Updated Pally Talents - Crusader strike - Page 5

Ultramax · 10/24/06, 5:42 PM

Originally Posted by Vinsent

Reduce the damage fine, just make sure I can swing it twice in a judgement window so my raid utility of keeping JoL, JoW, and JoC up is fufilled.

With a 10 second cooldown you can still strike twice in a judgement period.

Maledict · 10/24/06, 5:42 PM

Erm, didnt they confirm that the current, massively amped, values for Righteousnes were bugs and they werent changing in value?

Brissa · 10/24/06, 5:44 PM

Originally Posted by Repiv

Originally Posted by Killmour

Maybe it was too much damage?

Probably the main reason is because it was the same cooldown as MS (untalented) and what would be the reason to roll a warrior when you could be a warrior with healing? A 8s cooldown would be more reasonable, however.

They could have solved that by nerfing the damage to say 70% weapon damage and 30% +spell damage.

It was pretty obvious that a plated healing class with such a powerful attack was going to be imbalanced.

Killmour · 10/24/06, 5:46 PM

Originally Posted by Repiv

Originally Posted by Killmour

Maybe it was too much damage?

Probably the main reason is because it was the same cooldown as MS (untalented) and what would be the reason to roll a warrior when you could be a warrior with healing? A 8s cooldown would be more reasonable, however.

Mortal Strike doesnt make a warrior.

Anyway, as I stated in my post you can tone down vengance and the damage of the strike, but please keep the interactivity at least. :/

Cathela · 10/24/06, 5:48 PM

Originally Posted by Maledict

Erm, didnt they confirm that the current, massively amped, values for Righteousnes were bugs and they werent changing in value?

The super-duper-high damage from Righteousness (135% +damage coefficient on JoR if I recall correctly) were a bug. They're down to something like 60-70% on the current beta, which is a needed buff from the current 50% value on live, but it no longer does obscene damage.

• Vinsent · 10/24/06, 5:57 PM

Originally Posted by Ultramax

Originally Posted by Vinsent

Reduce the damage fine, just make sure I can swing it twice in a judgement window so my raid utility of keeping JoL, JoW, and JoC up is fufilled.

With a 10 second cooldown you can still strike twice in a judgement period.

Agreed, possible, but going off lag right now in live I dont know how possible that will be.

Not in beta so I don’t know, but I think Lag would make the two swings difficult.

0 - Sec CS hits, all judgments become 20 seconds.
10 - Sec CS misses/dodged/parried/etc, goes on cool down. (Note also if you are .5 seconds late with this strike you dont get a second chance, so best not be healing or cleansing or whatever might put you on global cool down around this mark.)
20 - Sec Judgments at 0, and CS hits.

This seems like a very very small window to hit again in. I that in the current live game if I try to min max to sneak heals in with my judgments, I often have them fall off and have to reapply. Not a big deal when I’m just responsible for my own judgment. But when needing to keep up the other two for the other two pallys it seems a bit clunkier.

Even 9 seconds would give a window for lag without giving to many more CS's per minute.

Hell make improved judgment not only reduce the judgment timer but the CS timer too.

Reading the spirit of the changes, Blizz says pallys deal too much damage, okay, I’m fine with that, I don’t want to lose the utility along with the damage.

/edit spelling

Fiola · 10/24/06, 6:29 PM

The 1 chance for refresh from CS is probably intentional, so that the Holy/Prot pallies can't get away with avoiding melee. = P
(When it was 6 sec CS/10 sec judgements; it was also one chance only.)

Otherwise, you'd have the Ret paladin replacing all of the other paladins for judgement refreshing. This is probably to avoid the potential of paladins "pigeonholed into healbotting".

Nite_Moogle · 10/24/06, 7:03 PM

8 seconds and a slightly lowered damage value sounds good to me. Without the ability to have at least one hiccup on refreshing the judgements Crusader Strike loses a lot of its appeal.

OT: Firefox 2.0's dictionary thinks judgement should be spelled judgment. Heh.

Igniter · 10/24/06, 8:08 PM

Originally Posted by Fiola

Pally talents updated:

Vengeance effects reduced to 2/4/6/8/10% from 3/6/9/12/15%.

Crusader Strike cooldown increased to 10 seconds; now has new icon!

I'm definitely not surprised about the CS CD increase; I was *very* surprised it was 6 seconds, as paladins could be spamming it as long as they had mana. (Since we don't have the disadvantage of a small "power bar")

EDIT:
And for those curious about huge paladin +dmg coefficients, those were considered a bug and fixed. (Still buffed from what it is on live, but you won't see 1k non-crit Judgements of Righteousness every 8 seconds with Tier 2 gear)

This makes me very sad. But at least it's not as horrid as 41 holy. 5% damage nerf on vengence AND a 4 second length on CS, will make leveling a lot more of a pain, compared to what it was on beta. Guess i'll reconsider my shaman :P This really messes with the idea of one ret crusader strike paladin in raids.

Oh, and don't forget the Fiola, the new tbc pally libram, which increases crit on judgements (it helps, but still doesn't fix the 5% damage loss >_<)