What breaks frost nova and entangle? - Page 2

Lumi · 10/14/06, 11:33 PM

While the sample size is small, it seems to indicate an almost equal chance of breaking at any point. Does this trend continue as you collect more data?

Also to make this data a little more thorough, do you have any hit gear or spell damage equiped?

Cryect · 10/15/06, 1:02 AM

Originally Posted by Lumi

While the sample size is small, it seems to indicate an almost equal chance of breaking at any point. Does this trend continue as you collect more data?

Also to make this data a little more thorough, do you have any hit gear or spell damage equiped?

For the tests I was wearing no hit or +dmg gear. Afraid I don't even have Hit Gear on my druid. One fluctation though was how many towers were taken in EPL but the damage variation was from ticks of 30 to 32 so nothing too bad.

Lord BEEF · 10/15/06, 2:54 AM

Awesome, look forward to the results of damage

chase · 10/15/06, 4:53 AM

Cryect how are you creating the timer and collecting the data?

If it is rather automated, I might just give the rank 1 vs. full rank frost nova debate some hard numbers. From experience I honestly think it makes zero difference. (yikes, looking at ~3 hours of cooldowns for 200 casts of each)

Cryect · 10/15/06, 12:34 PM

The gathering of data is simple enough. I created an addon that times from application to removal of entangling roots, the largest issue is how long this how takes spent around 2 hours on it about before I got bored and went on to something for the meantime. Once I add damage tracking in will upload the addon though its nothing really complex.

PvPing and working on my other main addon drew my attention.

Cryect · 10/15/06, 3:08 PM

Anyways heres the addon I've developed tracking this information should also work with gathering data on Fear, Frost Nova, and Polymorph as well.

http://acm.jhu.edu/~cryect/cctimer.zip

The data gets stored in cctimer.lua in your savedvariables folder for the account you are using it on. Tracks data by Spell used, target name, target's level, duration lasted, then stores each type of damage you did with the time from CC applied to the damage taken with the spell name, damage done, and damage type. Make notice its setup so it only tracks the damage you do and not the damage other players do to help you try to reduce variability (otherwise players in the same area attacking mobs named the same would be counted also). No way to disable the addon ingame by itself so disable it at the addon screen or via one of the ingame addon enabler/disablers.

Resetting data you will have to do manually by /script CCTimerData={}

Cryect · 10/15/06, 3:11 PM

BTW my current hypothesis on how Entangling Roots works is as follow.

Every time damage is dealt a check is done that is potentially influenced by the amount of damage done and type of damage done.

This probability works out for the DOT tick from Entangling Roots to 5% to break every time the DOT ticks.

My proposed plan then for determining on other types is deal damage then record how many of each attack doesn't break and how many do break the roots. Any damage attacks done after 25 seconds will be ignored since begins to get in the questionable area did the damage break it or just running out at 27 seconds.

chase · 10/15/06, 6:56 PM

Did some playing around with the mod, works well and is simple to export data to excel.

Now I just need a good mob to collect sample data from. The optimal mob would be humanoid/beast so I could pretty much nova, sheep, nova, sheep ....
thus killing two birds with one stone.

I'm fairly certain there is a periodic resistance check and that player level vs. mob level is a factor so that would pretty much mean a level 60 mob is needed.

My question: Anyone know of a level 60 mob with no frost resistance?

Barring that any other ideas on collecting data that would be worth the effort?

Exewut · 10/16/06, 5:41 AM

Originally Posted by Cryect

Anyways heres the addon I've developed tracking this information should also work with gathering data on Fear, Frost Nova, and Polymorph as well.

http://acm.jhu.edu/~cryect/cctimer.zip

The data gets stored in cctimer.lua in your savedvariables folder for the account you are using it on. Tracks data by Spell used, target name, target's level, duration lasted, then stores each type of damage you did with the time from CC applied to the damage taken with the spell name, damage done, and damage type. Make notice its setup so it only tracks the damage you do and not the damage other players do to help you try to reduce variability (otherwise players in the same area attacking mobs named the same would be counted also). No way to disable the addon ingame by itself so disable it at the addon screen or via one of the ingame addon enabler/disablers.

Resetting data you will have to do manually by /script CCTimerData={}

Using the addon right now, I have some hit gear (jindo's staff and some random blue's), I'll see if I can find a difference between using the +hit gear and withouth it.
Hypothetical situation:
14:01:00 > mob is affected by roots
14:01:00 > exe launches uber 1k starfire crit
14:01:03 > mob dies
14:01:03 > roots fade from mob

Does this count as a 3 second root breaking from 1K arcane damage? Or does the mod ignores the last 3 seconds?

edit: My avatar isn't running anymore! This is a sad day, a very sad day!

CrazyGamer · 10/16/06, 10:22 AM

In my experience with frost nova, the amount of damage matters. I definitely saw a pattern than my 200% frostbolt crits seemed far more likely to break novas than hits, back when I was frost spec.

As for the type of damage, I consider it a plain fact that fire damage breaks frost effects faster than other types. I cannot say whether frost has a lower chance of breaking though but I'm not aware of that. I think it's rather a product of most mages only comparing frost to fire in this context.

On Maexxna, you will typically have most mages gathered and ready to nova + AoE the spawns down. You should see a very clear pattern that nova tends to break when you blast wave, making it far more effective to use blast wave at the end of the AoE spam instead of right after nova, before using AEs. Blast wave does like 50% more damage of course but I'd estimate that nova is about as likely to break in one blast wave as in 3 AEs.

cyloria · 11/12/09, 7:43 PM

[Reign of the Unliving]

Enova · 11/13/09, 4:20 AM

Originally Posted by Cryect

This was on a Lvl 60 Scourge Champion which I believe has no NR but needs to be confirmed with some wrath testing.

Would the target's level not reduce the chances of breaking early?

tommynt · 11/13/09, 5:55 AM

I thought this topic was pretty clear and even covered in some spell discription.

It s just the amount of damage what matters if and when a nova or entangle breaks early.
There is even a entangle Glyph [Glyph of Entangling Roots] which clearly says that entangling breaks after a specific amount of damage.
From my experience I can say that the amount of damage is around 10k damage, but testing should be quite easy if someone is really interested in a more specific source then "my experience".
I think that also mob or player level is influencing the amount of damage before the root effect breaks.

Lileith · 11/13/09, 7:24 AM

While the topic may remain interesting nowday, that thread was brought back up from 3 years ago by a banned user. Just take that into account when commenting on previous post comments.

Today there are still some side effects due to that "damage threshold" such as shielded target (nova and root won't break on "absorb")

When high damage reduction timer are used (such as Pain Suppression / Shield Wall or Soulink + Nether Protection and high Resilience) it can reduce the icelance damage below that threshold allowing you to spam it for the whole duration of a frost nova.

Kaubel · 11/13/09, 8:17 AM

You people are idiots.