Thread of Ultimate Stupidity - Page 1445

burygnome · 12/22/10, 8:09 AM

Blizzard cost 11k, flamestrike 5k. Having 90k mana pool... Well, it hurts, hurts a lot. Also, I think blizzard overtuned a bit the mana cost of our main spells comparing them to base stats from wotlk. In wotlk they were fine since our base mana was low. But since the base stats going up in cata this is a little overkill for us. We can use chain mana potion,gem,evo. We used that in wotlk aswell (except the mana pot :P). I don't think it should be like that. Locks are doing way better dmg/dps while having no mana problems at all. Hunters became imba dpsers now with their new scaling. Shadowpriests even. On most fights you need to move and as we know, moving for mage was never good for his dps. I was doing pre 4.0.1 high damage in fire on lk 25 hc aswell as on halion 25hc. I had to use cds with gems/evo. But everything was fine with our dps. It's sad that in Fire our "proc" is a lot, lot lower than in arcane.

I am sad to be honest now for the very first time playing a fire mage..

Lets not take an offtopic here. There is a lot of things blizzard need to see with fire mage. Our main problem is mana issue. Yes, we can do scorch waving but then answer yourself. Is that really the way we should dps? We will never maintain good dps while scorching and then back to standard rotation. I don't belive that im bad with mage myself. I am always open to new things in game and my class. But when new things make me be a little more above the tank and as the last on the table that is wrong. I know, someone has to be last. I only don't understand why locks are always at the top. Every damn expansion they always there. In crap-raw gear or bis. With mages it takes skill to do dps in raw gear for example. The funny thing is both simcraft and rawr are taking my stats away from crit for the haste. Crit becomes only good with full 359 gear. While haste is a lot better than mastery/crit in pre-t11 gear. At least for my char and his gear.

Dracnia · 12/22/10, 8:11 AM

So i've checked this guide, and i must say its really nice.

Though i got some questions about haste caps. Be warned i just recently starting theory crafting.

You point out that 1% haste = 128.05 haste rating

Your calculations show that you need 579 (581 ingame according to blizz calcs) rating to get the 30% haste buff. (assuming ofc that you got Improved SF, Haste Aura and Dark Intent up.

But 579 haste rating /128.05 = 4.52%

15+5+3+4.52= 27.52%

Where do you got the other 2.48% from?

Minus all the buffs you should have 7% haste unbuffed if i'm correct and thats 896 haste rating

Mcpepsi · 12/22/10, 8:25 AM

When I play perfectly i can maybe push 7th or 6th on the dps meters but if the stars dont align then i often find myself in 10th 11th.

But when it comes to the actual encounter I dont feel mages are really that week.
Mages have huge AOE potential with combustion and impact, althought not fun and usually annoying the ability is still there.
One thing that would definatly help is to allow impact a 20 second duration or to allow fireblast to proc HS 100% of the time when impact is active and you cast fireblast.

And in terms of mobile damage fire is right up there, no complaints at all.

The only downside to fire is the actual numbers, which they could tweek quite easily by changing the fire spec bonus from 25% fire damage to 30% or 35%.

burygnome · 12/22/10, 8:36 AM

Also, as a notice. I think that combustion would be usefull with lower CD, like 1min? Otherwise it's just a skill that will be used once or twice on encounters with aoe and same with single dps and will not give then the potential of this ability.

Jmickey · 12/22/10, 8:38 AM

Originally Posted by Dracnia

But 579 haste rating /128.05 = 4.52%

15+5+3+4.52= 27.52%

Where do you got the other 2.48% from?

Minus all the buffs you should have 7% haste unbuffed if i'm correct and thats 896 haste rating

Haste is not additive, so it is not 1 + 2 + 3 = 6. Haste acts multiplicatively. So it would be 1.1 * 1.2 * 1.3 = 1.716.

Anubisblack · 12/22/10, 9:31 AM

Apologies for the tone of this comment, but I do not come here on these boards to read some random QQ from people who suck at playing their class. There are the MMO/Official boards for this kind of baseless whine. The latest comments do not contribute towards the compendium and are exactly the type of posts I do not expect to read when coming to this site.

Yes, there are a few concerns about the current state of Fire and they are all mentioned either in the OP or in some of the following comments. The thread has been derailed to a discussion which is not in any way beneficial and I would like to request some heavy moderation.

Having played my Mage for 5 years now, I do not see how the "low" we are currently in is any different than some "lows" we had in TBC or even Vanilla. Blizzard always attempts to balance classes out when a situation like this occurs. And even so, a good player playing a class that outputs less dps than another class can outdps a less skilled player of the latter class.

The biggest issue currently is the gap between Warlocks & Hunters (W & H) and the rest of the dps classes. Those two classes simply pull ahead too much. The gap between Mages and the rest of the dps classes is basically non- existant. So the two ways of balancing this is to either nerf W & H or increase the output of all other classes (which I do not see happening).

Mana issues disappeared almost fully after some gear optimisation (proper flask and food, new gems and enchants, Ember Meta until they fix the Chaotic) and the crit dependency has always been the cornerstone of Fire dps. Yes, it might not feel "fun" not getting Hot Streaks, but the rates we had in ICC were simply horrendous- 100% crit chance was easily achievable. Being able to cast on the move and having literally no downtime whatsoever is definitely bringing a far greater "fun" factor.

The concern about numbers being too low currently is very subjective and relative to one's skill level. They are low compared to what we were used to in ICC with the 30% buff, yes. But they are at the same level all other dps classes' are (bar W & H).

Loxii · 12/22/10, 9:36 AM

Apologies if this has been answered elsewhere but personally i havn't seen the answers clearly on this thread.

For Bear Tanks:

Do we need Hit cap?
Do we need Expertise (soft)cap?
And at what % of dodge should we stop reforging to dodge?

Pussifire · 12/22/10, 9:47 AM

imo haste > mastery till ilvl 359

arhmudo · 12/22/10, 9:50 AM

Original post mentions that [Glyph of Incinerate] (along with the Succubus glyph) now provides more DPS. So what is the third prime glyph.. Immolate or Meta?

remanis · 12/22/10, 9:50 AM

I see more and more ppl disregarding mastery in favor of haste. But if you have the 920 haste rating cap, whats the point of stacking haste if you cant reach the next cap (which is 2000is haste rating i bealive for an additional WG tick)?

Dracnia · 12/22/10, 9:57 AM

Originally Posted by Jmickey

Haste is not additive, so it is not 1 + 2 + 3 = 6. Haste acts multiplicatively. So it would be 1.1 * 1.2 * 1.3 = 1.716.

Ah that explains alot. Thanks for your quick comment on this matter.

miantank · 12/22/10, 10:04 AM

there is a problem still bother me, when i get into solar, should i refresh sunfire and insect swarm, because their damage is higher than Lunar's, but i have to waste 2 Gcds on them and when i going to finish on solar, should i refresh sunfire and insect swarm again?

Batlecruiser · 12/22/10, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by Schwierig

If I get a HS proc as Fire right before LB is running out.

Should I:

Cast the HS before the LB and loose considerable amount of LB dps
or cast LB before the HS and risking not getting a HS ignite

What has HS ignite got to do with LB?

But here a little hint:
@ #23 and #24:
Just find your own decisions, or do want to get banned for "beg for hand-holding" ? And don't use the risky line skip for every single sentence or word!

Cnile · 12/22/10, 10:18 AM

I personally went with the stat builds that I used in WoTLK with the addition of mastery. My primary stat was Hit, then Mastery, then Expertise, then Dodge. This has worked out really well for me so far. I am currently using agi + stam gems as well. I am usually hitting 10k dps single target for boss fight in Cata, and hitting around 20k dps for 4 mobs in raids. My damage is being reduced by using CD's as soon as they are up. I think that's how Blizz wanted it to be used.

♦ masanbol · 12/22/10, 10:22 AM

The problem with using the old stat priorities is that old mechanics around hit and expertise are no longer in effect. Taunts no longer miss, bosses do not parry haste. With the exception of interrupts that now relegates hit and expertise to threat stats only, which means they are not nearly as valuable as they were.