Thread of Ultimate Stupidity - Page 1022

Monkepro · 03/28/10, 10:11 PM

Hey can anyone tell me how sub dps compares to combat and mutilate almost all my gear is togc 10 and toc 25 gear with bloodfang hood, and that's my mutilate set with both toc 25 twin spikes, then my combat is maces with the togc heoic grinder and an assortment of toc 10 Arp gear and bladebreaker in off hand I'm rockin about 50% arp then plus mace spec, but I haven't gotten grim toll or mjolnir or that other arp trinket from icc 5s which I'm planning on doing, just started playing again quit in November. Trinkets are currently terrible victorscall... Mark of supremacy, the DTK tooth arp trinket that adds 39% when proc, mark of nonogran, and fotff,

Oh and can someone link me a talent build for this?

Jumai · 03/28/10, 10:31 PM

I wish things like Ick's Thumb were worth considering but basically they're not. You can't wear an item with ZERO ehp. You'll never get your stats proportionate if you do that.

The glyph is a great trinket, actually. The thumb is going to increase your avoidance by less than 1 standard deviation at a massive opportunity cost.
(actually I shouldn't say standard deviation since I really just have personal observation to back this up, but generally on Saurfang or similar, I find my actual % attacks avoided is about +/- 6 compared to my total avoidance chance)

OleFrosty · 03/28/10, 11:56 PM

These are the 2 specs I use, the first is what I believe should be the cookie cutter blood spec. The second is an AOE trash build, useful if you can use your dualspec for another tank spec.

Profiler - Wowhead

The difference between the standard blood build posted at the beginning, and this, is I dropped Dark Conviction. Bloody Vengeance, Subversion, and the 1 pt in Sudden doom, for Imp Rune Tap, Spell Deflection, Mark of BLood, and Bloodworms. This is because with the patch changes I think we can spec for more survival instead of max tps. This is losing some measure of dps, but I think the bonus survival makes up for it, and it's not as extreme as an IT spec.

Options:
Bloodworms are largely useless, I want to test them to see if they soak damage. And extra heals are never COMPLETELY useless.

I have a very high amount of hit at the moment, otherwise I'd drop the Morbidity points into Virulence. Riggins has made a number of excellent points regarding this threads direction, as well as specifics, and I agree with 95% of it. I like morbidity for 3 reasons.
1. Deathwhisper & Dreamwalker.
2. Helps on Trash
3. Makes it possible to maintain full RP (or even build up from 0) for as long as necessary before the pull. Which helps DRW.

Plus it buffs the DC so it's not useless even single target. You could put the points elsewhere for slightly more damage, but I think it's fair to leave this as personal preference.

Also, in case it can help anyone, here is a castsequence Macro I made for on the pull. My main attacks are all keybound of course, but I decided to macro the beginning rotation so I can focus on things like positioning myself and what not, without fumbling for the CD keys that I don't use as much.

Simply keep your RP full before the pull, and then start mashing it as you run in, DRW will go off at 30 yards, and IT will be up right after, if you're worried in the slightest about the pause before the first IT you can always Taunt and or DG during the gcd. This gives a massive threat lead, you can likely have rogues wait 5 seconds and then tricks to dps.

/Startattack
/castsequence reset=combat Dancing Rune Weapon, Icy Touch, Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Blood Tap, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Empower Rune Weapon, Icy Touch, Icy Touch, Icy Touch, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike
/cast !Rune Strike

*Note Since BT and ERW don't use a GCD you can click through that part fast.

After that I launch into the usual rotation of DS & HS, whether its DS heavy or HS heavy is situational. I use the glyph of Disease as well for extra flexibility, and an extra DS.

Airraid · 03/28/10, 11:58 PM

Originally Posted by Vanicae

I'd like to add that you can skip every pack in that room. Wait until the mob patrolling in a circle goes around the right side, and run down the path to the left, in between the mob pack at the left of the entrance and the middle. Run directly in the center of the path and you won't pull either side. Then hug the wall on the left around the other pack, and you are through.

Many thanks for the great tip - I tried it after reading your post and now save a good 10 mins per run!

Shigo · 03/29/10, 12:27 AM

Originally Posted by Binya

Hello everyone,

I manged to gear up my Unholy alt a bit but I am not sure how to deal with the 4Piece Damage-T9 bonus. I think it's really nice but Consider mentioned the bonus is ridiculousness. Some of the DKs i asked also said it is nice and should be kept as long as possible. So I'm questioning myself if i'm missing something. Should I go for 2T10 as fast as possible or did I messed up with the translation of the Unholy Thread? :S

Keep the 4piece t9 until you can get 2t10 at the same time.

ztella · 03/29/10, 12:30 AM

Originally Posted by riggins

Read the fucking thread. Please. Its on the same page as your post for God's sake, just scroll up. There are TONS of situations where you should spam HS instead of DS, and tons that you need to have the death runes available for other options. (ie Vamp Blood, Rune Tap, Army of the Dead, Strangulate, Mark of Blood)

As an overview your raid experience is definitely noticeable due to the statements and logic you are trying to provide in this thread. A bit of advice: Open up your mind a bit and do some research. There is a lot you can learn that I can tell you haven't already.

Thanks and I hope that helps.

I can't stress this enough. This site has been a treasure trove of ideas for the last few years that, of late, has quickly been watered down with people without hardmode experience offering up their "advice." This has happened in the holy paladin threads and its been happening here of late as well. I hope to see this downward trend of content quality reverse its direction.

I read because I don't know everything and I want to get better. Don't post if you think you know because this 110+ page thread probably has covered whatever you think you know and probably shown that you're incorrect. Don't assume anything, read the thread in its entirety before posting.

DPS matters as a tank. IT-IT is a good way to pull initially but there should be zero threat issues past the first few seconds. Icy Touch received an awesome buff but it doesn't significantly change how we play, if anything it is a quality of life buff as we can now lock a target on us quickly with a single spell rather than an entire rotation. Forgetting this would be folly.

riggins · 03/29/10, 1:08 AM

Originally Posted by OleFrosty

These are the 2 specs I use, the first is what I believe should be the cookie cutter blood spec. The second is an AOE trash build, useful if you can use your dualspec for another tank spec.

Profiler - Wowhead

The difference between the standard blood build posted at the beginning, and this, is I dropped Dark Conviction. Bloody Vengeance, Subversion, and the 1 pt in Sudden doom, for Imp Rune Tap, Spell Deflection, Mark of BLood, and Bloodworms. This is because with the patch changes I think we can spec for more survival instead of max tps. This is losing some measure of dps, but I think the bonus survival makes up for it, and it's not as extreme as an IT spec.

Options:
Bloodworms are largely useless, I want to test them to see if they soak damage. And extra heals are never COMPLETELY useless.

I have a very high amount of hit at the moment, otherwise I'd drop the Morbidity points into Virulence. Riggins has made a number of excellent points regarding this threads direction, as well as specifics, and I agree with 95% of it. I like morbidity for 3 reasons.
1. Deathwhisper & Dreamwalker.
2. Helps on Trash
3. Makes it possible to maintain full RP (or even build up from 0) for as long as necessary before the pull. Which helps DRW.

Plus it buffs the DC so it's not useless even single target. You could put the points elsewhere for slightly more damage, but I think it's fair to leave this as personal preference.

Also, in case it can help anyone, here is a castsequence Macro I made for on the pull. My main attacks are all keybound of course, but I decided to macro the beginning rotation so I can focus on things like positioning myself and what not, without fumbling for the CD keys that I don't use as much.

Simply keep your RP full before the pull, and then start mashing it as you run in, DRW will go off at 30 yards, and IT will be up right after, if you're worried in the slightest about the pause before the first IT you can always Taunt and or DG during the gcd. This gives a massive threat lead, you can likely have rogues wait 5 seconds and then tricks to dps.

/Startattack
/castsequence reset=combat Dancing Rune Weapon, Icy Touch, Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Blood Tap, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Empower Rune Weapon, Icy Touch, Icy Touch, Icy Touch, Death Strike, Heart Strike, Heart Strike
/cast !Rune Strike

*Note Since BT and ERW don't use a GCD you can click through that part fast.

After that I launch into the usual rotation of DS & HS, whether its DS heavy or HS heavy is situational. I use the glyph of Disease as well for extra flexibility, and an extra DS.

A couple of things about your post:

I just honestly dont see morbidity being taken in any serious raid build. Even on the fights you mentioned you can get by w/o having DnD talented. As far as the single target benefit you referenced, you are slightly buffing an ability that is ~5% or less of your total dmg/threat over the option of picking up survival talents or better dps/threat talents (IE Subversion/Dark Conviction/Bloody Veng, all of which will yield more results than 3/3 Morbidity). Have you checked parse data of how much your DC actually hits for? Check this out:

WoW Meters Online - Combatlog Replay 3.1% of my dmg
WoW Meters Online - Combatlog Replay 3.7% of my dmg

Its so little amount of your dmg/tps output, I just dont see justifying spending 3 talent points on it.

As far as macro's doing your job for you, I'm fairly certain you will run into issues at some point relying on that. Its better to just do your rotation manually so you can control what is happening. Situations change and you may need to change what you are doing. If you arent used to doing it w/o a macro, you will be shafted.

Glyph of Disesase I am against. I explained in this post:
Suno's Fireside Chat - DK Endgame Tanking

Originally Posted by OleFrosty

you can click through that part fast.

nooooooooooooooooooooooo

Solid117 · 03/29/10, 2:28 AM

Has anyone tried DW?

Marshal · 03/29/10, 3:49 AM

why there is no wepons from LK in 2.3.13? Can i add somehow it?

TonkaEE · 03/29/10, 3:52 AM

was doing heroic saurfang this past week with my enrage spec, and basically I never saw it proc. Our other fury warrior said the same thing. It was never up, and on this fight your almost always taking dmg whether is be from a mark or from boiling blood. Heres 1 attempt where I had mark almost the whole time with no enrage procs.

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Syzwick · 03/29/10, 3:59 AM

Originally Posted by jogi173

I re-gemmed my gear..went with all AP+AP/Hit, resultet in a huge damage increase on static bosses. Got only 425 Arp remaining. Gearscore was like 5800ish and had an increase of about 9% on saurfang(with mangle up!). Went with 3/3 Ruthlessness, 2/2 BS, glyphs: SS, KS, Rupt. Snd Glyph didn work for me because of Snd duration alway lasting to long to refresh and to short to do another finisher Oo. Rotation was sth. like 3+s3+e5r
For me that means it pushes me ahead of mutilate again. Anyone else with same experience?

Well I kept arpen in red sockets, gemmed agility/hit in yellow sockets to pick up most item bonuses. Also went for a SS glyph instead of "recomended" slice and dice...at this point Aldriana's sheet was showing on a 200 second fight 11.9 k. I did 12.2k with ToT boost (initial on tank and 7 on me). Wierd thing is rotation was kinda random, so rupture uptime wasn't too great (81.5%). So I'm kinda thinking I am on the right path... Although need a lot more logs to check to see what is actually "the best" way to do it....

Weather · 03/29/10, 4:12 AM

All theorycrafting suggest that in BiS gear fire is slightly ahead of aracane. However, that is in BiS gear, which I guess includes all hardmode gear. Now, how does fire compare to arcane in 25 man normal BiS gear? Has anyone made a 25 man normal BiS gear list for both fire and arcane that they might want to list for comparison?

Animas · 03/29/10, 4:12 AM

Been wondering how NEEDED is hit and exp cap really is?
The problem is THAT chest refuses to drop (sack of wonders if ya wondering). The ah also doesnt have it and when it does it goes for 15k, not a kind of money I have or am willing to spend. Currently that chest is blocking me from equipting full t10 and badge cloak.
Trying to make the best set posible from loot i have now im at ~5-6% hit and ~4% exp.
So how benefitial is it to be at those two caps?

Another question is how good or may I say must have is the t9 bonus?
Currently I'm keeping it but that also kinda limits me to wait untill I have all the best pieces from t10 content so was wondering if offspec gear (to keep at hit, exp cap) is viable option or should I keep wearing t9 until I get the rest t10 gear.

stuby · 03/29/10, 4:17 AM

well i had no fun tring rawr 3 for my resto shaman, if you try to swith from overall to burst ,substained or any it gives errors,and so had hard time tring to, optimize right, or anything like ttt link http://elitistjerks.com/f47/t24796-shaman_restoration/ . i tried but it needs a lot of work, if i used it like this i would not get in to halcyon guild, on arator relem. cause i tried to when rawr 2 worked like that, and they laughed at me and were rude, but just did not let me in there top guild on that server
but waiting to see rawr 3 working properly thank you very much !

Haakon · 03/29/10, 4:48 AM

To my knowledge, Enrage procs from physical hits, not magic spells or effects - which could explain why you do not see it proc on Saurfang (unless you are hit by bloodbeasts - and you really should not).