Druid Tree of Life Party Spreadsheet - Page 2

Daboran · 12/01/06, 4:44 AM

Originally Posted by TheOnly

Of course, many warlocks just don't realize there is a HoT on them -- When I play my druid in a raid, I end up wanting to yell out to some locks I heal -- "TAP! Use the HoT on you! Tap! Tap! Tap!"

Try this....

script SendChatMessage(">>>HoT - Life Tap NOW!<<<<", "WHISPER", "ORCISH", UnitName("target"))

My Warlocks love me....

Boevis · 12/01/06, 4:52 AM

Originally Posted by Northerner

People (myself included) tend to obsess about overhealing but frankly, it only matters if healer mana is a constraint during the encounter. Of course it often is exactly that but looking forwards to a raiding situation where tanks have very large relative HP pools and there is simply no way of sustaining maximal healing throughput, I can very much see HoTs being the staple healing method with big heals used to counter the spikes. Instead of tanks fluxing from full -> near dead and back to full and so on, I suspect we will have to see them spending much more time in that injured but out of one-rounding range. For chipping away in that sort of situation, HoTs are perfect.

Situations like that are generally what I see when doing Strath for orbs and have a tank in T3 and we're doing 3 pulls at once. Warriors tank with avoidance, they WILL go 6 seconds at a time without getting hit regularly, this makes half your HoT wasted. I honestly can't see how people think that casting spells that won't be needed half the time is worthwhile, it makes as much sense as using the old HT4 spam but never canceling. Maybe on a Bearform Tank (reliance on HP + Armor) who does get hit far more often it could be better.

Daboran · 12/01/06, 5:12 AM

It's when you are the single healer on something like DM North and pull a couple of the Warlock packs at a time that you can see how a HoT implementation can really work.
When everyone is taking enough damage to need healing, but not enough time available to single-target heal them one by one, plus your tank is taking too much damage for you to just leave them with HoT for too long - that's when a ToL healing/Swiftmend/Regrowth strategy will work.

My main concern here is that in T2/T3 I'm obviously more than substantially overgeared for this (although granted we are pulling multiple trash groups). It's all going to be dependent on encounter and trash design by Blizzard as to whether ToL will actually be a viable raid spec in comparison to a 17/0/34 or similar build.

Boevis · 12/01/06, 8:30 AM

I don't really see anything that 17 balance does for healing. Certainly there is a little bit of raid utility (imp thorns, Insect Swarm) But you really have to get Moonglow/Lunar Guidance or PI/HoTW to consider making an argument against ToL spec. Remember, just because you have ToL doesn't mean you have to be in that form.

I made a quick spreadsheet for the new talents and the new coeficients, looking at a personal level for my own comparisons (and for later when I update my full spreadsheet). Inputs are Your Level, Spell Ranks, Talent Boxes, +Healing, Int, Spi, and Str. I'm sure I screwed up somewhere :) It's in ods, I really need to get excell.

http://files.filefront.com/Spell_Coe.../fileinfo.html

Daboran · 12/01/06, 8:45 AM

Originally Posted by Boevis

I don't really see anything that 17 balance does for healing. Certainly there is a little bit of raid utility (imp thorns, Insect Swarm) But you really have to get Moonglow/Lunar Guidance or PI/HoTW to consider making an argument against ToL spec. Remember, just because you have ToL doesn't mean you have to be in that form.

I made a quick spreadsheet for the new talents and the new coeficients, looking at a personal level for my own comparisons (and for later when I update my full spreadsheet). Inputs are Your Level, Spell Ranks, Talent Boxes, +Healing, Int, Spi, and Str. I'm sure I screwed up somewhere :) It's in ods, I really need to get excell.

http://files.filefront.com/Spell_Coe.../fileinfo.html

My bad - typo - should be 27/0/34, I'm talking about TBC level 70 raiding.

...and yes you don't have to be in ToL form, but unless you use it often enough is it really worth having in preference to the Moonglow/LG build? It's different for the deeply Feral/Balance skills as they are always useful, but ToL seems at present to be a 41-point "Tranquility skill" - situationally useful only. I know they don't want to make 41-pt skills so good they are compulsory, but ToL is a long way from that imho.

Perhaps if they move Imp Regrowth and make the talents on the way to ToL more desirable it would encourage more tree growth? At present I can't really foresee an explosion of raid orchards in TBC.

Boevis · 12/01/06, 10:28 AM

I'd definately call it a "You'll want 1 per raid" when we hit BC. I don't think it's worth having more than 1 right now though.

Cafe · 12/13/06, 8:32 PM

A Tree of Life change for the worse...

http://thottbot.com/beta?sp=33891

Tree of Life (Shapeshift)
28% of Base Mana
Instant cast
Transforms the Druid into the Tree of Life Form. While in this form you increase healing received by 25% of your total Spirit for all party members within 45 yards, your movement speed is reduced by 20%, and you can only cast Swiftmend, Innervate and healing over time spells, but the mana cost of these spells is reduced by 20%.

The act of shapeshifting frees the caster of Polymorph and Movement Impairing effects.

If the aura stacks, then to make the most out of it you'd see maybe three Tree of Life's and a Shaman in the MT party. Otherwise, this is a big nerf to Tree of Life form. I'd attribute not only stacking HoTs to my guild's recent Maexxna kill, but also the stacking Tree of Life healing aura.

Can anybody find anything positive about this change?

Nite_Moogle · 12/13/06, 9:02 PM

increase healing received

That's the changed part if you had to stare at it for a few minutes to figure it out like I did. Sorta sucks, makes the MT group the obvious place for a tree right along side a warlock and a shaman and one other person :/

Althor · 12/13/06, 9:09 PM

With the other person being a Paladin for an Aura.

• Shalas · 12/13/06, 10:49 PM

Originally Posted by Cafe

A Tree of Life change for the worse...

http://thottbot.com/beta?sp=33891

Tree of Life (Shapeshift)
28% of Base Mana
Instant cast
Transforms the Druid into the Tree of Life Form. While in this form you increase healing received by 25% of your total Spirit for all party members within 45 yards, your movement speed is reduced by 20%, and you can only cast Swiftmend, Innervate and healing over time spells, but the mana cost of these spells is reduced by 20%.

The act of shapeshifting frees the caster of Polymorph and Movement Impairing effects.

If the aura stacks, then to make the most out of it you'd see maybe three Tree of Life's and a Shaman in the MT party. Otherwise, this is a big nerf to Tree of Life form. I'd attribute not only stacking HoTs to my guild's recent Maexxna kill, but also the stacking Tree of Life healing aura.

Can anybody find anything positive about this change?

As long as you have as many trees as tank groups, all healers get the bonus, instead of just some of them. Probably loses the stacking, but I doubbt that was intended anyways.

Zyla · 12/14/06, 2:29 AM

the puzzling thing is that paladins just got a new skill that does exactly what the tree aura does, and its potentially much, much better then this could be.

• Vinsent · 12/14/06, 3:13 PM

Agreed, that seems a really dumb change in light of the fact that the paladin aura is cheeper in terms of talents invested, and is potentially signifigantly better (6% better heals).

Thats a pretty terrible nerf IMHO.

Tank Group is now:
Pally (Improved Scantity Aura)
MT
Tree
Warlock
Shaman

Maybe drop the lock (since the stam doesnt seem it will be all that much) and put in an Imp Leader of the pack druid, who can tank also and will provide some free healing.

Still seems a weird change.