speed buff is a speed buff, so it buffs your white damage (which is based on your AP, tooltip DPS of your weapon, +hit and crit).

You don't want to blow BF under a few obvious scenarios (CC'd mobs around, single pull now vs something like a firelord on the next pull).

Nice profile ;)

BF increases your weapon speed in addition to SnD (I'll let the math-heads do the exact values) - keeping in mind the factors that Prob mentioned, you should be punching BF all the time, frankly.

On boss fights with timers you should aim to squeeze as many BFs in as possible as well - you can have 3 BF's on patch no problem.

It's certainly worth the energy cost. Not trivial to mathmatically show, though.

Just don't do it on twin emps ok? :)

We have all our rogues use it on Twin Emps. They just all use it at the same time, and the 1 or 2 bugs that are in the vicinity quickly die off. It's a nice burst of dps, and hasn't caused any problems before.

I use it on the Emps, but a) only when all the bugs are dead, and b) I hover my mouse over the buff ready to click it off if I see bugs, and c) keep my hands on my vanish hotkey in case I pull a bug. Vanish resets it before it aggroes anyone else, if I'm quick, so it's no problem.

Ofcourse it makes sense. Perhaps you misunderstood the very nature of the haste abilities. They're multiplicative, not additive. That means Blade Flurry and Slice and Dice (which is up at ALL times) will net you a pretty 56% increased attackspeed. KotS ups that amount to 87%. At no point will it make sense to save if you're on a boss. It needs to be up when the cooldown allows it to be up :)

So all in all, yeah, 26% extra attackspeed (From SnD to Snd+BF) is definitely worth the 25 energy, even if it's only used on a single target, like a boss.

And pop troll berserking on top of that and you get 117% increased attackspeed!

Sorry about that sarcasm. This forum has so many combat mechanic threads that I couldn't resist commenting on wrong numbers. :)

weaponspeed/(1+haste%) for hasting effects and weaponspeed*(1+slow%) for slowing effects.

1/1.3/1.2/1.2=0.534 - Not even near 87%.

The point stands though that it is well worth using at the energy cost on single targets. I personally tend to try and berserker/BF with a good SnD chain as often as possible given the fight mechanics. Of course it is more useful if you can actually hit multiple targets to effect but the haste alone is a bargain at the cost, even just counting white damage.

Right math, wrong conclusion. You just calculated the final attack speed of a 1.0 speed weapon with a 30% and 2 20% hastes applied. The total haste is 130% * 120% * 120%, or 187.2%. Proof: 1/1.872 = 0.5341.

can't you just turn them all on and mouse over the tooltip?

Correct. This is because haste effects are multiplied together, just like damage effects and threat effects are. When dealing with % based effects in the game, always multiply them together to get the real effect. The only exception I'm aware of is stat bonuses (ie Kings overwrite gnome int bonus) and run speed bonuses (which also overwrite).

Uhm... Did I miss something here? By going with your example Qrmu, how is 0.534 as the new attackspeed NOT 87% faster than what you originally started with? 1 was the unmodified attackspeed - 0.534 was the modified attackspeed. If we had 100% increased attackspeed we'd attack twice every second (0.5).. 0.534 is how fast we'd attack with 87% increased attackspeed.

This thing turns around 100 times every 1 second. We increase the speed by 87%. Now it turns around 187 times every 1 second. That means it only takes 0.534 seconds to reach the original 100 times every second.

Our weapon swings 1 time every 1 second. We increase the speed by 87%. We now swing 1.87 times every 1 second. How much time does it take to swing one time? 0.534 seconds.

My main-hand weapon swings 1 time every 1.8 seconds (Attack Speed = 1.8). We increase the speed by 56% (SnD+BF). We now swing 1.56 times every 1.8 seconds. How much time does it take to do one swing? 1.15 seconds.

If we were to pop KotS aswell the new speed would be 0.96 seconds for one swing. Had it been 100% increased attackspeed it would be 0.90 seconds for one swing. Tell me what doesn't make sense here...

Blade Flurry is worth 0.26*15*actualwhitedps damage, where actualwhitedps ~= (mhdps + [0.5|0.75]*ohdps + AP*[1.5|1.75]/14)*(hitrate +2*critrate + (0.7+.12*skill)*.4). It costs you 25*DPE damage lost from energy cost.

For me, for example, raidbuffed (1500 AP, 33% crit, 15% +hit, 10 +skill, PB/DoVS):

(58.3 + .75*51.7 + 1500/14*1.75)*(.218 + 2*.33 + .4)~= actualwhitedps ~= 363.68 DPS

BF damage added ~= 1418 damage. Backstab DPE required to beat using BF: 56.73 DPE

BS average DPE = (1.5*58.3*1.8 + 225 + 1500/14*1.5*1.7)*1.2*(1+1.24*.63) = 23.35 DPE

Blade Flurry is well worth using.