http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/...125331051#none

Didn't already see it mentioned so... I for one, am realy excited for this, but there are already forseeable problems down the road, as many pve pallies won't want to spec the nerfed 41 holy. The obvious cookie cutter now will be 20/0/41, minus the prot pvp paladins.

This could actually make a ret dps pally viable, as the old 41 ret sanctified crusader is still in ret. There goes my enhanc shammy plans :)
Hopefully it fixes what we've been asking (and somewhat crying for) since beta.

If there is a better place to post this let me know, as there shouldnt be 9999 tbc threads. <3



Heres how it works(Currently NOT on beta)

It works as MS, instant, not as a warriors heroic strike
40% of weapon damage converted into YELLOW damage, it doesnt seemed to actually be classified as holy damage atm, so I'm skeptical if it recieves any benifit from jotc
Melee crit %, x2 crits

Yes, with crusader strike, 1 ret paladin will be able to keep all 3 of the judgments up by himself, which is quite nice. I'm still confused as to what tree I should go down. I look forward to trying to tank a little, but I just feel that prot is still our weakest tree.

I wonder how Crusader Strike can't be overpowered, when combined with Santificed Crusader being buffed to 3%.

So Ret Paladins get two direct damage attacks, one with +15% crit (Fanatacism + Seal of Command/Blood/Righteousness) and the other that scales with weapon damage AND spell power, and both on shorter than 10 second cooldowns. And Ret Paladins give all DPS classes +3% crit. And they're able to use every single healing class (and every single Dranei...) as a mana battery. And Vengeance is basically the equivalent of Flurry, except Vengeance will scale Crusader Strike and DD Judgments up, whereas Flurry won't scale BT or MS higher.

Can't wait to roll my Blood Elf. :)

They've also made changes to Reckoning and Blessed Life (unless those changes were made when they nerfed Divine Purpose), and perhaps just as importantly as Crusader Strike, they've pushed Sanctified Crusader down to tier 7 and made it 3 points for 3% crit (and Kalgan clarified that it's melee, ranged and spell crit). 3% raid-wide crit doesn't suck, especially when it only requres 33 points in the tree.

FoL bug making flash heals horribly low was also fixed, coding error.

Calm down Chicken Little, the sky isn't falling. A fully decked out ret Paladin will come to a warrior thta is specced 31 fury/30 prot, but that's before execute spam. Very little in this game comes close in damage to DW + Recklessness + Execute spam. Rolling ignites being the only thing I can think of. And if the curse database can be trusted, the highest rank of execute is over 1k.

All this does is give retribution paladins more claim to a raid spot. The ability to refresh 3 judgements and provide 3% crit raid wide is invaluable. They will not be pushing the top tier of the damage meter.

Oh, how are you getting Fanaticism will affect the crit rate of Seal of Command or Crusader Strike? And what's the second direct damage attack...holy shock?

I think Holy is the weakest tree. I've heard from a few friends that the coefficents for the healing spells aren't working properly. But that being said I'm rolling a Ret BE paladin so I'm on cloud 9 atm.

I hear Judgement of Command is a direct damage attack.

That being said, looking around for a new class to reroll, I think Paladin looks pretty attractive now. Except now I have to learn how to heal.

Is crusader strike holy damage, or physical?

If I understand your first question, the answer is zilch. Fanaticism affects judgements only. (Last I checked; talent calculator just went down) SoC and Crusader Strike are not judgements.

Holy Shock is a 31 point talent in another tree, and won't be achievable with the other high end Ret talents. (And again, is not a judgement)

Kalgan said Physical on the WoW pally forums.

That makes it significantly less powerful I guess - both from a damage perspective, and a threat production one. Still quite nice though.

I think he means Judgment of Vengeance/Blood/Command as the second one (Crusader Strike being the first).

+6% healing aura for tanks, +3% raid wide melee and offensive spell crit and reasonable DPS (?! Need to hear some beta reports on how this thing pans out and whether it's sustainable) plus the ability to emergency heal (20/0/41 seems eminently reasonable) means a ret pally can probably hold down a raid spot, but I'm suspecting it's not a spec you'll be crying out to have. Refreshing other judgments is just a convenience, not anything particularly huge unless those other paladins really can't afford to use their global cooldowns on Judgment or get in close (while the ret pally is still able to do so).

Sorry I'm not quite up to date on my paladin mechanics. Does the judgement portion of this just mean that paladins 2 through 5 in your raid don't have to melee? I suppose with x crusader strike paladins you could keep up x judgments on x mobs.

Hahah yeah I was trying to watch the casting animation of my bloodelves but it was very hard to pay attention when this gigantic hammer kept falling from the sky.

Yes on all counts.

Thinking on the new ability between classes, I realized there was no way in heck it'd do Holy damage. Extra unmitigated swing every 6 seconds for 240ish mana? (Potentially worth 1k-ish damage in L70 gear, I'd imagine. Would likely do 2x damage on crit)

I was expecting a talent cd reduction on the judgement timer to make it more spammable but this is going to be hella fun. I've always been 20/0/31 (enough healing talents to get by, repentance for pvp/1v1) and was always planning to go 41 ret in the xpac especially for levelling.

I'm expecting it to get nerfed tbh like unstable affliction.

Kalgan said it's physical

It scales very fast with gear at the moment. 4.24 AP to add 1 damage OR 2.5 spellpower to add 1 damage. My guess is mana cost is going to go up.

To the post below..

Ofcourse, but I'll bet you five hundred bucks that it is.

edit: bleh meant to say something exactly opposite of what I said

I don't think anyone knows whether or not it's normalized yet.

Good leveling plan ;).

I doubt the Ret tree is getting nerfed. The devs want more off-specs and the new improved Ret tree is very powerful (the only problem is it is the best tree now).

The lock affliction tree (in the orginal talent preview) was too powerful (so powerful that only unintelligent players would not get it). The devs want all trees to be powerful in their own right, I feel the Lock and Pally trees have nearly reached this point (However I would like to see the weapon skill talent become more powerful in the Prot tree).

Stormstrike is not normalized, I doubt Crusader strike will get the nerf bat either.

One thing that will impact Ret Pally DPS is probably group makeup. Unless I'm missing something, you want the guy with improved Sanctity Aura in the MT group. Not too bad actually, you probably get windfury and battleshout more often than not.

MT
Offtank War (sometimes)
Ret Pally
Warlock
Shaman?

Hmm, on 2nd look, do you always want imp devotion aura there?