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Old 10/08/06, 5:19 AM   #16
huzzdi
Von Kaiser
 
Undead Mage
 
Blackhand
It only applies to the direct damage spell because it's only a -100 threat to scorch fireball frostbolt and arcane missle, if you read the set bonus is mentions nothing of ignite. Would be cool if it was -100 threat off each ignite tick, but thats not the case.

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Old 10/08/06, 6:37 AM   #17
Northerner
Great Tiger
 
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Troll Mage
 
Mal'Ganis
I was referring to http://thottbot.com/?sp=21879 the actual effect. It's a little odd, although again trivial considering the range.

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Old 10/08/06, 8:38 AM   #18
Maledict
Bald Bull
 
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Undead Mage
 
Bloodhoof (EU)
Only frostbolt and Scorch get -100 threat from NW 3 piece bonus straight up.

Arcane Missils gets -20 threat on each missile pulse, and Fireball gets -20 threat on the initial hit, and then -20 threat on each tick of the DoT. So it's not very much use for Fireball, as it very rarely gets to tick for every tick of it's DoT in a raid setting.

The NW 3 piece bonus kicks in after any other aggro modifiers according to KTM theory, so makes it a bit more powerful than you would think once all the modifiers kick in.

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Old 10/08/06, 9:59 PM   #19
kelben
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Death Knight
 
Ysera
The dot being the useless fireball dot or the dot being the ignite if it crits?

Haste is the devil...

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Old 10/08/06, 10:46 PM   #20
Nurru
The beatings will stop once morale improves
 
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Nurru
Undead Priest
 
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Originally Posted by kelben
The dot being the useless fireball dot or the dot being the ignite if it crits?
The fireball dot. Not that -20 on each ignite tick would amount to anything either.

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Old 10/09/06, 11:09 PM   #21
Cerralius
Glass Joe
 
Murloc Mage
 
Shattered Hand
With my past uses of Fetish of the Sandreaver, ignite threats have been calculated when the damage is taken. If it wasn't like that I would've pulled aggro so many times in the past, and unless they recently changed it all of my past experiences say that the aggro calculations for ignite are not done upfront upon the first crit.

-Cerralius
60 Mage, Shattered Hand
http://ctprofiles.net/7009

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Old 10/10/06, 2:32 AM   #22
Mandilo
Von Kaiser
 
Murloc Mage
 
Garona
His question was one he and I were discussing in regards to a mage who had the sustained ignite tick on Loatheb, then the spore buff expiring, and the ignite tick continuing for insane damage amounts.

I pretty positive we answered it tonight when I had the ignite tick and then missed the next spore buff, and continued receiving a 4k ignite tick for over a minute and a half or so and didn't get aggro.

http://ctprofiles.net/1391975

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Old 10/10/06, 2:48 AM   #23
Tzeni
Piston Honda
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Bonechewer
Originally Posted by Mandilo
His question was one he and I were discussing in regards to a mage who had the sustained ignite tick on Loatheb, then the spore buff expiring, and the ignite tick continuing for insane damage amounts.

I pretty positive we answered it tonight when I had the ignite tick and then missed the next spore buff, and continued receiving a 4k ignite tick for over a minute and a half or so and didn't get aggro.
That's 180k in ignite ticks alone o.O

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Old 10/10/06, 2:54 AM   #24
DarthB
Glass Joe
 
Murloc Warrior
 
Garona
Originally Posted by Tzeni
That's 180k in ignite ticks alone o.O
Ya, it looks something like this

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/9...mmetersnh8.jpg

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Old 10/10/06, 3:10 AM   #25
zork
Don Flamenco
 
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Dwarf Warrior
 
Aegwynn (EU)
Originally Posted by Vhex
I'm not sure if ignite is coded to work like a DoT or not but as far as I recall DoT damage builds agro by tic, not front loaded agro.

Though I could be horribly wrong and I welcome someone to show me the err of my ways.
Eh...ignite can hold forever but it does not have to.
Threat is generated when it ticks.

*bzzzzzzzzzz*

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Old 10/10/06, 5:11 AM   #26
Mandilo
Von Kaiser
 
Murloc Mage
 
Garona
Originally Posted by zork
Originally Posted by Vhex
I'm not sure if ignite is coded to work like a DoT or not but as far as I recall DoT damage builds agro by tic, not front loaded agro.

Though I could be horribly wrong and I welcome someone to show me the err of my ways.
Eh...ignite can hold forever but it does not have to.
Threat is generated when it ticks.

It depends on the tank, if he has enough rage income.

Depending on rage income the tank should use as available the spells in the following order:
shield slam, revenge, heroic, sunder

sunder threat it down the drain atm and cannot be compared with heroic, shield slam or revenge.
if you got the rage to spam all 4, fine then do it, if not sunder less, heroic more.

if the tank could spam all 4 the mage would need ~1600dps to get aggro. thats impossible atm.

its possible to do 1600dps on thaddius, but thaddius can be taunted, dont know if loatheb can be taunted too.

if you want to know more: click me
The thread wasn't about warrior aggro mechanics, it was about a threat modifier at the beginning of an ignite stack continuing on when the players(mage's) threat modifier changes.... referring directly to the 100% threat reduction given by the spore buff on Loatheb. Ofcourse ignite ticks always generate threat, but if the threat is reduced by 100% it doesn't really matter what the tank is doing as long as he has auto-attack on now does it. I don't really see what your post has to do with the topic.

http://ctprofiles.net/1391975

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Old 10/10/06, 5:17 AM   #27
Tel
Don Flamenco
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Kazzak (EU)
His posts NEVER have anything to do with the topic, im shocked more havent noticed heh.

Having done loatheb last night, I can say with a reasonable degree of confidence that ignites threat DOES change dynamically when people pick up the spore debuff (ie even if you have a ignite running before you get it when you pick up the debuff your threat goes to 0 from any subsequent ticks) as we had mages miss the debuff and pick up a slightly later one while owning the ignite stack still and they wouldve pulled agro straight off the tank if it didnt. Unfortunatly i have no dps/ktm to show you this in action tho, was too excited by the huge difference the darkmoon faire buff is, saved me a shadow pot :P

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Old 10/10/06, 5:28 AM   #28
zork
Don Flamenco
 
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Dwarf Warrior
 
Aegwynn (EU)
sorry guys :(

threat is calculated at the time the damage lands.

cause your damage is multiplied with your threat modifier at that specific time.
as Tel just said: if you have the spore buff there is little to no threat generated.

| Simple is beautiful.
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"I wonder what the non-pathetic people are doing tonight?" - Rajesh Koothrappali (The Big Bang Theory)

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Old 10/10/06, 10:40 AM   #29
snape
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Human Mage
 
Destromath
Let me explain a situation to you:

Loatheb - 5 Fire Mages in Group 1, 1 Fire Mage (new recruit) somewhere in Spore Group 4.

New Recruit crits early, before getting the Spore buff, Group 1 Mages continue the Ignite on with the Spore Buff, New Recruit continues receiving Ignite ticks.

New Recruit receives Spore Buff (and continues to receive Ignite ticks).

New Recruit pulls aggro and dies 20 seconds after getting the Spore Buff.


This happened last week. What happened here?

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Old 10/11/06, 8:12 PM   #30
Mandilo
Von Kaiser
 
Murloc Mage
 
Garona
This would support my thinking on the situation, that the threat modifier attached to ignite is set in stone from the mage's threat reduction when he BEGINS the ignite tick. Your scenario would also coincide with my scenario which was about the opposite, I begain the ignite tick with the spore buff and then missed next spore buff while ignite tick kept going for 1.5 min and I did not pull aggro, even though I was about 200k damage above rest of raid group.

http://ctprofiles.net/1391975

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