Theres something fishy about "naxx starting guild" that is willing to recruit a crappy geared rogue. Not like there is a shortage if this class. I mean go if you see it being better choice but I personally wouldnt expect too much jump of a quality.

Naxx starting guild = Instructor/Anub = possible with little better then tier 1 if your real good. Say,if your rerolls on a new server and have been there before.

Yeah, I'd say that if you'er not having fun, then is the time to move on.

You say he has the support of some officers but it appears to me that they are the same officers who are slacking in raids. If you have the support of the members who are pulling their own weight, I'd say you are the one calling the shots.

First off, I'd suggest a discussion with the leader and the officers about that. If that doesn't work out to your satisfaction, try letting him handle leading entirely for a week or so to let yourself and others get a proper impression of how he's managing. If you still find it to be an issue after that, you can try a "public" discussion (all guild members but no one outside the guild) about the issue and what kind of long term solution they'd like. It may be that they support him or it may be that they support you but the opinion of both members in general and particularly the core raiders should be an indicating of which way to go. If you have massive support and your leader won't let you handle raid leading without his interruptions, you may have to reform the guild without him as happened to Nightmares Asylum.

I'm with CrazyGamer on this one, with the exception of letting him lead for a week. That might push some people out of the guild before you get the chance to take charge (if it comes to that).

Every story has two sides, but even if what you say is half precice, you shouldn't have to suck it up at all.

Put some feelers out there; if the majority of the guild agrees with you, you can just ask him to leave the guild. If he refuses that, form a new one. After all, you did just fine in his and his friends absence right?

Worst case scenario, you apply to another guild. But don't just up and leave; explain to the rest of them the situation, then make your farewells peacefully.

First you make sure you have the support of your guild members then you place an ultimatum. Dont leave the guild. Obviously its good one if you are up to 4hmans.

"Hey mistar guild leader, after your return we have got the image that you are not really up to the job anymore nor wish to commit yourself fully to it either. Therefore we are asking yout to step down to a normal member. If you dont want to do that we just do quick mass /gquit and establish another guild under 10minuters or so. So its not really a big problem. Hopefully you'll stay but if you dont then be bye"

The first time we downed Nef, the raid leader immediately put AQ40 into our rotation. That was a month after we killed Rag. We now have 4 Nef kills under our belt and have downed Huhu twice. We have the Twin Emps pull and a few teleports down but Emps is honestly the first time in AQ that we've collectively said "okay we have to gear up for this fight". Our MT is only in 5/8 Wrath and is still wearing a blue belt from ZG. Stupid low Wrath/Might drops.

Only 1 of our Priests (me) is in 3/8 Trans - 2 (new recruits) have none at all. It's probably more difficult, but not impossible to start AQ early. I think it's made us better as a guild.

We are starting Naxx tonight. :P

"Previously we've been led by a guild leader / raid leader who although brash and abusive, got the job done"

It's been my personal experience that this does not work well in Naxx. You want 40 people working in unison, but everyone needs to show individual intitative. Yelling makes people follow the line but dampens down any intelligent thought. It's quite likely someone who led successfully through MC/BWL where that was all you needed will be in for a very rude shock upon return.

As for how to handle it. You have two choices, and they depend on who the guild leader and his cronies are:

If you judge them incapable of change, or egotistical bastards (ie.. are they the type of people to move against you as a threat), you need to set them up and take them out. Offer them no help. Do not assist setting things up that they forget. Give them enough rope to hang themselves. Put feelers out, use your friends. Your goal is them either quitting or a break/reform. Go for the throat. The more people you get and the more swiftly it's done the better.

If they are decent, then you work with them. Phrase things as for the good of the guild. Work from there. Help them out.

Personally, anyone who would take off to egypt for an extended period without passing leadership is a complete asshat and should be punched in the face. It's just fucking bullshit. Leaders should lead by example. In the end, there really isn't any other way.

It's entirely possible, my guild went through the same rate of progression. After 2 Rag kills we went into BWL and cleared it all within the week, we then bravely strode into AQ40 and managed to clear to Huhuran who promptly whipped us because of course we had little to no NR. Our progression has definitely outstripped our aquesition of gear, but it makes fights that much more interesting. I'm probably one of the few Priests who could say they healed Huhuran with Dreadmist being their best healing robe. :P

As for leaving your guild, don't feel you're under any obligation to stay. If you have fun with the people you play with then the game shouldn't really feel like a chore, if you find yourself dreading logging in, or worse, simply logging in because you feel obligated to then it's time for a break. WoW is a game, and if you're not playing it for your own enjoyment there's no reason to play at all.

The enjoyment you get from WoW really has everything to do with the people you play with, I couldn't imagine playing it solo or with people I hated, being in a good guild with people you like really does make all the difference, and if you're in such a guild hold on to it for dear life.

We definitely took advantage of the craftable NR for Huhu. After many, many ZG runs we had a good amount of Bloodvine and people were advised to start collecting the mats for it after we downed Nefarian the first time. The guild bank was tapped to help in that also. Most of our guild are re-rolls from an Alliance raiding guild so they knew which Maraudon pieces to pick up. We did flask 2 tanks, 2 priests, and a few mages on both the first and second kill.

Ok, this doesn't directly relate, but I assumed it would be better here than in it's own topic.

When is a guild in a slump, and when are they dying?

I was in one of those shoot thru MC/BWL guilds, taking care of those instances in about 1-2 months. After that, we shot thru Fankriss as well, and waited for people to get NR. We downed huhu one week using zanza pot's and then that was nerfed the next week (lame strat, I know, not the point of question though). A few weeks later, we down huhu normally. During those few weeks, our guild leader/raid leader gets his xbow of smiting, last piece of tier 2, and prestors, pvp's for a few days, and then sells his account. Since then, attendance has been crappy, we wipe on bosses we shouldn't have, and we haven't progressed since the middle of july.

Now that we've finally got people showing up for emps and we had them down to 20% in 12 minutes, the leadership decides that the guild wants to get easy epics from Anub'rekhan and Razuvious. I took over as raid leader month or so after the other one quit, and I told them that I wouldn't do that, it's a waste of time. So now I'm being replaced as raid leader for Naxx.

Is this a really long slump or what?