This is just a compiled list of observations I noticed from our guild's first raid night in Naxx after the 2.0 patch. Obviously due to the nature of the patch and speed at which things get updated, some or all of this will ultimately not be relevant - but this thread isn't intended to be one thats around for the ages.

- CTRA lags people whenever someone disconnects, or a raid change is made. This ONLY occurs if your CTRA windows are shown. If you hide the windows, with the mod still running, the lag goes away immediately. This is especially bad during wipe recoveries, zoning, or group changes.

- CTRA can lose synch, closing/reopening the group displays will resync the mod.
- CTRA has basically no MT Target control, and not everyone can see the MT targets. The /tm feature is gone - so you have to manually set each MT target, but you can only set one at a time, and it displays in that order - sometimes rearranging randomly... the first MT target seems to be #3 for some reason. oRA users can set MT targets, but CTRA users cannot see them.
- CTRA updates slowly for some people, grid updates much faster.
- CTRA when you enter combat, locks, so you can not hide the windows after-the-fact to speed it up (another issue but this one is probably a "Feature" of the overall system, detailed later).
- CTRA /raready is completely broken. You have to use the abyssmal default /readycheck which keeps you guessing as people ready up - waiting up to 30 seconds just to see if people are around. And seriously if you're going to fix raready, just fix rarly while you're at it, its way more fun (by fix I mean show the raid leader on the fly who is readying up so we can call the name out before waiting to see the news in the final report).

Conclusion? CTRA is hurting - apparently NONE of these problems exist with oRA (we're likely to change entirely unless CTRA gets fixed shortly, and our mod guy is gone so we can't exactly fix it ourselves). YMMV

- There are clicking noises every group switch and login/logout or raid state change. This is only annoying if you don't tell your raid to not mention it (it blends into the background once no one is bringing it up.

- When you enter combat, your raid is LOCKED. You CANNOT change groups, you cannot change mods, you can't change where your hotkeys are located, etc etc. Basically this means no raidrestore for phase 1 nef, and phase 2 nef groups (or KT, or whatever). One group for the entire thing. This may be circumventable, but I couldn't change anyone all night.

- KTM appears totally broken, sundering the mob lowers your threat.

- Grid plus Clique makes an extremely powerful combo for dispelling - basically 1 click dispelling with a nice display grid. It seems to be the way to go currently, but is a bit discordish in setting up (boy do I miss discord).


About the mobs themselves:
I'm VERY curious to hear what patchwerk hits for, and behaves like for anyone who played him after the "hotfix" went in tonight. I know it was 2.5k mt, 9k on OT's before, but what is it now?

- Razuvious: When you MC razuvious, with the default gui, bongos it CAN not show any of the MC options. Meaning no shield wall shown, or no taunt shown, or nothing at all shown. This apparently occurs on Razorgore as well. I'm not sure if other action bars fail also, but default GUI can fail here!
Also on razuvious, we pulled aggro off the adds a dozen times, completely randomly... battle shout helped a little to rectify the problem.

- Maexxna: This fight is a complete joke... also our damage appears to have skyrocketted on him... we did 14% in under 8 seconds.
- Anub'rhekan: I CAN SEE THIS BASTARD FINALLY! Otherwise not changed. Seemed to take a lot longer than normal.
- Faerlina: MC worked perfectly for someone in our guild who couldn't get the action bars setup on razuvious adds.


Overall we went slow tonight - as did our friends on alliance on the same server... less than half the number of bosses we normally do; I feel a bit drained and annoyed a little by having to reacclimate to things (mostly due to CTRA). Overall things were laggy all night as well (framerate). Also I'm completely underwhelmed by devastate - although I'm not sure how to quantify its aggro contribution since we didn't have KTM to measure that, and weren't really losing aggro much...

I'm curious, how did things go for you all? And in addition, is there anything new or important you can report with 2.0 that might be of interest to other raiders. And my true hope is that this becomes a patchwerk thread.

Most of my feelings about this patch are detailed in another thread.

Anyways, like you, tonight we killed about half of what we normally kill in a single night. We had LD problems for the duration of our raids, and spent most of the night dealing with all of the problems you've desribed in the OP. As far as CTRA is concerned, I noticed all of the problems you've described, plus ressurection monitor seems to be broken too. We will probably look into changing to oRA soon.

We wiped once to Razuvious due to the mind control pet ability buttons being invisible for one of our priests. We had a little trouble with Faerlina and Noth aswell, but that was our own fault. Maexxna is completely trivial now with stackable HoTs, Earth Shield, and the increased debuff limit. A couple of our warlocks are currently affected by the bank slot bug, which made using Sould Shards a real pain.

The UI locking while in combat is extremely frustrating for me. I'm used to showing/hiding my raid frames and swstats at various times while in combat. We also adjust groups mid-combat via raidrestore quite often, and this change makes doing that much more difficult/impossible. This is the most annoying change in the entire patch for me, and I really hope it is a bug of some sort.

Once the dust from this patch settles I expect Naxxramas to be a lot easier than it was pre-patch. Raid dps is going to increase a lot, and a lot of classes get some very nice buffs. Restoration shaman, for example, got some really good improvements with this patch. Right now though, the bugs and UI changes are causing a lot of problems for us. To me this patch is a failure, and I'm wondering why it even went live in this state.

A few people(myself included) had the lag issues with oRA(2 for myself, possibly others), but for most people, switching to oRA mid raid helped them immensely.

We went quite slow compared to normal tonight as well(we have 11 down as of this past week), generally getting 6 to 7 down our first night, hoping this week we'd make it 8. However, due to the lag, crashes and uncountable UI errors people were having, we only managed 4 for the night. Still not bad, all said and done, considering a lot of people had borderline unplayable conditions.

Maexxna is the one thing that really, really stood out, at least to me. We have relatively poor luck, generally taking 2-3 attempts before luck goes our way and our MT doesn't get 3 crushing blows in one spray and die. Tonight, however, he ended every spray above 90%. DPS, as well, was interesting - we burned 26% between sprays, hardly needing Shield Wall. We really wanted to try and see if he could live through it alright without SW, but it was already late, so we opted against that.

We didn't get over to Noth tonight, but Necro Stalkers with 6 poison curers sure was.. well, interesting, to say the least. All in all, it's not as bad as I had feared it was going to be, it's just extremely annoying, struggling slightly on 3+ month farm content that you'll only be doing a handful more times.

There is an updated KTM on cursed that fixed the negative sunder bug. Our MC priests were using Bongos and were having the same problem but, after the first MC for some reason abilities were on the pet bar. Overall it wasn't that bad, Grid with Cliques makes dispells just as easy as before. Server crashes and restarts was worse than everything that came with the patch.

The Prophet Skeram -

No longer keeps raid targets during splits (its not like anyone assists anyway)
Annoying lag/pause after/during a split, I reckoned you could actually see if you were going to get two at once on the 3 sections before they were actually there.

Fankriss the Unyielding - Starts with a pack of bugs in his room spread out around him, we were too pussy to test if they were linked, warriors had a hard time keeping bugs of course.

Stopped there, we were very frustrated with all the issues and problems occurring, like the lack of incompatibility between oRA and CTRA now, apparently CT crew is trying to make it not compatible with the ACE crew in attempt to control the raid ui market, like the make millions off it anyway, was just a rumour spreading anyway.

AND GOD DAM SHAMAN LOOT ;)

Actually i don't think FPS issues has anythig to do with UI. Before patch, i was running around 20-30 FPS in raid, but if i stared into wall or floor it went up to like 70. Now in raid it is about 15, and staring into wall or floor only gives about 20-25. There is definatley something going on with FPS, and it is not mod related.

Yes, we had people shut off all mods at one point tonight and fps is still a good deal lower than previously. We ended up just not raiding again tonight, not sure when we'll pick back up. Not until something is resolved most likely. People that normally get 60-70 fps were getting 20-25. Those with slower computers were fairly well unplayable.

We only hit BWL tonight since hardly anyone could set anything up last night anyway...but I'm glad we did. I know I wasn't the only one that had stuttering issues with all raid mods disabled (Not just CTRA, though that fix of closing windows did work for most), but I know at least one other person was suffering crippling framerate issues late into bossfights as well. What I was experiencing was that starting at around 50% on each boss my framerate would get worse and worse, and finally grind to a halt. I tried different mod setups each time, and even with everything disabled I was having this issue :/ It would be ~40-50 fps pre-fight, then by the time we hit 10% I would hit SnD, and the next frame of animation I got would have SnD at about 16 seconds. It was absolutely unplayable.

Otherwise echo the same feelings: CTRA seems horribly broken mostly due to all kinds of minor inconveniences and only bandaid fixes for them (MT windows are a joke etc), oRA seemed to work for me, as did Grid, though I ended up with both turned off just so that I could attempt to do a smidge of DPS on bosses anyway.

I think it's good that they're patching this stuff now versus when BC launches, but talk about a horribly frustrating night overall. I was incredibly pleased to see that people could figure out how to decurse again without issues but felt badly that those doing it had no fun at all on fights like Chrom, and nuking shaman loot is pretty irritating. I think this patch is going to cause woes for a good week or more at least :/

Elog, I've been having the same suspicions. Will try to make some tests, just hard to get a solid environment. Has to be after shield block fades, and on bosses. Guess I'll log a few bosses tonight and see what comes out of it.

What I think though is shield block still negates crushing blows - when it is up. When it goes down, any hits landing appear not to have a 15% chance for crushing blow. It might not be ppm either, ever tried staying in combat without attacking anything, and your first hit always crit?

Anyway, enough theorycrafting, will try to get some numbers instead.

Things have been awful for us. Everyone was performing subpar. The lag and the clicking just gave people headaches and made them seem disinterested.

This change really got to me:
Our raids run without vent/TS, and I direct healing assignments by group. If a group gets half wiped during a fight, I'll merge groups together on the fly to keep people alive. Our healers are used to it, and it's pretty much how we've been managing healer deaths the whole time we've been raiding. I can't imagine ae heavy fights where priests lean on PoH with that gone.

The other change that's really bugging me is the loss of /rs in ctmod (it's still there, but you don't get the text in middle of screen... only spams raid chat when flagged on). Again, no vent... so I typically use /rs (auto-replicated in raid) to direct the raid during encounters. It works pretty well. I don't like /rw because:
- My name isn't attached to the spam
- It gets mixed up with the announcements from boss mods.

All in all, big negative changes this patch. Those two are the worst for us, and it's going to be quite difficult to adjust. Does anyone know how I can fix /rs to work as it did before, or if any other mods function as ctmod did in respect of that particular channel?

There doesn't seem to be anything fun about this patch, at all. It's all bad from where I'm sitting. We havn't actually killed anything yet this week. Our server keeps getting restarted/going offline. Last night after we finally got going and lost a bunch of time screwing around with the MC bar bugs, they restarted our realm. Tonight the realm was off until 7:30. When we finally got going at 8, we zoned in to find 0 mobs up in Naxx. Realm shutdown 30 minutes later. It's pretty pathetic.

I still ponder why people use CT_RaidAssist, it's outdated and offers poor performance and slow updates