I'm still teeter tottering on if I should even go after these. Lets compare them to the current best tank legs in-game Timewarden's leggings.

______________Timewarden's______________U/g T5___________Wrynn Dynasty Greaves
Stamina(max gem):93_____________________66_______________________78
Armor(w/Agility):__1019___________________1370_____________________1110
Avoidance:________11D____________________28B______________________25D
Defense:__________18_____________________35_______________________23
Perks:____________N/A_________________27BV&30AP__________________40AP

I listed these in order of my personal stat preference obviously if your preference differs you may not agree. Now the dodge on the lower level legs is obviously superior to the block rating on T5 (block rating in general is crap we block 100% of the time anyway). Defense is meaningless in TBC, you'll always have enough to hit the crit cap and if not, throw on a defense trinket instead of moroes/compass/blocker. The perks, *shrug* I'm not too worried about ap while getting pounded on, block value is lovely for threat, gimpy for mitigation. Which leaves us stamina and armor the two highest priorities for any guild main tank.

So 3 months ago I got timewarden's leggings and was absolutely floored by how uber they were (69 stamina at the time with 3 gem sockets). Wrynn Dynasty's could arguably be better then Timewarden's due to the dodge. Also not quite as much of a stamina hit. Armor is very close slightly better on Wrynn's. Now, look at T5. Immediately what stands out to me is a 270 health drop. For a 350 armor buff. That armor is hot, but to be serious, what the hell is the point of killing fathomlord and making it to the final boss before vashj if getting revered with Keepers of Time in ~1 Durnholde run and ~4 Black Morass runs let you buy something so comparable for 90g.

WHERE IS THE STAMINA????? WHERE ARE THE SOCKETS!?!?!? Do they consider items they've already created when making higher level ones?

What are the other main tank warriors opinions on the leg situation (also carries over to T5 gloves). Quite frankly when Fathomlord's shaman is wailing on me with windfury, surviving one more hit > getting hit for slightly less each time. The more stamina given up the harder that becomes.

With the changes ongoing in the ptr, its very possible that the basis of your post will be nullified by next week. I would suggest a more patient stance till after the ptr upgrades are done.

I hope this isn't too specific of a topic. I've been wondering about the Karazhan legs myself vs Timewarden's. So far, I've passed on them, but when I eventually get them, will I still want to wear my timewarden's for stamina on the hard hitting bosses? Or does that armor make them good enough?

This is the only item I've really been thinking about not socketing with 12 stamina gems. Is it best to keep it as a crazy avoidance item (2x stamina/def gems and 1x dodge). Or maybe make it a threat item for trash (2x +hit gems and 1x dodge).

Of course, both tier 5 leggings and Wrynn Dynasty Greaves could be buffed by next week in the massive itemization changes...

tier 5 is getting buffed significantly (guesstimate ilevel 140 based on current changes), so stop making stupid posts like this until everything has been sorted.

Good point Heisen. Honestly the reason I ask is I'm really honestly curious if there are warriors that Blizzard is pleasing with these items, or if their head is just plain old planted firmly in their anus. How is putting a clefthoof kit on them change the fact of the stats? I *ALREADY* have my timewarden's kitted.

As far as the upcoming item buffage, for all we know Blizzard will continue their same asinine itemization path. I have no faith in them, period, they do not actually play their game. They do not understand what classes really want and need to perform. They also have this stupid belief that we will actually follow gems color code O.o. At this point I'd rather see a priest get the legs. *shrug*

Suesse I once thought like you, then my guild hit Maulgar and Gruul, I replaced over 8 blue gems (color matched) with solid stars of elune *sigh*. We've a tank that goes avoidance over stamina, I take over tanking when he dies. Your relying on luck when you rely on avoidance. The best tank in-game would be a uncrushable feral druid(not possible atm), because of that, I gear like one.

Block value isn't a perk, it is an insanely nice tanking stat. Yes all warriors will use T5 over timewardens/karazhan legs... FFS thats not even a valid question.

Calling Timewardens the best tanking legs in the game just because of the stamina... thats just classic. With that logic you might as well go collect some green items of stamina and call your tanking set the best.

I think the problem here is that you clearly under value armor when higher armor values decrease your damage taken by SO much these days. Anyway as noted above its a silly argument since they are getting buffed again in the next couple of days, just rethink your "best" tank item theory mkay

Oh, and you can never have too much defense... its not like it gets any worse each additional point you get :P

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The armor is more important than the hp difference imo. With what some bosses hit for, small armor gains translate into relatively large mitigation.

This.