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Old 04/29/10, 10:57 AM   #16366
Dragonspear
Von Kaiser
 
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Human Paladin
 
Gorgonnash
Am I reading Landsoul's BiS list right in that Arms does not use any expertise items in their BiS gear setup?

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Old 04/29/10, 11:41 AM   #16367
Lolercaust
Glass Joe
 
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Orc Hunter
 
Zul'Jin
arcaneshot+GCD << Steady +GCD, the arcane may do more damage but they both have the GCD and dropping the arcane which is instant + GCD makes room for an extra steadyshot and better timing on your other moves.

Also you said you are running SV, that isnt MM, in MM you will have additional gains that will push steadyshot to be stronger and better to use.

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Old 04/29/10, 12:43 PM   #16368
xeonight
Glass Joe
 
Human Warlock
 
Malfurion
Originally Posted by clavarnway View Post
Well just to be fair in my understanding unless you re-cast Corruption when you have the Eradication buff it won't help Corruption tick faster.
Because of Everlasting Affliction, every Shadow Bolt, Haunt, or Drain Soul application will update the current Corruption on the target with your current Haste and Spell Power (this includes buffs you currently have), but not Crit or +Damage buffs, those require you to completely re-apply Corruption when you have the buffs. But then those continue to stay with that corruption as long as you continue to refresh it with the aforementioned spells, as has been stated MANY times before in this thread.

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Old 04/29/10, 1:12 PM   #16369
ElJoser
Glass Joe
 
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Human Warlock
 
Cenarion Circle
Originally Posted by Raskull View Post
Raskull's Gear

Also, I do have 4 pieces of T-10, but its all 251 and since I'm hit capped already, the extra hit seems like a waste and my DPS seems to be higher with the 4 264 pieces. Regardless, any suggestions would be MUCH appreciated. I think with my GS I should be doing A LOT better.
Just a few things that jump out at me right away
  • You're way over hit cap: 17.39% with that gear set. Are you not getting any hit buffs in 25-man? Shed some hit
  • You're pretty low on Haste, and have some spirit gear (which is really not optimal). Try to focus on the Haste / Crit pieces
  • You have a Spellpower / Spell Penetration gem on your shoulder item. No reason whatsoever to have Spell Pen in PVE

other than that, can't help you much without a WOL or WWS parse. On fights with adds, are you immolating the adds? Are you tracking cooldowns well and using Conflag / Chaos Bolt every time they're available? Are you life tapping too much? when I go from Demonology to Destro for Heroic Fights, I find I have to consciously avoid life tapping. Demo is hugely mana intensive, but I can go like 3 minutes spamming in Destro and never have to tap

Finally, do go with 4-piece T10, even if they are 251. They're pretty hefty DPS increases, even if you have to downgrade from 264 pieces to 251. Go with every piece but the Legs (stick with Woven Death). Your hit should actually stay the same as you'll add the hit from the Tier Gloves but lose hit from going with Tier Shoulders. The tiered gear is also much better itemized than the pieces you're using.

Hope this helps

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Old 04/29/10, 1:41 PM   #16370
Raskull
 
Undead Warlock
 
Tortheldrin
Originally Posted by ElJoser View Post
Just a few things that jump out at me right away
  • You're way over hit cap: 17.39% with that gear set. Are you not getting any hit buffs in 25-man? Shed some hit
  • You're pretty low on Haste, and have some spirit gear (which is really not optimal). Try to focus on the Haste / Crit pieces
  • You have a Spellpower / Spell Penetration gem on your shoulder item. No reason whatsoever to have Spell Pen in PVE

other than that, can't help you much without a WOL or WWS parse. On fights with adds, are you immolating the adds? Are you tracking cooldowns well and using Conflag / Chaos Bolt every time they're available? Are you life tapping too much? when I go from Demonology to Destro for Heroic Fights, I find I have to consciously avoid life tapping. Demo is hugely mana intensive, but I can go like 3 minutes spamming in Destro and never have to tap

Finally, do go with 4-piece T10, even if they are 251. They're pretty hefty DPS increases, even if you have to downgrade from 264 pieces to 251. Go with every piece but the Legs (stick with Woven Death). Your hit should actually stay the same as you'll add the hit from the Tier Gloves but lose hit from going with Tier Shoulders. The tiered gear is also much better itemized than the pieces you're using.

Hope this helps
Thanks for the response. As far as hit, it’s all built into the gear. Can’t really dump any of it except for maybe the boot enchant, haha. I realize that I have some spirit gear in there. It’s not because I’d rather have that than the haste/crit gear, it’s simply the gear that’s dropped for me.

As far as haste, I’ve read that at some point your haste rating hits a law of diminishing returns (500 seems to be the number most often quoted). You’re saying I’m pretty low on haste, should I swap out my gems that have crit for gems with haste? I know haste > crit, but I thought there was a law of diminishing returns for that stat.

Thanks for pointing out the sp/sp gem. I totally forgot I had that in there. That was an emergency placement because I couldn’t find a sp/spirit gem, haha. You said spirit is not optimal though. I’ve read spirit is good for locks cause of Fel armor. Would you recommend the G of Life tap over G of Immolate?

I will switch it up and use my T-10 gear.

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Old 04/29/10, 1:58 PM   #16371
Elam
Glass Joe
 
Elam's Avatar
 
Tauren Shaman
 
Proudmoore
Originally Posted by Typhoon811 View Post
Hello, I have a question. I usually like to do my own testing before i start raiding in new specs. I've been running SV and have recently gotten up to around 441 ArPen. So, I respeced and reGlyphed for an Arpen build. My confusion is this: The spread sheets say it's time to change over to the ArPen build, however, when reviewing recount against the target dummy, all of my single Arcane Shots do more damage than steady. Even the shot analysis on the spreadsheet says that Arcane is doing more damage that Steady, but the dps value of steady is more. I guess my question is, why should i remove Arcane if each time i fire it I know that it will do more than a single Steady shot?
Your post is a bit confusing. You say that you've been running SV, but you recently switched to an ARP build. I'm assuming that you mean you respecced MM, since you wouldn't be using Arcane Shot if you were SV, but you really should clarify.

At any rate, Arcane Shot is dropped at higher ArP levels because Steady Shot+the Piercing Shots debuff does more damage than a single Arcane Shot. If ArS crits for (arbitrarily assigned numbers inc) 5k, and Steady Shot crits for 4500 and then Piercing Shots does another ~1500 damage, the Steady Shot ends up being 6k damage per button press vs. 5k.

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Old 04/29/10, 2:09 PM   #16372
Tinava
Piston Honda
 
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Human Warlock
 
Scarlet Crusade
Originally Posted by Raskull View Post
Thanks for the response. As far as hit, it’s all built into the gear. Can’t really dump any of it except for maybe the boot enchant, haha. I realize that I have some spirit gear in there. It’s not because I’d rather have that than the haste/crit gear, it’s simply the gear that’s dropped for me.

As far as haste, I’ve read that at some point your haste rating hits a law of diminishing returns (500 seems to be the number most often quoted). You’re saying I’m pretty low on haste, should I swap out my gems that have crit for gems with haste? I know haste > crit, but I thought there was a law of diminishing returns for that stat.

Thanks for pointing out the sp/sp gem. I totally forgot I had that in there. That was an emergency placement because I couldn’t find a sp/spirit gem, haha. You said spirit is not optimal though. I’ve read spirit is good for locks cause of Fel armor. Would you recommend the G of Life tap over G of Immolate?

I will switch it up and use my T-10 gear.
The haste hole is far higher than 500; more like 1342 I think is the cap.

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Old 04/29/10, 2:13 PM   #16373
Drty
Glass Joe
 
Troll Hunter
 
Velen
In addition to Elam's post about Piercing Shots, SS can proc ISS giving CS a 15% damage boost.

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Old 04/29/10, 2:18 PM   #16374
TheBacon
Soda Popinski
 
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Human Paladin
 
Kel'Thuzad
Unless you had a warrior and druid buddy applying sunder/mangle to your dummy you were also missing out on some very key buffs that make SS hit harder then ArS.

Originally Posted by Florrie View Post
Soon this forum will be a forgotten place, shrouded in cobwebs and lost in time until one day a ship comes. A chamber will be found with jars of strange black goo and Boe will be woken up from stasis and respond by trying to kill everyone. It will basically end with Carebear flying off with Vontre's head.

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Old 04/29/10, 2:20 PM   #16375
Varze
Glass Joe
 
Orc Warrior
 
Proudmoore
My DPS seems low.

First:could someone explain at what time you use pestilence to refresh diseases? Can anyone estimate the dps gain from using glyph of disease compared to glyph of icy touch.

Second: I follow the rotation as accurately as I can, and something seems off.
Does this seem right for my gear?
Saurfang: 11103.9
25 man, missing a few buffs, no unholy dk's, I am the only one that provides the haste buff.
Marrogar: 9303.4
My DPS seems to go significantly down on movement fights

Any oddities you might recommend?
Going to start using potions of speed when boss is below 75%
Going to start using armies
Do you pop ghouls between your rotation, replacing Horn of Winter for more damage

I know these things seem minor, but I really want to be the best I can be for my guild

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Old 04/29/10, 3:28 PM   #16376
Vaugh
 
Dwarf Death Knight
 
Hyjal
I believe it is expressed earlier in the thread as to the amount of DPS increase from GoD, but those numbers seem very high for your gear from my perspective. Your expertise is through the roof, you should really look into dropping some of that. Movement fights is all just a part of your playstyle, in my not-so-great gear, I can do around 11000 on Lord Marrowgar. You should really work on getting your 4pc T10 ASAP, cause I am MS tank and just got my 4pc for dps, and as expected, it was a very large dps increase. Also, I try to use my BT-UBA then immediately pop my Potion of Speed after that, and normally try to save it for under 35% so that Merciless Combat gives a tiny little push aswell.

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Old 04/29/10, 3:35 PM   #16377
Trivial
Glass Joe
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Defias Brotherhood (EU)
Allright, I wasn't aware the ranking was off for some other class.

And yes, as I said, simming my stats into ZAP was showing same as you said, was just wondering why was there a difference, which one of the sims was wrong.

Clearly, ZAP's isn't!

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Old 04/29/10, 3:53 PM   #16378
Kilee
Glass Joe
 
Human Priest
 
Earthen Ring
difference between simcraft and spreadsheet

I've done a search for threads about Simcraft, and I can't really find a good answer to this question...

When I plug my hunter into Simcraft, I get a different resulting set of DPS and stat weights than when I run the same hunter through the spreadsheet. Now, for the most part the stats line up and the DPS is equivalent enough that it's not a big difference.

But a good example is some of the middle to lower stats like Haste are generally represented as higher in Simcraft and lower on the spreadsheet. I've read the arguments that things like Rapid Fire and Improved Aspect of the Hawk modify Haste and make it less important that it might seem, but I generally have trusted Simcraft in the past to catch things like this and still give me a an accurate value of stats. I don't understand why it would be so different unless one is wrong. And if Simcraft is wrong, why doesn't someone fix it, since the point of that program is "simulation craft", you'd think the people who maintain it would try their darndest to keep it somewhat accurate.

I mainly ask this because small differences in the weight of gear stats would ultimately affect my gear choices or my gemming. Maybe not enough to make a huge difference, but enough that I don't think you should overlook it either.

Edit: I've also noticed the same inconsistences in Rawr, but I generally don't trust that program, because it keeps telling me to regem all my gems to haste gems...

Last edited by Kilee : 04/29/10 at 4:09 PM.

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Old 04/29/10, 4:46 PM   #16379
blak422
Banned
 
Troll Shaman
 
<xLR>
Sargeras
good info thanks

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Old 04/29/10, 4:48 PM   #16380
blak422
Banned
 
Troll Shaman
 
<xLR>
Sargeras
good info ty

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