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Old 01/26/07, 6:58 PM   #26
Elendril
KIND OF A BIG DEAL
 
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Night Elf Hunter
 
Ner'zhul
No, I've definitely noticed it before. I've assumed that's how it works but was never sure - though it does amuse me every time a warrior gets MC'd and bitches about losing their recklessness.

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Old 01/26/07, 7:00 PM   #27
Maledict
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Undead Mage
 
Bloodhoof (EU)
Last night on this fight, I ran out of mana just before the mass mind control. When controlled I evocated back to full mana - and then ran over and started wacking the priest with my staff. I have *no* idea what sort of demented logic caused that chain of reactions, but I was pleasantly surprised...

I had one major lag burst about half way through when a mind control ended, but no disconnects from anyone in our group, so it definitely seems fixed.

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Old 01/26/07, 7:00 PM   #28
Whiteknight
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Night Elf Warrior
 
Proudmoore
And yet, in def stance MC *never* uses shield wall. It does however use last stand all the time.

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Old 01/26/07, 7:16 PM   #29
Apate
POWER = MEAT + OPPORTUNITY = BATTLEWORMS
 
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ChickenArise
Night Elf Warlock
 
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Originally Posted by Elendril
No, I've definitely noticed it before. I've assumed that's how it works but was never sure - though it does amuse me every time a warrior gets MC'd and bitches about losing their recklessness.
That shouldn't happen anymore. A few patches back, MC was changed to not use abilities on longer than a 15min CD.

See you, auntie.

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Old 01/26/07, 7:28 PM   #30
Plea
Don Flamenco
 
Undead Mage
 
Twisting Nether (EU)
We dont care though! It always does the same : Deathwish, then fear, then shoot twice, then slam the nearest paladin.

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Old 01/27/07, 7:00 AM   #31
talzar
Piston Honda
 
Human Warrior
 
Blackhand
One thing's for sure, this fight sucks for priests. Our priest gets MC'd and then spams holy nova until he's out of mana after the first MC. Pretty shitty =\

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Old 01/27/07, 7:14 AM   #32
huzzdi
Von Kaiser
 
Undead Mage
 
Blackhand
Originally Posted by talzar
One thing's for sure, this fight sucks for priests. Our priest gets MC'd and then spams holy nova until he's out of mana after the first MC. Pretty shitty =\
Same for mages, normally he will spam blizzard, while others beat on me, interupting the channel, so he starts it all over draining my mana, we have figured out hit seems to be on a 1 min timer in between so sometimes i can ice block right before i goes off and delay the mc quite a bit so as to save most of my mana. Also the last couple times we have had a shadow priest with us, vamp touch ftw, which really helped keep our mana up and kill him pretty fast, typically in 2-3 mcs.

I started running this place about 5 days ago and i dont think in any of my clears has anyone dced during or after the mc, so whatever was causing the problem seems to have been fixed

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Old 01/27/07, 7:20 AM   #33
kelben
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Death Knight
 
Ysera
Last run through the labs, I repeatedly cast various different types of mage armours (ice/mage/fire) and a couple of time I cast evocation too... I'm guessing the armour had something to do with who i targeted or targeted me or maybe related to the type of dmg I took... ice for melee, mage for magical and fire for attacking someone... casting 4-5 armours in a row really eats through your mana quickly.

Haste is the devil...

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Old 01/29/07, 11:32 AM   #34
Emth
Piston Honda
 
Undead Mage
 
The Venture Co (EU)
Originally Posted by Elerion
Entertaining or just hopelessly random and annoying. Have your pick.

I have a feeling that I won't truly enjoy the boss until we outpower it so much that the MC will just be hilarity instead of a potential random wipe.
Funny thing is the MC scales with your gear. I don't like this fight in all honesty, after having 3 people smashing on me and eventually killing me while hammering my ice block button I've decided randomness sucks :P I wonder if you still get MC'd if you are already ice blocked as it's cast. You definately can't use it while already MC'd and Invisibility doesn't avoid it either (and it didn't take me out of combat and allow me to drink much to my annoyance).

http://ctprofiles.net/404078

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Old 01/29/07, 11:58 AM   #35
Vhal
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Murloc Rogue
 
Tichondrius
Originally Posted by Praetorian
You never noticed this before? That's exactly what it does, though it may have gotten a bit less stupid in TBC (maybe?). That's why having Intimidating Shout up is deadly in MC fights -- it's a long cooldown and always one of the first to go. Similarly, MC'd orcs will tend to use Blood Fury (2min cooldown) consistently, shamans favor chain lightning over lightning (it has a cooldown), etc.
Last night in Shadow Labs, we were on the Spellbinders near the end, and I got caught in a MC with AR and BF up (it was late!). So the mob goes green, party goes red, and I think I'm about to explode one of our healers when... the AI decides to turn around and chuck a dart at our hunter. It definitely still likes to blow cooldowns, but it's not the "all cooldowns go first" that it used to be. Also new to me was that you can gain skill points while mind controlled...

As far as Blackheart goes, you can avoid the MC if you Vanish at the right time. Picking that time, though, is the tricky part.

Is there any good way to stop the MC from picking on a healer (beyond just spreading way out)? We were fairly spread but on two runs everyone ran over and killed our shaman. On the runs when we didn't gang up on the shaman, he was easy.

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Old 01/29/07, 12:11 PM   #36
Crowbite
I'm sure I'll think of something clever
 
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Orc Hunter
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Emth
Originally Posted by Elerion
Entertaining or just hopelessly random and annoying. Have your pick.

I have a feeling that I won't truly enjoy the boss until we outpower it so much that the MC will just be hilarity instead of a potential random wipe.
Funny thing is the MC scales with your gear. I don't like this fight in all honesty, after having 3 people smashing on me and eventually killing me while hammering my ice block button I've decided randomness sucks :P I wonder if you still get MC'd if you are already ice blocked as it's cast. You definately can't use it while already MC'd and Invisibility doesn't avoid it either (and it didn't take me out of combat and allow me to drink much to my annoyance).
Our theory is that it is a one minute timer. I'm pretty sure if you ice block right before it, you stay ice block.

Personally, I figure it's a dps race. The 3rd MC is when things really start to go south normally for us. As long as you are full hp before the mc hits, we have yet to kill each other.

Originally Posted by missiletoad View Post
I get enjoyment out of constructing buildings out of my fries and demolishing them with my chicken nugget army as I make monster noises. But you people. You people are FREAKS.

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Old 01/29/07, 12:21 PM   #37
Grumpwagon
Glass Joe
 
Troll Mage
 
Firetree
Originally Posted by Emth
Originally Posted by Elerion
Entertaining or just hopelessly random and annoying. Have your pick.

I have a feeling that I won't truly enjoy the boss until we outpower it so much that the MC will just be hilarity instead of a potential random wipe.
Funny thing is the MC scales with your gear. I don't like this fight in all honesty, after having 3 people smashing on me and eventually killing me while hammering my ice block button I've decided randomness sucks :P I wonder if you still get MC'd if you are already ice blocked as it's cast. You definately can't use it while already MC'd and Invisibility doesn't avoid it either (and it didn't take me out of combat and allow me to drink much to my annoyance).
You definetly can. If you're watching for it, you can get in ice block when he yells. You still get MC'd but the AI doesn't break block. You have to be really fast if you're waiting for the yell, I got in about 75% of the time.

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Old 01/29/07, 12:23 PM   #38
Fres
Piston Honda
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Mal'Ganis
First thing my guy generally does is Howl of Terror, which is great because no one ends up fighting each or using mana.


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Old 01/29/07, 4:19 PM   #39
Bibdy
Great Tiger
 
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Orc Warlock
 
Bonechewer
Any other Warlocks find themselves casting Rain of Fire on...themselves?

Twice now I've been MC'd and standing there shooting at people, with nobody near me when all of a sudden I start casting Rain of Fire on myself...

There's always free cheese in the mouse traps, but the mice there ain't happy.

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Old 01/29/07, 4:29 PM   #40
♦ Praetorian
Mike Tyson
 
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Orc Shaman
 
Mal'Ganis
The other night I had a sweet group that went on a couple of 5-man instance runs. Me, an elemental shaman, two enhancement shamans, and a warrior. Cycling bloodlusts, no CC so we could all drop searing and fire nova with reckless abandon, and the highlight of 4 fire elementals helping destroy a given boss. And anyone can offtank an add while healing themselves if it comes down to it. Honestly was the fastest and easiest Shattered Halls run I've ever done. Then we hit up Shadow Labyrinth, which was similarly smooth.... until Blackheart. Four MC'd shamans is horrible. Everyone chain lightnings each other, burning mana and bringing everyone critically low on health. We wiped, then came back and had to use all sorts of tricks with timed earth elementals and stoneclaw totems right before MC to have things that could "tank" us and otherwise keep us busy during the MC phase.

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Old 01/29/07, 4:59 PM   #41
• Snowy
Not a Super Macho Man
 
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Blood Elf Priest
 
Mal'Ganis
Depending on our group composition, we treat this very much like the spider boss in ZG now. We'll tank him on the left side by the door, while everyone else is on the hill on the right side. The OT (or whoever pulls aggro) will just bring him back across to the MT.

What I aim for on this fight is try to really keep my dots refreshed. I can sneak in a fresh SW:P right as he does his yell, and dots will continue to tick on him while chaos is going on. Keeping people topped off is really essential here -- VE is a great boon in that regard. Before the first MC, which can happen in as soon as 15 seconds or so, we make sure to blow all of our cooldowns and just go balls out on DPS. There's really no worries if you pull aggro at that point anyways, since it's not going to last for long. At full hp, even cloth can take 3-4 hits so if you have a healer who is reasonably alert it's not a big deal. I think it's better to treat as a DPS race since each time there is Chaos, you are going to lose X amount of mana. Why not blow that mana as quickly as you can on DPS instead?

Ironic that this is the hardest boss of the instance though -- but it's still a lot of fun!

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Old 01/29/07, 5:05 PM   #42
Abaxial
Piston Honda
 
Abaxial
Gnome Rogue
 
No WoW Account
Only mob MC that I've experienced so far where CoS doesn't break it. Every other MC seems to make me use CoS right off the bat which ends up breaking it.

It is a fun fight unless you bring one healer and the AI decides to have the rest of the group gang up on them. We ended up bringing the priest to about 5% when they got charged right after and died. This was fortunately when he was at about 10% and we just zerged him the rest of the way.


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Old 01/29/07, 7:59 PM   #43
Kalman
Super Macho Man
 
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<>
Orc Shaman
 
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Originally Posted by Bibdy
Any other Warlocks find themselves casting Rain of Fire on...themselves?

Twice now I've been MC'd and standing there shooting at people, with nobody near me when all of a sudden I start casting Rain of Fire on myself...
Blackheart Mage Priority List:

Priority 1: I have the wrong armor on. Change it. I don't care what kind of armor you started with, it was WRONG.

Priority 2: Dude, your staff skill sucks. Go beat on someone nearby to improve it.

Priority 3: Nobody near you? Obviously you HAVE to drop a Blizzard or Flamestrike on your own head.

Priority 4: I burned through all your mana last time Blizzard/Flamestriking uselessly? Well, you still have enough left for a Fireball or Scorch! Scorch/Fireball random target. Good thing you're a frost mage, right?

Priority 5: You don't even have enough mana to Scorch someone? Must be time to Evocation. At which point, go to priority 3.

(This is intended as a joke, but is remarkably similar to the order in which the AI chooses to do things when I get MCed.)

Melador> Incidentally, these last few pages are why people hate lawyers.
Viator> I really don't want to go all Kalman here.
Bury> Just imagine what the world would be like if you used your powers for good.

Clearly law school has done wonders for me.

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Old 01/29/07, 10:51 PM   #44
 Tecton
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Worgen Druid
 
Argent Dawn (EU)
Well, if the AI actually MCed us intelligently, it'd be an impossible fight, wouldn't it? And it's always good for a laugh.

Although, scarily, while tanking him today, the hunter laid a trap just as I feral charged him, leaving me trapped for the last 10% and scaring the crap out of our mage.

Please contact me via PM/Twitter regarding any issues with Wrathcalcs or Treecalcs rather than whispering me in-game.

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Old 01/30/07, 2:29 PM   #45
Uziel
Piston Honda
 
Night Elf Warrior
 
Burning Blade
Originally Posted by Tempestra
Resto druids in tree-form are easily the best healers for this fight, as the AI won't cast any beneficial spells (all they can cast). So they just sit there and don't run OOM like all the other casters - makes the fight more trivial than it already is.
Do they not change shapes into other shapes? If not, would that then be a bug?

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Old 01/30/07, 5:10 PM   #46
Kalman
Super Macho Man
 
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Orc Shaman
 
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Wiping repeatedly on Blackheart last night (our group was just not enough; undergeared 68 shaman and a prot paladin healing a 69 tank doesn't bode well), I could pretty consistently get the iceblock off when he yelled if it was up. It stays up the normal 10s duration, so it takes you out of the fray for a good 2/3 of the incite.

Melador> Incidentally, these last few pages are why people hate lawyers.
Viator> I really don't want to go all Kalman here.
Bury> Just imagine what the world would be like if you used your powers for good.

Clearly law school has done wonders for me.

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Old 01/30/07, 5:19 PM   #47
Mordinm
Piston Honda
 
Orc Shaman
 
Ner'zhul
Originally Posted by Uziel
Originally Posted by Tempestra
Resto druids in tree-form are easily the best healers for this fight, as the AI won't cast any beneficial spells (all they can cast). So they just sit there and don't run OOM like all the other casters - makes the fight more trivial than it already is.
Do they not change shapes into other shapes? If not, would that then be a bug?
I have yet to change shapes while being MCed in that or any other fight with a MC. I guess it's shapeshifting is on the do not cast list along with the port spells and 30 min cooldowns.

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Old 01/30/07, 5:56 PM   #48
Harem
Great Tiger
 
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Tauren Warrior
 
Mal'Ganis
The worst thing for me was when I figured out you can actually gy zerg this fight. If you die, there is nothing stopping you from running back and joining in.

However.

Make sure you've cleared everything up to that point. We left a pack or two in the first room, and I got MCed just as I zoned in. The AI walked me over, targetted the unpulled pack, and scorched.

Dieing multiple times on the same attempt sucks.

"Puns are inherently evil, in the "must do evil!" sort of way."

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Old 01/30/07, 9:19 PM   #49
Elerion
Great Tiger
 
Worgen Priest
 
Ravencrest (EU)
Originally Posted by Snowy
Before the first MC, which can happen in as soon as 15 seconds or so, we make sure to blow all of our cooldowns and just go balls out on DPS.
We've had the first MC happen within 3 seconds of aggroing him, actually.

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Old 01/31/07, 1:11 AM   #50
Saigone
Von Kaiser
 
Human Priest
 
Hellscream (EU)
The MC fairly accurately mirrors my real game play. I cast mass dispell for no reason at all and smite inappropriate targets. If I was fully raidspecced and it holy novad me entirely oom, then youd be really hard pressed to tell that I had been MCd at all.

Interestingly I heard from a druid mate, who was healing in treeform, that he got banished by a warlock in the group.

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