First of all some background. I'm a MT(1 or main OT) for a guild currently on twin emperors (pratically beaten, had a 2% attempt) and been prot specced all my tanking life. Small variations of 15/5/33.
Now that I have more experience and better gear I though of going for a build that would allow me to keep some core talents on prot tree and invest heavily into fury. My goals are to be a good resource both in terms of dps and also tanking, even if not the best in each. I believe I have the gear for it, here is my profile -> http://ctprofiles.net/3511040. I'm not worried about pvp problems.
I made a build http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/ba...50000300000000, but faced heavy problems with TM. After looking at rage costs, it doesn't seem viable to have less than 2 points in TM. The solution I found was having 3 points only in defiance. I have some questions for people who have experienced similar builds:
1) Will this build allow for a good performance on the roles I mentioned?
2) Is losing 6% threat compensated by greater damage done by increased damage?
3) I have put a talent in improved intercept and piercing howl which im not sure if they are usefull for bosses/trash from twin emperors onwards. Is there a better place to put them?
4) If you answer is no to my first question what would be better as alternative for what i seek? A more classic 31/5/15 build (I have a BRE) or just a full out arms/fury build?
Hmmm..... The truth of the matter is that you can tank with more or less any build you want but you will sacrifice mitigation and aggro generation for the non-tanking skills you carrie. I mt'ed through the first 4 or so Naxx bosses and TE while being 31/5/15 and not carrying imp shield block. I had less damage mitigation than I might, but the fights weren't really that damage intensive as to make my weaknesses unacceptable. I then started to pile on DN gear and decided, "what the hell, let's actually spec prot". I've noticed the increase in aggro/mitigation. I've also noticed how gimp I am when I am not being hammered by a raid boss.
I would say this:
1. TM is mostly a PVP skill. You can tank without it. You can DPS without it. The only time it is nice as DPS is to swap for overpowers. Your build didn't go into arms far enough to get imp-op. Maybe not using overpower is a reasonable sacrifice. Or maybe you swap without TM and land a hit (you are DWing) to be able to OP a stationary raid boss.
2. If you are currently MTing, your guild will most likely want you to continue to do so. I specced protection half because it helped raid and half because I hadn't DPSed in a raid in months.
3. Fury (though I have never been DW fury) seems point intensive. If you were to swap on some more +def, you could drop anticipation and 1 defiance for +5 block and 1 pt imp shield block. Then put +threat on your gloves.
4. I'd recommend, if you're going to do it, do it right. See if you can get your guild to give you a month off from tanking to play around. Then spec for full DPS. Going halfway just makes you mediocre at both. Besides, an 8/8 T2 or equivalent DPS warrior can still tank the TE.
Let me know how it turns out. I want to spec 2hd fury in a month or so as a "vacation". I'd go dw/fury but I won't have decent weapons or enough +hit to really do it well.
Zero points in TM also sucks, but that really is mostly a PVP talent. Not having Imp Overpower, HS, and Impale maybe took 5-6% off my DPS. But since warriors are an overpowered class, I still end up topping the meters. The prot talents have proven invaluable though for Patchwerk and 4h.
I played as a basic variation of 8/31/13 for a while, it's fantastic for holding aggro as long as you have a high enough DPS weapon to support it (also Conqueror's Armor makes this build extremely nice too)
I was fury prot for months with no tact mastery, imp shield block, 5 toughness, last stand, 1 defiance, 5 deflection or 1 deflection 5 defiance.
I recently respeced to protection due to the fights we were having problems with and the lack of other protection tanks in the guild
Benfits to fury/prot:
Great dps when not tanking
More flexible in raid roles, passable in pvp
Faster and better agro dump when fully potted up with high rage gen due to flurry and more heroic strikes. (esp if you sacrifice deflection for defiance)
Benefits to prot:
Stuns are great on Anub and Sartura
Tactical mastery is great for fights where intercept/mocking blow (yes you can get 2 tact mastery with flurry but then you are sacrificing last stand or imp shield block or toughness or defiance)
Higher agro in low rage situations and over time.
Less gear needed (omg i have sooo much gear from being fury spec so long)
I think having some fury/prot tanks in the guild is very useful (imp shield block and toughness is a must though!) since very few fights require the 8 warriors you want on 4 horsemen. Prot tanks with imp taunt and concussion blow are great too. Warriors are the true hybrids in WoW, able to dps or tank to varying degrees depending on spec/gear.
First of all thanks for the very interesting replies :)
@ clockwork, very interesting builds, but for an all around build I dont really think i can go down 2/5 TM, especially after being used to 5/5 for so long. Also not sure if I have the gear to lose deflection yet. But might be interesting to try out with better gear and if naxx doesn't require much of stance dancing.
@Gyshall, I will probably test a build very similar to what you posted, altough i'm a bit afraid of only 2/5 defiance. But with the gear I have, probably its best to have imp shield block than anticipation, so thanks for bringing that up.
Just killed emps and got conqueror helm, so it's the right time to try it. I will probably post again later describing my experience :)
I have had 3 warriors on diffrent servers over the past 2 years i have played all the cookie cutter specs and a few of my own creation over that time but i had never given fury/prot a real chance until my guild reached patchwerk a bit ago. I can honestly say it brings the most utility you can squeeze out of the warrior class possiable.I have arranged the point spending prefectly to fit my playstyle.
And for those that call TM a PvP talent i dont quite understand from being able to switch stances for a intercept to get to a giant claw quicker on c'thun to the basic switching of stances for a mocking blow after a taunt resist on trash a warrior becomes less effective without at the very least 2 points in the talent.
I am currently prot specced to MT in Naxx, but all the way through BWL and AQ40 i was a fury/prot hybrid spec with no points in TM.
There are situations where having TM would be handy, but it is easy to play around these by anticipating what stance you will need to be in and saving bloodrage for after a stance dance. I really didnt miss having TM apart from in PvP, although I dont argue that it is useful in some specific situations.
I realize that TM is by no means needed but by haveing to burn te bloodrage when you change a stance to intercept or mocking blow hurts.Becaue bloodrage has so many important combinations with other skills and not haveing it up when needed feels like a uneeded hassle. Since you are at least putting 5 points into the firt teir of arms anyway(if you are going after the mitigation talents) you arnt loseing anything inportant anywhere esle by dropping 2 more points in the tree.